Pronunciation difference between Ź and Ż / RZ

wat is the difference between in pronunciation between - and Ż? i think all you can do is explain how to make them is the sounds are different. btw, how do u say Ń?

O.K. Hmmm. How can I make this simple to understand. The letter ż might sound like the "g" like in "genre" and the other letter "z" like "Zsa Zsa" like in "Zsa Zsa Gabor" or like "Dr. Zhiwago". Yes, stupid examples but..... The letter 4; could sound like in the word "coin".

That's the closest I came up with.

It's like w Szczebrzeźnie chrzążcz brzmi w tżcinie.

:)

Merged:How to say Polish rz?

just a question about how to say polish rz is it like polish sz or ś or completely different, can any one help proszę:)

duno how 2 write it down, am not sure if it will help u anyway but its the same pronauciation as other polish letter 'ż' as in word Żaba ...soz if i hvnt helpd much

try Ivona speech synthesiser (google it) she'll tell you:)

like "g" in "genre"

Well, maybe not like in "genre" cause "g" is like polish "dż"
If you know a little french try saying "je taime" (i love). "j" sounds exactly like polish "rz"
in english it's hard to find a word like this

try saying mea[su]re or plea[su]re - that's the sound of polish rz/ż

polish sz - english [s]ure
polish ś - ?? cannot think of any right now :(

SZ and ś are similar, but the shape of the mouth is different...hard to explain. You can see the differences/similarities here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_phonology

how the French would pronunce the very begining of June...dz

I think it would sound more like in 'Je t'aime" (not sure of the exact spelling), which sound more like polish 'że'

Maybe it will help u :
Ż - is the same like for example english word PLEASURE
DŻ - like in JUST word, but a bit harder spoken ;-)
RZ - sounds the same as Ż
;-)

between rz and ż isnt any deferent. is saund simialr like in french word 'je taime' like j


sorry i didnt noticed it :(

i wrote out as 'jur' to get the phonic sound

rz and z with a dot

if you lay your tongue flat on the floor of your mouth and say je in je t'aime or su in pleasure you will get the sound.

sz is sh tonge at floor of mouth s accent is sh tongue raised a little towards palete.

In many words in polish when 'rz' is after consonant you pronounce it like polish 'sz'. Fo example word 'krzyż' (cross) or 'trzcina' (cane)

... and polish 'sz' is english 'sh' like in word shattered

rz sounds like g in 'genre'

That's generally true, but not always... above I have given some examples of polish words where they are pronounced as 'sh'

yeah, I know, I read it and indeed you're right. but the one I wrote is the simplest comparison to and English sound I could come up with

and t seems to work best when it comes to describing the 'rz','ż' sounds.

after voiceless consonant!!! this is phonetical assimilation.

BTW ś-ź, ć-dź, ń, are palatal sounds. The middle of your tongue softly touch the palate.

yeah and 'genre' is exactly such a word.

There is more. Some examples:

marznąć - to freeze
zmarzlina - frozen (matter)
obmierzły - repulsive
mirza - an old title used of Old Persian princes and nobility
superzespół - supergroup
erzjański - one of the languages used in Mordva (Russia)
przemarzać - to freeze through
mierzić - to irritate, to repulse, to cause negative feelings

In all these "rz" is pronounced as two sounds.

I was wrong, there is more of an A in Wrocław. Maybe I lazily and errantly pronounce it with an O. vrot-swov just sounds easier.

thank you for clearing that up S... although i was looking forward to a lesson in vowel sounds ;-)

To be precise, in 'przemarzać' the first 'rz' is pronounced as 'ż', the second consists of two separate sounds. 'Superzespół' is a compound word, first word ending with 'r' and the second starting with 'z', so it's not really a good example :)

I guess there's no problem with k and p, while rz is a little fussy. It's often pronounced as "su" in "pleasure", while sometimes as a sound similar to Czech ř as in Dvořák. I noticed many Poles often confuse it with ż...


In this case it would be as in English "pleasure", though it's not exactly like rz, still very close.
rz varies between ż (morze), sz (zaparz) and cz (trzy)...

because there's NO difference in the basic pronounciation of "rz" and "ż", so many people with writing disorders don't know which one to use (although the rules are taught at schools, some people just get confused).

In many positions within a word/sentence, rz/ż are pornounced as "sz".

Exactly. What is funny is that I never mix these up (I'm Czech) and correct the Poles. It looks very clear to me, "rz" comes where we have "ř", while "ż" comes where we have "ž" :-)

HI,

Does anybody know a phonetic transcription system of Polish for non-Polish speakers?
Maybe we should ask prof. Miodek? Maybe he wrote a book about it or something?

It's actually "W Szczebrzeszynie chrząszcz brzmi w trzcinie" LOL Not that it makes it any easier :)