Poland before WWII or Poland now what would you choose?

Borrka:

Actually I've got no obsessions at all cause I don't care too much about the past.

Borrka:

for us the total outcome of the Polish-German relationship was more than negative..

Borrka:

In some political sense you were mostly wrong (when allowed to act on your own).

Borrka:

So better get used to your new position of a medium sized country on the European city dump.

...Twenty blue chip German companies are pooling their resources with the aim of harnessing solar power in the deserts of north Africa and transporting the clean electricity to Europe.

The businesses, which include some of the biggest names in European energy, finance and manufacturing, will form a consortium next month. If successful, the highly ambitious plan could see Europe fuelled by solar energy within a decade...

...According to the European Commission's Institute for Energy, if just 0.3% of the light falling on the Sahara and Middle Eastern deserts was captured, it could provide all of Europe's energy needs....

PlasticPoleThreads: 10 Posts: 5,181 Joined: May 28, 09	Jun 17, 09, 16:23 / #
Bratwurst Boy: All Poles of course, weren't they! The achievements happened in Royal Prussia and not Prussia proper which tells you Poles invented it and Germans prolly stole it.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Jun 17, 09, 16:25 / #
PlasticPole: The achievements happened in Royal Prussia and not Prussia proper which tells you Poles invented it and Germans prolly stole it. Which Poles??? :):):)

BorrkaThreads: 49 Posts: 769 Joined: Apr 25, 08	Edited by: Borrka Jun 17, 09, 16:32 / #
Junge I see you've got some serious mental problems ! Posting the list of German achievements every three weeks is becoming your true obsession lol. I suggest prepare some kind time line with the most important facts...starting ww1, starting ww2, first KZ, gas chamber invention ... etc.etc. Don't forget the greatest thinker Marx, Engels, Rosenberg... And now this funny coalition... Self healing of old zone-complexes ?

SokratesThreads: 19 Posts: 4,464 Joined: Jan 19, 09 [Suspended]	Jun 17, 09, 16:37 / #
Bratwurst Boy: All Poles of course, weren't they! You're again mistaking points i'm making for chauvinism, i never denied Germans a great deal of achievements what i do oppose is marginalization of considerable Polish cultural and civilizational achievements, the great development of regions and cities, what you view as rewriting history for us is asserting our position in the face of not always true German outlook on history. The problem with German-Polish relations is that you were so keen on proving we're small in all regards you believed it yourself, we're definitely not as big as we sell ourselves to be but much bigger than German perception gives us credit for.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Jun 17, 09, 16:37 / #
Borrka: Junge I see you've got some serious mental problems ! Posting the list of German achievements every three weeks is becoming your true obsession lol. Well...it's easy for me to point them out to you. Want some more? Borrka: I suggest prepare some kind time line with the most important facts...starting ww1, starting ww2, first KZ, gas chamber invention ... etc.etc. That's a polish obsession...:) Borrka: Don't forget the greatest thinker Marx, Engels, Rosenberg... At least we have some... Sokrates: You're again mistaking points i'm making for chauvinism, What points? That holy, mighty Poland could have "squashed Germany like a bug"??? Sorry Sokrates, that's not a point but wishful thinking! That Danzig is full of polish achievements? Why don't we just compare??? Sokrates: never denied Germans a great deal of achievements You do nothing else or we wouldn't have this discussion (b*itchfest, flame war). Sokrates: The problem with German-Polish relations is that you were so keen on proving we're small in all regards As in "Poles won all battles against the Germans" or "Poland could have squashed Germany like a bug"??? Sokrates: we're definitely not as big as we sell ourselves to be but much bigger than German perception gives us credit for. I'm all for sharing, you know that...I always said that these lands have been "polman" since ages.

SokratesThreads: 19 Posts: 4,464 Joined: Jan 19, 09 [Suspended]	Jun 17, 09, 16:50 / #
Bratwurst Boy: You do nothing else or we wouldn't have this discussion What did i deny? I've stated that Gdańsk was built and for most of its history inhabited by Poles and provided sources, the only one opposing those was Freebird who's argumentation was "COMMUNISTROTFLLMAO". Then you said Poles did nothing with Gdańsk, i provided you with a few examples of Polish architecture including Gdańsk town hall. Then you said Gdańsk got rich because of being a member of Hanza, i rebuked that Gdańsk got rich because of trading Polish goods which it did on account of being the major harbor on the coast of Poland. As you can see the issue here is not denying any German achievements but you unwilling to accept Polish ones :) Bratwurst Boy: As in "Poles won all battles against the Germans" or "Poland could have squashed Germany like a bug"??? Poland could have destroy Meklemburgia or Prussia at a certain period yes, whats so strange about it? As for wars Poland won several wars, so did Germany, comparison of power is meaningless since by the time Germany rose to power Poland was well in decline. Bratwurst Boy: That Danzig is full of polish achievements? Why don't we just compare??? Of course! What shall we start with? How about historical sites though i'd be carefull if i were you, the town hall is by far not the only one. Bratwurst Boy: That's a polish obsession...:) Not really no, you're just used to Poland not speaking with its own voice and have a problem with a more assertive neighbour, people like Kaczyńscy are treated as idiots here which is why they lost the elections.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Jun 17, 09, 16:56 / #
Sokrates: Poland could have destroy Meklemburgia Oooh please...the odd cow roaming the fields doesn't count!

