Deadly Roads - "Are polish roads really THAT dangerous?"

BubbaWoo:

what saddens me is that like with so many things, the poles think they are better drivers than they really are.

and you know what, there comes a time when you are blue in the face from telling them to drive carefully when youve just got to say listen, go cry at your graves, what do i care. and stop blaming it on the roads

KazikowskiThreads: 23 Posts: 107 Joined: Oct 2, 08	Oct 12, 08, 08:55 / #
Hi i've recently read an article on driving in Poland. They said that somewhere around 40-50 ppl die weekly from road accidents. Yikes! Are polish roads really THAT dangerous?

MatyjaszThreads: 2 Posts: 1,786 Joined: Jul 20, 06	Oct 12, 08, 09:06 / #
This is going to be a looooooong thread. ;)

Wroclaw Boy	Oct 12, 08, 09:12 / #
I wintessed a car crash yesterday actually. The driver in front went straight into the back of a lorry at about 50 kmh. Must have been day dreaming.

benszymanskiThreads: 9 Posts: 510 Joined: Feb 29, 08	Oct 12, 08, 09:50 / #
Kazikowski: Are polish roads really THAT dangerous? I live on a main road and there is a car accident in front of my house on average every 2 or 3 months. So I would say yes.

polishgirltx	Oct 12, 08, 09:57 / #
benszymanski: there is a car accident in front of my house on average every 2 or 3 months. So I would say yes. ah cmon'... after i get up in the morning, i turn on the tv to check how heavy the traffic is... and there are accidents all over the metroplex when i go to work... and then during the day, on my way home, evening, night, all the time... so....?

Grzegorz_Threads: 81 Posts: 6,213 Joined: Nov 16, 06	Oct 12, 08, 10:06 / #
Kazikowski: somewhere around 40-50 ppl die weekly from road accidents. I think more.

benszymanskiThreads: 9 Posts: 510 Joined: Feb 29, 08	Oct 12, 08, 10:56 / #
polishgirltx: ah cmon'... I don't follow your argument. You are hearing about accidents all over town. I am talking about one 200 metre stretch of road. I think that an accident in one place every 2 or 3 months is very high and I am surprised that the council or road department or whoever hasn't done anything about it.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:00 / #
I think they are, yes. U can be drifting along and suddenly hit a bump that knocks u off ur stride. However, driver error plays a major part too. Driving is sth u should do when u r calm and alert, not when edgy and agitated. The problem is, there is so much tension that builds up after a tough day in the office, it comes out in all the wrong ways.

polishgirltx	Oct 12, 08, 11:04 / #
benszymanski: I am talking about one 200 metre stretch of road. I think that an accident in one place every 2 or 3 months is very high i will help you out... in dallas, everyday on I-635 and Marsh Ln exit is an accident, west or east line, but the place is the same.... i'm not even talking about meters... everyday in the morning.... people drive like crazy everywhere... i'm afraid of the big 4x4 trucks speeding 100mph here... in Italy i was afraid of bikers speeding like crazy between cars... in France i was afraid of 4 lines road suddenly becoming one line road... i mean there is always something... and yes, accidents happen, everywhere and everyday... by threads like that foreigners have a mistaken idea about PL... so as i already said....ah, cmon'... thank you...

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,726 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Oct 12, 08, 11:06 / #
I often drive through Poland. My take on this topic is that , yes the roads are bad but there are road works everywhere. So it is changing. The same thing happened in Ireland. It is good to see people working on it. It will not be so bad soon enough. I just crossed the boarder and it was the first time the road was new and I could use it. It was very good. I think the same thing about corruption in politics, if you see it in the paper everything is ok but it is when you do not see it, you know there is a big problem?. I have a bit of a cold and I am not sure if what I am typing makes much sence, or is it that I always write non-sence? ha ha ha don't answer that.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:29 / #
It's a defensiveness that I find in some Poles that doesn't square with reality. If I could coin a term, I'd say 'defensive pride'. Others would say misplaced. It's part of what could be called the 'ja wiem' culture. This kind of person thinks they know everything and is too nonchalant. Thankfully, most are aware of the state of the roads and take extra care. I don't think the Poles are as bad drivers as many make out. Having said that, I'm still cautious at certain crossings. They are put in the most precarious of positions and have almost caught me out as a pedestrian. There's a stubborness that I see. The driver thinks he has a right to just keep on driving and the pedestrian uses their right of way a little too strongly. A bad combo!! The key is, don't rush

BubbaWooThreads: 46 Posts: 4,438 Joined: Sep 26, 06	Oct 12, 08, 11:32 / #
are you a regular driver in poland Seanus?

