I got married to a Polish wife; Polish family advice needed

Gunners wrote:

Now, the daughter who owns the property thinks that all daughters should pay 200-300zl towards the parents upkeep every month until the debts are paid off. My wife is a housewife, so i would ultimately be giving them money, which i think is wrong.

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Dec 31, 07, 05:48 / #
I recently got married to a Polish Wife, but it wasnt until i became married that i was made aware of the perilous financial position of her parents. Her parents have had a chequered employment history, her father does odd-jobs, which are low paid. Her mum doesnt work. They are both 59. They owe approximately 40,000zl to various loan companies like Provident Financial, which they have accumulated over about 3 years. They dont own a property, as the property they live in is owned by their daughter, who bought the property off them a few years ago to clear their debts then. The property is worth approx 240kzl. They both smoke, and i suspect my father-in-law has a drink problem. They have 3 daughters including my wife who are all grown up. Now, the daughter who owns the property thinks that all daughters should pay 200-300zl towards the parents upkeep every month until the debts are paid off. My wife is a housewife, so i would ultimately be giving them money, which i think is wrong. Can anyone give me some advice in the situation? Is there a way out of this situation? What would you do in my position etc? Is this normal Polish behaviour from in-laws? Thanks in advance, Gunners

db1874Threads: 10 Posts: 251 Joined: Jun 28, 07	Dec 31, 07, 07:14 / #
Gunners wrote: They owe approximately 40,000zl to various loan companies is the 40,000zl loan secured against any collateral ? Am just wondering if this is really the loan company’s problem rather than the family’s ?

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Dec 31, 07, 07:28 / #
No the loans are all unsecured debt? Does this make a difference? Apparently, individuals cant claim bancruptcy here as its a jailable offence. So what do i do?

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Dec 31, 07, 07:41 / #
devorce? lol

noimmigration	Dec 31, 07, 07:51 / #
tell them no, we brits are paying millions of benefits to poles and now her parents want you to dip into your pocket for them. tell them you will pay if they work for it, like a butler and maid.

ukpolskaThreads: 51 Posts: 2,236 Joined: Oct 23, 06 MEMBER	Dec 31, 07, 07:52 / #
noimmigration wrote: paying millions of benefits to poles proof it!! where are the facts?

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 [Moderator]	Edited by: Wroclaw Dec 31, 07, 08:08 / #
Gunners wrote: Now, the daughter who owns the property thinks that all daughters should pay 200-300zl towards the parents upkeep every month until the debts are paid off. My wife is a housewife, so i would ultimately be giving them money, which i think is wrong. Find out what the debts are, which ones have the biggest interest etc. Clear the small debts as quickly as possible. Maybe, re-arrange the larger debts. Move them into a smaller house and use the extra cash to clear the debt. They are not in much of a position to argue. Take on the debts and then they owe you, if you can afford it. [Knowing that they can never repay you in full] Do as your wife asks, but it will take years. Find out how they got into debt and put a stop to any future problems. Find out how the State can help.

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Dec 31, 07, 08:20 / #
noimmigration - i think you have hit the nail on the head to an extent. They dont work, claiming that no one would give them a job at their age etc. Not sure if this is true, or just a fatal outlook. They got into debt by overspending & underworking. I think the cigarette and booze bill every month roughly equals the debt on aggregate. Can the state help? Are there debt advice agencies? Its hard for me to fully understand the problem as I dont know what are genuine reasons from them, or just lame excuses?

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 [Moderator]	Edited by: Wroclaw Dec 31, 07, 08:29 / #
Gunners wrote: I dont know what are genuine reasons from them, or just lame excuses? They have to made aware of the problem in no uncertain terms. Once in debt it is almost impossible to get out of without help. They have to show that they are doing something themselves. If any one of the children fail to pay at any time, it is a backwards step. But of course you know all of this. It's time for a family meeting to thrash it out.

noimmigration	Dec 31, 07, 08:37 / #
ukpolska wrote: proof it!! where are the facts? I have already reported home office statistics, aswell as benefit agency statstics on other threads go have a look yourself. I cant keep posting the same stuff just because one of you offended poles screams 'prove it, prove it'

szkotja2007Threads: 38 Posts: 2,544 Joined: Dec 29, 06	Dec 31, 07, 12:18 / #
ukpolska wrote: jock twat Because he studies in Glasgow doesnt mean to say he is Scottish.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Dec 31, 07, 12:25 / #
Yeah, keep nationality out of it, I'm Scottish and happy to be so. I can assure u that England has far more BNP types than we do in Scotland. He is just winding people up, the forum is largely anonymous so it's not as if noimmigration is a prominent politician who has the power to do much. Ukpolska, treat people as people as I do, I have many friends from England and don't appreciate nationalism

ukpolskaThreads: 51 Posts: 2,236 Joined: Oct 23, 06 MEMBER	Dec 31, 07, 13:16 / #
szkotja2007 wrote: Because he studies in Glasgow doesnt mean to say he is Scottish. Ok fair enough I do apologise to the Scots here, it was a cheap shot said in anger

