Polish Residency - Zameldowanie to be abolished?

delphiandomine:

I guess this is where he's going wrong then - he's trying to register at the provincial office without having the zameldowanie from the local council first. And of course, they'll tell him to piss off without having the zameldowanie as you have to be registered locally first.

And you can't get registered locally without the landlord's consent. What a mess.

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Feb 14, 09, 15:03 / #
dtaylor: Though i'd agree if you done nothing wrong, why argue against ID cards. I argue against the UK's plans to keep a ridiculous amount of data in one (well, three) places about people. ID cards to prove identity are fine - I have absolutely no issue with them. But there is absolutely no need to hold the masses of data that the UK intends to hold on people - and anyway, with the Labour government's record of failures in IT projects, does anyone think the data will be secure? It creates a single point of failure, and this is never good.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Feb 14, 09, 15:17 / #
Data Protection is a top priority we hear but misplaced data is not uncommon. I agree with you, delph.

MohsinThreads: - Posts: 1 Joined: Feb 16, 09	Feb 16, 09, 22:37 / #
hi friend im also come 2 poland and i don't know abt residence rent Poland jobs vicancies will u plz help me out im a Graduate in Mass Communication my work Experience Media in 3 years, i know u don't have time bt if u do that for searching job in Media or other so plz help me i hope u reply me must my yahoo id mohsin_khan82@yahoo.com take care babye

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Feb 18, 09, 18:38 / #
Do you have an EU passport? If you don't, and you've been here more than 45 days - it's time to go home :)

james_warszawaThreads: 6 Posts: 12 Joined: Feb 10, 09	Edited by: james_warszawa Feb 21, 09, 14:01 / #
Thanks for your detailed info, delphiandomine. That's great. The place where I applied for residency is in Warsaw (where I'm living). The address is as follows: MAZOWIECKI URZĄD WOJEWÓDZKI ODDZIAŁ D/S CUDZOZIEMCÓW Ul. Dluga 5 1st Floor, Room 42.43 WARSAW Tel: 695 6752 www.mazowieckie.pl I was told to apply here by the British Embassy, who gave me an information sheet for EU-Member Short Term Residency. On the sheet of information, is the address above, and also the requirements for the residency, as I stated before in my previous forum post. When I went to the building at the above address, they knew that I was British, obviously an EU member. I applied for residency and gave them all of the details they asked for except for the Zameldowanie, which at the time, I didn't know I needed, because it WASN'T on the info sheet the Embassy gave me. Make sure that you get given a PESEL number when you register - it's not required, but makes life much easier for you. May I ask what the PESEL is? Does this office give it to me ONCE I've registered, and not before? What is the "Gmina"? But - and this is the important question. Do you know what type of contract you have? I have an Umowa o Dzieło. This, I have heard, is the "Contract of Death". I would have much prefered the Złacenie. Is Dzieło the one where you can get really screwed over with? Look into the umowa o najmu lokalu. I didn't have this document for so long but it is needed to apply. My landlord and I drew one up. Other documents from your landlord are also needed as evidence. What is the umowa o najmu lokalu? This cannot be something compulsory to residency registration because I have never heard about it before. And the NIP can be obtained from "Urząd Skarbowy"??

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Edited by: Seanus Feb 21, 09, 14:09 / #
The PESEL is your personal ID number that only you can use. For most intents and purposes, you won't be using it but there are official documents where it is necessary. O dzieło is for services rendered. It's not necessarily the contract of death, if you do contract work, e.g games projects, or want to work here only for a short time, then it's fine. I worked under one for 3 years. The holiday entitlement is not so good. Well, it is compulsory James. My landlord was told to go home and get it, otherwise the process wouldn't go ahead. It's your agreement with your landlord, for renting/using the property etc. As for the NIP, yes, you have to register with the tax office. The NIP-1 form is important as it shows you as the registered taxpayer. Sorry, the gmina is simply an area. The jurisdictional area in which it covers I think.

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Feb 21, 09, 15:08 / #
james_warszawa: MAZOWIECKI URZĄD WOJEWÓDZKI This is where I'm getting confused - in Poznań, you first register with the "Urzędu Miasta Poznania" (which is effectively the city administration) for the three months temporary residence permit, and then you go to the "Wielkopolski Urząd Wojewódzki" (provincial administration) to obtain the 5 year residence permit given to EU citizens. As far as I know, there's no way round this - you cannot jump straight to the 5 year permit, as the 'zameldowanie' is granted by the city administration. But you certainly don't need all the documentation listed by the British Embassy for local (temporary) registration to obtain the 'zameldowanie' to begin with. This could be where you're going wrong - although Warsaw might be a special case in terms of registration of foreigners. james_warszawa: May I ask what the PESEL is? Does this office give it to me ONCE I've registered, and not before? What is the "Gmina"? Apparently, you can get it when you first register for the three months. But you might not get it until you apply for the 5 year residence card - either way, you won't be getting it until you're registered in some way. The best bet is simply to ask at every stage of the way - and someone will give you it. It's probably closest to our National Insurance numbers in the UK in terms of what it does. james_warszawa: I have an Umowa o Dzieło. This, I have heard, is the "Contract of Death". I would have much prefered the Złacenie. Is Dzieło the one where you can get really screwed over with? Yup, basically. Usually the best way to find out their intentions is to tell them that the tax office wants to see your contract - if they tell you not to show them, then you know they're operating some sort of tax dodge.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Feb 21, 09, 15:13 / #
That's true as well, tax dodging. I know how it works now, my fiancee did some digging just to see what was really going on. It's cheaper for them to employ you on this contract. The PESEL is not top priority if you have your own interest. I got mine long after my NIP and REGON. I think the registration process has been streamlined/harmonised so I don't think Warsaw operates differently.