Shawn_H	Oct 12, 08, 11:36 / #
PolskaDoll: UK had 2946 in 2007 (about 56 people per week) Are the roads that bad in the UK? ;-)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:38 / #
Nah, I've never driven in Poland, hehehe. However, I've been a passenger countless numbers of times and a pedestrian everyday. I was waiting for sb to ask me that, trust u amigo. It's my armchair commentary if u will, well, couch really, lol

PolskaDollThreads: 44 Posts: 4,134 Joined: Jun 15, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:16 / #
polishgirltx: i turn on the tv to check how heavy the traffic is... and there are accidents all over the metroplex when i go to work... and then during the day, on my way home, evening, night, all the time... so....? Yeah there are crashes and bumps every day but I don't think the OP is just talking about bumps but more about deaths on the road which are less frequent. Kazikowski: They said that somewhere around 40-50 ppl die weekly from road accident That's a high number for the size of population. UK had 2946 in 2007 (about 56 people per week).

BubbaWooThreads: 46 Posts: 4,438 Joined: Sep 26, 06	Oct 12, 08, 11:20 / #
what saddens me is that like with so many things, the poles think they are better drivers than they really are. and you know what, there comes a time when you are blue in the face from telling them to drive carefully when youve just got to say listen, go cry at your graves, what do i care. and stop blaming it on the roads

dnzThreads: 25 Posts: 804 Joined: Dec 2, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:38 / #
The roads are bad and fairly dangerous but I think the level of accidents are down to the total lack of talent, common sense and a general disregard for other road users which 90% of polish drivers seem to display. Bad roads shouldn't be a problem if you drive accordingly but people her seem to have no idea what they are doing, I witnessed a police van drive into a lamp post in the centre of poznan the other day, I also had an incident with a ford focus tailgating me, when I braked he panicked, swerved around me and hit the car overtaking in the middle lane.

BubbaWooThreads: 46 Posts: 4,438 Joined: Sep 26, 06	Edited by: BubbaWoo Oct 12, 08, 11:38 / #
good point the number of foreigners driving dangerously on british roads is a growing concern Seanus: I was waiting for sb to ask me that, trust u amigo. had to be asked ;) dnz: The roads are bad and fairly dangerous but I think the level of accidents are down to the total lack of talent, common sense and a general disregard for other road users which 90% of polish drivers seem to display. boy racer syndrome at 35 is a recipe for disaster where as in many countries you get your first car and drive like a twat at a young age, many poles are getting their first car a lot older and driving like twats when they should have matured a little

sobieskiThreads: 82 Posts: 1,141 Joined: Jun 1, 08	Oct 12, 08, 11:42 / #
I am driving every day 50 kms one-way to work (from Bielany to Radziejowice) and the kind of things I see every morning and evening.... there is no pen to describe that. - Signs with speed limits are showing the minimum speed limit as concerns most drivers - Red lights are purely Christmas decoration - Overtaking in a bend is an obligation - How longer the CB antennae on a car is, how more suicidal traffic behave the driver will show - Direction indicators are a useless luxury om most cars, best to be forgotten. - And never ever under any condition, give right of way to anybody. That would be a foolish sign of human weakness. I am lucky that my VW Touran is powerful enough to rescue me out of most dangerous situations... But what I do not like is that here in Warsaw you have "to go with the flow". Basic politeness in traffic - as much as I try to show it - is immediately punished by all the egoistic maniacs on the road. So on the end my driving style also has roughened, although I hope not so much as compared to the average Pole.

Wroclaw Boy	Edited by: Wroclaw Boy Oct 12, 08, 11:43 / #
Wroclaw Boy: wintessed a car crash yesterday actually. The driver in front went straight into the back of a lorry at about 50 kmh. Must have been day dreaming. Ohh I forgot to add I witnessed the car crash on my way from a funeral for my wifes aunt how was killed by a car whilst riding her bike. Also the old guy who lives less than 60 meters from my house, his son was killed last year by a drunk driver. Its just far too common.