NathanThreads: 33 Posts: 1,846 Joined: Feb 13, 09	Jun 17, 09, 17:14 / #
Harry: campaign against any mention of Polish concentration camps and government websites repeat tired old lies about your WWII allies. So true. sjam: Do you mean Bereza Kartuska? Was it the only one? Central Labour Camp Jaworzno (Polish: Centralny Obóz Pracy w Jaworznie, COP Jaworzno) was a concentration camp in Jaworzno, Poland. It operated from 1943 until 1956, run first by Nazi Germany and then by the Soviet Union and the People's Republic of Poland. Estimated over 9,000 people died in the camp, and several thousand more prisoners were executed elsewhere. COP Jaworzno was selected for detention of Lemko and Ukrainian civilians. The first transportation of 17 Operation Wisła prisoners reached the special subcamp of Jaworzno on May 5, 1947, from Sanok. The number of these prisoners until March 1949 totalled 3,936 (3,760 of them arrived in 1947 alone), including 823 women and dozens of children. Most prisoners at that time were Lemko intelligentsia, people suspected of sympathy towards the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, priests and people otherwise selected by Polish communist forces from Operation Wisła transports. About 15% of those captured in the operation are estimated to have died in the camps. sjam: Polish-British historian Tadeusz Piotrowski who also calls it a concentration camp notes that the establishment of the facility was a norm of its times So this is Ok, right? It was "norm of the time". Others did it, so we can do it too. Nice reasoning.

SokratesThreads: 19 Posts: 4,464 Joined: Jan 19, 09 [Suspended]	Jun 17, 09, 17:50 / #
Nathan: COP Jaworzno was selected for detention of Lemko and Ukrainian civilians. The first transportation of 17 Operation Wisła prisoners reached the special subcamp of Jaworzno on May 5, 1947 As for Łemko population it was a tragic mistake and a crime of the communist regime, as for Ukrainian population you guys should be glad there was Russia to protect you, without Russia you would be facing a retaliatory invasion as soon as Berlin fell. Nathan: About 15% of those captured in the operation are estimated to have died in the camps As for UPA i wouldnt cry if communist goverment executed all of these people, as for imprisoning innocent civilians thats always wrong, however lets not forget the crimes that Ukrainian Insurgent Army commited on Polish civilians (because you were completely unable to fight against our Home Army).

HarryThreads: 59 Posts: 7,996 Joined: May 2, 07	Jun 17, 09, 18:00 / #
Sokrates: without Russia you would be facing a retaliatory invasion as soon as Berlin fell. I assume that would be retaliation for the invasion and occupation which followed WWI? Oh, sorry, my mistake. After WWI Poland stabbed her Ukrainian allies in the back, did a deal with the Soviets and carved up Ukraine between Poland and the USSR. And then she set off on 20 years of repression of UKrainians. Have you considered ever reading any history books which weren't written by Polish communists?

BorrkaThreads: 49 Posts: 769 Joined: Apr 25, 08	Jun 17, 09, 18:14 / #
Bratwurst Boy: That's a polish obsession...:) Actually I've got no obsessions at all cause I don't care too much about the past. And if you think I wake up obsessed with hatred towards Germany or Russia then you're totally wrong. With all respect to your technical skills or achievements European history doesn't give Germans right to teach us any lessons. We don't owe you anything - for us the total outcome of the Polish-German relationship was more than negative.. In some political sense you were mostly wrong (when allowed to act on your own). So better get used to your new position of a medium sized country on the European city dump. Try to forget your incurable megalomania, the Kulturträger myth, leading position in the EU... It's over. Time to get real. Maybe to catch up with the Netherlands lol.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Jun 17, 09, 18:21 / #
Borrka: Actually I've got no obsessions at all cause I don't care too much about the past. Why don't I believe you? You argument with "the Zone" even today even as it is over and gone since twenty years! Borrka: for us the total outcome of the Polish-German relationship was more than negative.. Well...it takes two to tango! Borrka: In some political sense you were mostly wrong (when allowed to act on your own). When you call 12 years of german policy "mostly" wrong what would you call big chunks of polish history then???? Borrka: So better get used to your new position of a medium sized country on the European city dump. This "dump" allowed Poland entry into the EU and NATO, this dump sends billions of aid over to you, our football team beats yours every time..if Germany is a "dump" what are you then???? What a vain cock you are...we Germans at least have reason to be! Just another example: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/jun/16/solar-power-europe-a frica ...Twenty blue chip German companies are pooling their resources with the aim of harnessing solar power in the deserts of north Africa and transporting the clean electricity to Europe. The businesses, which include some of the biggest names in European energy, finance and manufacturing, will form a consortium next month. If successful, the highly ambitious plan could see Europe fuelled by solar energy within a decade... What a "dump"! ...According to the European Commission's Institute for Energy, if just 0.3% of the light falling on the Sahara and Middle Eastern deserts was captured, it could provide all of Europe's energy needs.... Poland is doing in the meantime...what exactly??? Besides being better and more successfull on all counts than Germany of course...

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Jun 17, 09, 18:40 / #
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BorrkaThreads: 49 Posts: 769 Joined: Apr 25, 08	Jun 17, 09, 18:46 / #
Bratwurst Boy: You argument with "the Zone" even today even as it is over and gone since twenty years! Just ask any "old" Bundesbürger about his opinion lol. As for me I don't share this kind of prejudices. Bratwurst Boy: if Germany is a "dump" I didn't mean specifically Germany but our old dying off Europe as compared to the new dynamic world of Asia - now I see you could get it wrong - Sorry. War nicht meine Absicht . Bratwurst Boy: the highly ambitious plan could see Europe fuelled by solar energy within a decade... Fantastic idea.