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Edited by: delphiandomine Feb 21, 09, 15:27 / #
Seanus: I think the registration process has been streamlined/harmonised so I don't think Warsaw operates differently. I guess this is where he's going wrong then - he's trying to register at the provincial office without having the zameldowanie from the local council first. And of course, they'll tell him to piss off without having the zameldowanie as you have to be registered locally first. And you can't get registered locally without the landlord's consent. What a mess. That's true as well, tax dodging. I know how it works now, my fiancee did some digging just to see what was really going on. It's cheaper for them to employ you on this contract. I wouldn't be surprised if they were charging him the tax and then keeping it to themselves, seems to be a rather common scam in Poland towards naive foreigners. No ZUS as well, although the EHIC card is good enough even though you really shouldn't use it if you're not resident in the UK...

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Feb 21, 09, 15:29 / #
Welcome to the wonderful world of bureaucracy. My school which required me to register initiated proceeding well in advance. Everything had its time. I have several ringbinders here, the paperwork that I have is quite staggering.

mw78Threads: 3 Posts: 37 Joined: Feb 4, 09	Edited by: mw78 Aug 20, 09, 16:56 / #
I got my zameldowanie yesterday and it was surprisingly easy. I had my contract for my apartment which I think had the landlords signed agreement to give me and my partner zameldowanie, I had my passport, and I also had my partner with me to help fill out a little form. The whole process took about 30 minutes, they used my girlfriends ID card at one point of the procedure (what for I dont know). next is a karta pobytu which doesn't look as easy. they said I needed 4 copies of my passport, 3 copies of the application form and proof that I am being paid regularly by an employer.

lowfunk99Threads: 18 Posts: 435 Joined: Jan 7, 08	Aug 20, 09, 17:18 / #
I never had a problem with the zameldowanie.

mw78Threads: 3 Posts: 37 Joined: Feb 4, 09	Aug 20, 09, 17:34 / #
I forgot about the health insurance. UK EHIC, thanks will have to get hold of one, I wasn't sure exactly what they were after. You say a polish bank statement for the last 3 months, I opened a bank account a few days ago, so I'll have to wait another three months then?

james_warszawaThreads: 6 Posts: 12 Joined: Feb 10, 09	Feb 21, 09, 15:47 / #
delphiandomine: I guess this is where he's going wrong then - he's trying to register at the provincial office without having the zameldowanie from the local council first. And of course, they'll tell him to piss off without having the zameldowanie as you have to be registered locally first. And you can't get registered locally without the landlord's consent. What a mess. This is exactly the case.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Feb 21, 09, 15:55 / #
You just have to ride it out, James. There is no circumventing it. It makes things easier in the long run.

NivThreads: - Posts: 2 Joined: Jul 15, 09	Jul 20, 09, 17:18 / #
hi. i am not european but marriaged with polish leaving in poland. i have been told that i can do this registration in another adress diferent that where we live. the problem is they use this adress to come and visit the couple to check if the marriage is real and if bouth living there. i dont know what to do because actually we really live together but in a flat where the landlord i believe will not sign. the adress that i could register is in another city. do you thing that i would have problem? please someone advice. thanks a lot.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Jul 20, 09, 18:22 / #
I think that would be problematic as they want you to be registered in that area. I know because my Polish fiancee had to re-register. She was formerly registered in Zabrze but had to get re-registered to Gliwice when she moved out.

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Aug 20, 09, 17:22 / #
mw78: they said I needed 4 copies of my passport, 3 copies of the application form and proof that I am being paid regularly by an employer. Aha, I can tell you exactly what they want in Poznan. You need 4 copies of your passport, 3 copies of the application form, proof of health insurance (ie, the UK EHIC card is enough for them), a copy of a Polish bank statement for the last 3 months, the previous and current zameldowanie (you have to be here for 3 months and then apply for the 5 year residence permit, so back to the Urząd Miasta) and some sort of work - but - this can be as simple as someone writing a letter saying that they intend to give you work. They don't actually have to promise you it, an intention is enough - or you can give them a contract. It's actually easier than getting the zameldowanie, at least in Poznan :)

delphiandomineThreads: 40 Posts: 9,585 Joined: Nov 25, 08	Aug 20, 09, 18:12 / #
mw78: You say a polish bank statement for the last 3 months, I opened a bank account a few days ago, so I'll have to wait another three months then? Yep, but you'll have to wait for 3 months to apply for the residence paper, so it's not really a problem :) By the way, when you go back for the second zameldowanie, tell them that you've been out of Poland (even if you haven't). I had problems with the dragon telling me that I should apply for the 5 year permit and that she couldn't give me another 3 months registration because I hadn't left Poland - so I told her that in fact, I had left during the last 3 months. (the truth was that I'd left for 15 minutes to fool around in Germany, but :D)

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08	Aug 20, 09, 20:11 / #
I have had some rough experiences with id cards etc. I'm British and have my own one-man firm. However, GE Moneybank once refused me credit because my id doesn't have a PESEL on it. I have a PESEL, of course, issued by the local ratusz... it just isn't on my card. The local immigration office told me that there was no such card bt GE Money *ankers told me they wouldn't give me any credit without one. Guess who I have never used in 7 years. A coupke of years ago my wife and I bought a new car. I wanted to buy it on the firm but the dealer said they couldn't give me 5 year credit because my card was due to expire in 3 years. I said I just needed to renew it... but they said "How do we know you won't just leave the country?" (yes, that card is what keeps you here!). My wife commented, "Give me the credit and I'll leave tomorrow!"