BubbaWooThreads: 46 Posts: 4,438 Joined: Sep 26, 06	Edited by: BubbaWoo Oct 12, 08, 11:45 / #
ive got friends who quite nonchalantly tell me they have killed people on the roads

Wroclaw Boy	Oct 12, 08, 11:54 / #
Seanus: The driver thinks he has a right to just keep on driving and the pedestrian uses their right of way a little too strongly. thats very true and a bad combo as you say. certain pedestrians dont even look, you need to watch out for those kamikaze grannies.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Oct 12, 08, 11:59 / #
I don't wanna see the day when more Hummers/SUV's are introduced onto the roads here. They are like battering rams for people. Just throw some heavy metal into the MP3 player and, voila, one more death will be chalked up.

dnzThreads: 25 Posts: 804 Joined: Dec 2, 07	Oct 12, 08, 13:11 / #
BubbaWoo: where as in many countries you get your first car and drive like a twat at a young age, many poles are getting their first car a lot older and driving like twats when they should have matured a little I think you may have described the problem perfectly, People do seem to try and race each other all the time, Screeching tyres of the line, and trying to drift in the centre of town and subsequently hitting people. The overtaking on country roads on blind corners and on brows of hills is what I can't understand. I also wonder how often an unsafe vehicle plays a part in these accidents? Is the polish technical check very stringent as I often see total wrecks which would never pass a UK MOT test on the roads. Lets hope things improve in the coming years,

Foreigner4Threads: 22 Posts: 1,975 Joined: Nov 18, 07	Oct 12, 08, 13:27 / #
BubbaWoo: what saddens me is that like with so many things, the poles think they are better drivers than they really are. and you know what, there comes a time when you are blue in the face from telling them to drive carefully when youve just got to say listen, go cry at your graves, what do i care. and stop blaming it on the roads you sir have filled up this thread with the new ultra refined clean burning "correct." Everything is a p*ssing contest on the roads here and it seems half of the driving population here is always trying to "teach a lesson" to the other half.

sobieskiThreads: 82 Posts: 1,141 Joined: Jun 1, 08	Oct 12, 08, 14:50 / #
No here in Poland you just pay to get a yearly MOT inspection (meaning you pay the local inspector to get your car passed, whatever the state your car is in). The "passing stamp" on your documents is purely symbolical.

nierozumiemThreads: 13 Posts: 127 Joined: Jan 18, 08	Oct 12, 08, 15:00 / #
Kazikowski: They said that somewhere around 40-50 ppl die weekly from road accidents. More like 100 per week: http://www.forbes.com/lifestyle/2007/12/10/drivers-europe-dangerous-fo rbeslife-cx_ll_1210driving.html And here is a "list of countries by traffic-related death rate": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_deat h_rate Poland does not show its death rate per kilometer driven. I imagine this number is through the roof (there must be a more sensative way to phrase that) as there are so few roads in Poland and car ownership is stil relatively low. I read something somewhere a few years ago that had Poland with the highest death number of deaths per km driven in the world, second only to Russia.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Oct 12, 08, 16:05 / #
I also see it from a different perspective, as a cyclist. I must say that most drivers are pretty accommodating and give me plenty space. They are not maniacs in that way. However, I get to see the state of some of the roads. I think that's how I came off of my bike and was lucky not to break my neck. This is a message for any budding/would-be cyclists, take a helmet. Sometimes we need a scare to change our ways. I was going way too fast on my bike but a momentary lapse of concentration almost cost me dearly. Feckin holes

KazikowskiThreads: 23 Posts: 107 Joined: Oct 2, 08	Oct 12, 08, 18:31 / #
nierozumiem: And here is a "list of countries by traffic-related death rate": en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate Haha, Australia (where I'm from) has 7.7. Wherever there is an accident, they lower the speed limit by 20k's or install a speed bump. sobieski: - Overtaking in a bend is an obligation Thats true. On my visit to poland, whenever I was on the road I saw people overtaking 5-6 cars on a bend, even trucks. The opposite coming cars had to drive off the road for them not the crash. A Solution to this Road Carnage: Every Pole should have their car replaced with a Jag or a Porsche. That way they will care if the get their car totalled.

dnzThreads: 25 Posts: 804 Joined: Dec 2, 07	Oct 12, 08, 18:46 / #
You think they would care about their octavias on 15 year HP though. Give the average polish driver a faster car and they would just die sooner. They can't even manage to control the clutches on their asthmatic diesels.