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what is the difference between prosze and poprosze?




porta Activity: 20 / 308
Joined: 16 Jul 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #1
As the topic says.

Also i'd like to ask: Is Słucham short for co słuchac?

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #2
No, slucham is the present form for the first person ja slucham from the imperfective dictionary form therefore I am listening from the verb to listen

same with prosze I am requesting something now and poprosze I will request-this is the future perfective case

ja slucham, ty sluchasz, my sluchamy, wy sluchacie, on/ona/ono slucha, oni /one sluchaja i tak dalej

slwkk Activity: 2 / 232
Joined: 31 Mar 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #3
same with prosze I am requesting something now and poprosze I will request-this is the future perfective case


but prosze and poprosze could have the same meaning, for example in a shop when we are asking for some products:

Prosze/Poprosze chleb, ser i wode mineralna.

porta Activity: 20 / 308
Joined: 16 Jul 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #4
Dziekuje bardzo!

That was very informative :thumbs up:

But ,prosze, niegazowana woda mineralna ;)

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #5
but prosze and poprosze could have the same meaning, for example in a shop when we are asking for some products:

IS THAT NOT WHAT i HAVE JUST SAID?

slwkk Activity: 2 / 232
Joined: 31 Mar 2007 ♂
  19 Jul 2007 /  #6
You said that poprosze is about future:

same with prosze I am requesting something now and poprosze I will request-this is the future perfective case


and that's not quite right, because sometimes 'poprosze' is used in present tense.

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  20 Jul 2007 /  #7
Yes it is used now asking for something in the near future as I think you said, using examples in a restaurant. Czy ja moge poprosic cos, na przyklad. However, to differentiate prosic and poprosic it has to be done somehow.

technically speaking, czy ja moge cos poprosic is not a present tense.

slwkk Activity: 2 / 232
Joined: 31 Mar 2007 ♂
  20 Jul 2007 /  #8
technically speaking, czy ja moge cos poprosic is not a present tense.


your sentence in the future tense:

Czy ja będę mógł coś poprosić?

and if I'm asking 'czy ja mogę coś poprosić' that is going on now (I'm asking now) and it's the present tense.

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  21 Jul 2007 /  #9
"Prosic"/"poprosic" is sort of like "rozumiec" (to understand) vs. "zrozumiec". The latter form is perfective, the former, imperfective. When, for example, we say "Prosze!" or better still "Prosze o cos!", e.g. to the server in a restaurant, it means something we do all the time, namely, requesting something. The sentence though beginning "Czy moge uprzejmie poprosic, gdy.. (not: "prosic")....." would mean that the request is just this one specific time, not general, i.e. imperfective.

Same with: "Czy rozumiesz po polsku?" = Do you (in general) understand Polish? vs. "Czy zrozumiesz moje pytanie?" = Do you (right now) understand my question?

Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  21 Jul 2007 /  #10
I think that we are simply making 'heavy weather' of something here! I will never go in to a restaurant and poprosic something nigdy!

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  22 Jul 2007 /  #11
Michal,
......Neither would I (and never have), as I said, only "Prosze o chleb, piwo.itd..."

Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  22 Jul 2007 /  #12
Where do I come in to this conversation?

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #13
Nie wiem, Michalku. Prosze mi powiedziec! -:)
Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #14
I have already answered you.

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #15
? Then perhaps I, silly Yank that I am, failed to understand the answer. Did you in fact have time to assimilate the information in my initial post on this query?
Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #16
As far as I can see the question was 'is slucham' short for sluchac'? This has already been gone over and over again. Maybe I am the silly Brit?

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #17
Yes, but the title of the original post was "What is the difference between prosze and poprosze?", which is what I attempted to elucidate!

Apologies for the confusion.
Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #18
I answered the question about slucham and sluchac. Prosic and poprosic is really a completely different question and a different word.

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #19
Then the title of the post is misleading!
Marek

dannyboy Activity: 19 / 248
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #20
Hi,

think of it as the difference between how the queen would speak and you would speak

you would say, I would like x,y,z (prosze)
the queen would say, one would like x,y,z (poprosze)


you would say, go f*ck yourself
the queen would say, would one go f*ck one's self
hitler would say, f*cken sie bitte

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #21
Dannyboy!
Don't wish to appear rude, but the borsht (sorry, proper Polish "barszczt..")-belt humor is rather out of place, plus, your remarks essentially teach us nothing.

Guess I seem the proverbial sour-pickle puss, but, the last part particularly rubbed me the wrong way.

Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #22
ou would say, go f*ck yourself
the queen would say, would one go f*ck one's self
hitler would say, f*cken sie bitte

I can see that you are obviously a fully qualified CELTA man!

dannyboy Activity: 19 / 248
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #23

Dannyboy!
Don't wish to appear rude, but the borsht (sorry, proper Polish "barszczt..")-belt humor is rather out of place, plus, your remarks essentially teach us nothing.

Guess I seem the proverbial sour-pickle puss, but, the last part particularly rubbed me the wrong way.

Marek


Marek, I strongly disagree, but your entitled to your opinion and I take note.

I was demonstrating the use of first person and third person, or snobbery as some people like to call it ;-) , (I would, One would) in what I considered to be a humorous manner.
This construction doesn't really exist in Polish from what I've been taught.

I'm sorry you didn't find it humorous, I'm going off for a good cry now!

porta Activity: 20 / 308
Joined: 16 Jul 2007 ♂
  23 Jul 2007 /  #24
As the topic says.

Also i'd like to ask: Is Słucham short for co słuchac?



Title of topic is not misleading. I asked for the difference between prosze and poprosze in the title and added in the topic "As the topic says.". Then i go on to say "Also i'd like to ask:Is Słucham short for co słuchac?" The "Also" implies the start of another question. :)

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  24 Jul 2007 /  #25
"Sluchac" is merely the infinitive form, "slucham" is the first person singular for "I'm listening."or "I listen", since in English we represent changes in time through tenses, Polish, through aspects.

"Slucham!" is also a way to answer the phone in Polish, meaning "I'm hearing/listening to/you.."

Marek

Dannyboy,

Indeed it was "humorous", in a purely sophomoric way. -:)
Marek

Michal Activity: - / 1,871
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 ♂
  24 Jul 2007 /  #26
Sluchac" is merely the infinitive form, "slucham" is the first person singular for "I'm listening."or "I listen", sin

I thought that somewhere above I had already explained all this.

dannyboy Activity: 19 / 248
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  24 Jul 2007 /  #27
Dannyboy,

Indeed it was "humorous", in a purely sophomoric way. -:)
Marek


But I am a sophomore!

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  24 Jul 2007 /  #28
Touché, Danny-me Boy!! -:)
Well, once a grump (speaking about myself, of course!), always a grump.

Marek

You did indeed, Michal. Onset of senility on my end.
Marek

tyczkowaty   25 Jul 2007 /  #29
I like to think of it as perfective and imperfective. Take czytac for example. ja czytam a book everyday. but if I read a book and will finish it, Ja przeczytam. prosze o pieniadze if I am homeless and ask every day but it I ask my dad for a dollar bill to pay for something which only requires one time would be poprosze

Marek Activity: 4 / 867
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 ♂
  25 Jul 2007 /  #30
EXACTLY!! Tyczkowaty's saying what I/we've/ been saying all along: perfective vs. imperfective is expressed by the presence or absence of a certain prefix, e.g. "po-", "prze-", "z-" etc.

Marek

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