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Dec 31, 07, 13:21 / #
Apology accepted, the occasional rants get things off ur chest.

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Dec 31, 07, 08:38 / #
Wroclaw, you give good advice. The problem is the sisters are being deferential to the mum, as she got depressed about it before, and is on anti-depressants, so they dont want her to get depressed again. So they have never really thrashed it out, just buried head in the sand thinking "things will be ok". But i feel they need tough love. We live in a fairly big city. But are jobs (any jobs) hard to find at 60 yrs of age? I think the problem is they are looking for managerial jobs or something. The thing i dont like in all of this is the parents have done nothing to help themselves. If they gave up smoking and tried hard every day to find work, then i'd feel more charitable. But to just take money for nothing is shameful.

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Edited by: plk123 Dec 31, 07, 11:30 / #
noimmigration wrote: I have already reported home office statistics, aswell as benefit agency statstics on other threads go have a look yourself. I cant keep posting the same stuff just because one of you offended poles screams 'prove it, prove it' dude.. there a thousands threads on here.. how about posting it up if you're gonna make such claims. otherwise you're speking out of your dupa. btw. the official unemployment rate is 15% which means it's at least 20-25% in reality. could they find jobs at that age where you come from?

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Dec 31, 07, 11:36 / #
I know it might be difficult but what about employers like Tesco etc? I know they take them in the UK but not sure about Poland.

ukpolskaThreads: 51 Posts: 2,236 Joined: Oct 23, 06 MEMBER	Dec 31, 07, 12:11 / #
noimmigration wrote: I have already reported home office statistics, aswell as benefit agency statstics on other threads go have a look yourself. I cant keep posting the same stuff just because one of you offended poles screams 'prove it, prove it' Hey knob, I am English you jock twat and for every post you put up I can put a fact up to disprove it, you do a search and you will see

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Jan 1, 08, 04:59 / #
Ok can we avoid slagging each other off and focus on the problem. What should i do?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Jan 1, 08, 14:06 / #
I need more info to advise u. For example, what does the pre-nuptial agreement say? Was there an agreement between the sisters of any description, oral/written etc about the house? Best go to a Polish lawyer but I'd hold back in the meantime from paying anything.

GunnersThreads: 1 Posts: 7 Joined: Dec 31, 07	Jan 1, 08, 14:46 / #
I didnt have a pre-nuptial agreement. Could you get a nupital agreement drawn up during the marriage? So there is no agreement as far as i know oral/written between the sisters. They just try and keep the problem within the family.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Jan 1, 08, 15:29 / #
I'd just steer clear and let the family deal with their own self created mess. I sometimes drink and smoke but the point here is moderation. U don't have a moral obligation to help. They just need to learn money management skills, the hard way

noimmigration	Jan 1, 08, 16:11 / #
ukpolska wrote: Ok fair enough I do apologise to the Scots here, it was a cheap shot said in anger well be careful not to repeat your ethnic slurs againts scots in the future please

BuddyThreads: 7 Posts: 180 Joined: Nov 18, 07	Jan 1, 08, 16:52 / #
Gunners wrote: recently got married to a Polish Wife, but it wasnt until i became married that i was made aware of the perilous financial position of her parents Warning bells. do mind me asking how long you have known your wife? Why did she not tell you, was she ashamed or hiding the truth for other reasons. If they have had these problems before then chances are they will do again, even if the current debt is paid. As for alcohol and ciggys well that will shorten the life expectancy but onroute will be medical bills etc. Well 200zl to 300zl per month I doubt will break the bank. However, setting the precident of helping the parents is fraught with danger especially if more and more cash is asked for. This will cause an large strain on your marriage. As for the loan companies, unfortunately these companies are springing up everywhere like fungus. And the poverty trap is sprung. Again the older less educated classes are victims of these companies who are essentially loan sharks. If the father drinks, this is the core problem. Until he sorts it out or dies there will be financial problems. I'm sorry to say. Although you do have family duties, your first duty is to yourself and your wife. As a family unit. i wish I could offer more sage advise, but I'm just an ordinary Joe. You are in a catch 22 situation, damned if do, damned if you don't. What do the other husbands of your wives sisters think.

