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When do adjectives preceed nouns....



ArcticPaulThreads: 49
Posts: 245
Joined: Apr 7, 08 		Edited by: ArcticPaul   Jul 31, 08, 04:33 /  #
My latest assignment is 2 lists of adjectives and 1 list of nouns.
I must 'connect the adjectives with nouns in a logical way - some should go before a noun, some after.

duże------zupa-------polski
zimna-----woda-------nowe
mineralna--kurs--------nowoczesny

Ezample- zimna woda mineralna.


So what governs the correct placement of adjectives?
ArcticPaulThreads: 49
Posts: 245
Joined: Apr 7, 08 		  Jul 31, 08, 07:30 /  #
WELL?
MrBubblesThreads: 13
Posts: 768
Joined: Nov 13, 07 		Edited by: MrBubbles   Jul 31, 08, 08:32 /  #
dude, are you learning to speak the language or is this a course of descriptive grammar?

Sounds like the difference between fact and opinion or something.

English course - Course of English
Mineral Water - Water of minerals

Hmm tricky
ArcticPaulThreads: 49
Posts: 245
Joined: Apr 7, 08 		  Jul 31, 08, 08:51 /  #
I'v found an answer to my original question in 'Polish Grammar in a Nutshell' by Oscar E Swan. It's all free over the net from the Uni of Pittsburgh.

Basically I want to learn when an adjective should follow the noun. It's usual for the noun to follow the adjective but there are exceptions
Zimna Woda (Adj-No)
Woda Mineralna (No-Adj)

When dealing with titles such as 'National Bank' the noun comes first.

I'm trying to learn Polish, dude.
I'm not sure whether your being sarcastic but mineral water is just bottled water.
benszymanskiThreads: 9
Posts: 510
Joined: Feb 29, 08 		  Jul 31, 08, 09:23 /  #
I think someone like Krzystof posted about this exact topic a while ago. I remember reading it but I can't find it using the search tool...

My understanding is that it's Adj-No like in English a lot of the time, but No-Adj when the adjective limits the noun. E.g.:

letnia skoła - here the adjective says something to describe the school - it is "summery". So a "summery school" (which doesn't make sense, I am just using this as an example).

skoła letnia - here the adjective quantifies/restricts the school. It says something about the type of school - i.e. it is a school only open in the summers, a summer type of school. Thus "summer school".
MrBubblesThreads: 13
Posts: 768
Joined: Nov 13, 07 		  Jul 31, 08, 10:31 /  #
ArcticPaul:
I'm not sure whether your being sarcastic but mineral water is just bottled water.

I was just thinking about adjective order. As you correctly point out, it's mineral water not water of minerals. Perhaps it would be better to just remember examples from real life rather than learning abstract rules that are bound to have a dozen exceptions.

ArcticPaul:
I'm trying to learn Polish, dude.

You ought to tell your teacher that. I had a year of 'lessons' like this and didn't learn sh1t. I wasted a lot of time and money. Friendly advice that's all.
benszymanskiThreads: 9
Posts: 510
Joined: Feb 29, 08 		  Jul 31, 08, 12:00 /  #
just realised I can't even spell - should be szkoła of course...
osiolThreads: 59
Posts: 4,714
Joined: Jul 25, 07 		  Jul 31, 08, 12:06 /  #
MrBubbles:
Perhaps it would be better to just remember examples from real life rather than learning abstract rules that are bound to have a dozen exceptions.

I say try to learn both.
KrzysztofThreads: 2
Posts: 1,146
Joined: Jul 26, 07 		Edited by: Krzysztof   Jul 31, 08, 14:38 /  #
benszymanski:
I think someone like Krzystof posted about this exact topic a while ago

Yep, but I don't remember who was the thread starter and what was the topic :(

EDIT:
OK, found it (I thought it was an older thread), guess who was asking .
ArcticPaul :)
ArcticPaulThreads: 49
Posts: 245
Joined: Apr 7, 08 		  Jul 31, 08, 15:20 /  #
I knew I'd asked about it before but couldn't find it!

I seem to forget 75% of what I learn and it only sticks after several attempts.
MrBubbles:

You ought to tell your teacher that. I had a year of 'lessons' like this and didn't learn sh1t. I wasted a lot of time and money. Friendly advice that's all.


I'm very happy with my teacher. She really pushes me.
For the first few months we've been concentrating on beginner theory/basic vocab but now she's making me converse with her and actually use what I have learned. The pronounciation can be problematic but I feel I'm making real progress.

Like karate Kid doing all that cleaning and waxing floors....then when he thinks he's learned nothing Mr Miaggi shows him just what he's learned
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