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Jan 1, 08, 16:56 / #
I think everyones missing a big point here,Gunner,you say your wife is a housewife so you will have to pay this debt. Ok,simple answer,its your wifes fekless parents who cant work at 59,whats her excuse?

BuddyThreads: 7 Posts: 180 Joined: Nov 18, 07	Jan 1, 08, 17:13 / #
Good point although it could be argued that being a housewife is a fulltime job. Maybe the father should bite the bullet, declare bancrupcy and go to prison. At least while he is there the states paying, he can't drink. And he is being a man and doing the honourable thing. Maybe you should suggest this to him. Choose a family dinner, don't tell your wife what you are going to say. Just make her translate on the spot. Say it in all seriousness and as one man to another. This way its a win win. Because if he doesn't then he is a coward. If he's proven to be a coward when he should be head of the family, then you don't have to pay squat, because he is dishonoured. HOWEVER, TAKE INTO ACCOUNT HIS STATE OF MIND. If he is unstable he might do himself. So reflection ignore my advise. The other er...side effect is that you singlehandly turn the family against you in one fell swoop. Actually I think maybe the above is VERY BAD ADVICE. Its all well and good mulling it over on the form, but we have the blessing of being very detached from the reality Gunner is experiencing. I'm going to stick by my orginal hypothesis, you are ******.

Patrycja19Threads: 79 Posts: 3,972 Joined: Oct 31, 06	Jan 1, 08, 17:36 / #
Gunners wrote: I didnt have a pre-nuptial agreement. Could you get a nupital agreement drawn up during the marriage? So there is no agreement as far as i know oral/written between the sisters. They just try and keep the problem within the family. you dont need that, how would you be responsible for her parents debts? set your pride aside and ask her to work.. she should , unless she is with child, theres no reasons for her to sit home while you bust your butt to pay off her parents problems.... thats not your responsibility, only she is now your responsibility and your children if you two have any or going to have any.. how can you save for a future when her parents are taking it away? no, they are responsibile for their own problems.. if they are handicapped then they need to apply at the appropriate offices. if they arent, then they need to also get a job, even if its not paying a whole lot, at least its paying something!!!! and they also need to stop drinking and smoking ( wastin their money) and work on putting their ( rest of their lives together) whats left.. no one should be responsible for someone else's bad habits and thats what they are and if you cannot support them yourself, then dont do it.. im on your side gunner. it sounds like they are expecting help. which to me is wrong.. the whole purpose of raising children and sending them off to college is to make sure their future is stable.. not to take it away.. and even if I had nothing to give my children, I would still never expect them to pay my way..

DiceThreads: 20 Posts: 677 Joined: Nov 27, 07	Edited by: Dice Jan 1, 08, 17:49 / #
Buddy wrote: I'm going to stick by my orginal hypothesis, you are ****. I agree 100%, sorry to say that. First, here is a little 101 lesson on how relationships work: (or, to be precise, here is my theory on how relationships work.) 1. A woman will become a carbon copy of her own mother - if you want to see what your wife is going to look like in 20 years, just look at her mother. Is she unhappy? **? Unstable? This is your wife in 20 years, my friend. 2. A woman will unconsciously look for a husband that reminds her of her own father. Look at her father** - does he look and act like you? If he doesn't then she will not stick with you - an infidelity is coming. If you're different from her father, then she chose you for other reasons: i.e. to support her parents financially? In any way, if this is the case, consider your marriage to be practically over.

BuddyThreads: 7 Posts: 180 Joined: Nov 18, 07	Jan 1, 08, 17:55 / #
Dice wrote: 1. A woman will become a carbon copy of her own mother - if you want to see what your wife is going to look like in 20 years, just look at her mother. Is she unhappy? ******? Unstable? This is your wife in 20 years, my friend. Do you really have to remind us...jesus...dude nothing gym, plastic surgery and prozac won't cure.

ukpolskaThreads: 51 Posts: 2,236 Joined: Oct 23, 06 MEMBER	Jan 2, 08, 05:31 / #
noimmigration wrote: well be careful not to repeat your ethnic slurs againts scots in the future please If you think I was appoligising to you, you are 100% wrong as it was directed to you and no other decent scots.