Abortion - how is the Polish government going to deal with this issue?

Quoting: daffy

POLANDs current abortion policy

Availability: Under certain conditions

Gestational limit: 12 weeks

Conditions: Allowed to save a woman's life, to preserve her mental or physical health or in the cases of rape or incest or foetal impairment. The procedure must be performed by an obstetrician or gynaecologist who has passed the national proficiency tests.

After 12 weeks, abortions are allowed only if continued pregnancy would endanger the life or health of the pregnant woman. It must be performed in a hospital or clinic with the consent of the pregnant woman or her parents or guardian if she is a minor.

Giles	Edited by: Administrator Apr 10, 07, 13:17 / #
Ok this is a serious topic, which 99% of people will have an opinion on. Because this is an emotionally charged subject, (I'm often guilty of getting over excited), lets all try and have our say without the thread dissolving into anarchy. From my understanding abortion is illegal in Polska. However, it is part of the European law that abortion is available throughout EU countries. (plz correct me if I'm wrong). I believe women should have a choice, especially in special circumstances absolutely. Though it is not something to be taken lightly. Since I'm a not in God/religion, I take a humanist approach, what do others think. And more importantly, how is the Polish government going to deal with this issue. especially given the amount of mind control the catholic church has over Poles, especially the old, infirm and mentally unsound.

Arien	Edited by: Arien Apr 10, 07, 13:50 / #
Alright, I do have a clear opinion on the matter, and this may seem unfriendly and rude to some women, and probably offending to certain religious members too, but keep in mind I don't wish to judge someone who sincerely believes she has made the right decision, because I could understand that in some cases there might be a good reason for abortion. One of them being rape and one of them having an unborn child which will have a serious affliction. One of the reasons I can't understand, is sleeping around with men, getting pregnant, and removing what could've been a perfectly healthy child because it will be an inconvenience to you. I do hope you'll notice I haven't named any more reasons because I'm not a woman, and I'm not in the situation to make such a hard decision. Maybe you're homeless, and your man walked out on you.. I mean, you name it! I could understand. In any case, I think this is a loaded subject, and I hope none of you will ever have to make such an awful choice. I'm just a boy, so I don't have the right to judge, but I do have a personal feeling about this. And this feeling tells me it's very wrong to take away the most innocent and biggest miracle of all in life, this being a child.

Grzegorz_Threads: 81 Posts: 6,213 Joined: Nov 16, 06	Apr 10, 07, 14:09 / #
Some want abortion to be completely banned, but 99.9% the law will stay the same.

AmathystThreads: 30 Posts: 3,967 Joined: Nov 10, 06	Apr 10, 07, 14:46 / #
things are changing in the UK, private clinics are starting to move away from what was a very lucrative business - and the national health service is questioning - "life style" abortions, since we have free contraception in the UK and the morning after pill is sold over the counter I see no real reason for abortions to be as high in the UK as they are, I know that there will circumstances where a woman will have little or no choice in the matter but these are few and far between and from what I remember they are trying to bring down the amount of weeks pregrant a woman is to have an abortion. I have friends who have had abortions and it was their choice and I dont judge, we all have our own opinions and each Country will have its own stance on this matter.

BartolomeThreads: 2 Posts: 1,345 Joined: Sep 14, 06	Apr 10, 07, 15:28 / #
Abortion - how is the Polish government going to deal with this issue? The government will deal wit this problem as it usually does - the Sejm will issue a new law, (perhaps even change The Constitution) that will be commonly disobeyed.

daffyThreads: 40 Posts: 2,119 Joined: Feb 5, 07	Apr 10, 07, 15:37 / #
Quoting: Bartolome how is the Polish government going to deal with this issue? POLANDs current abortion policy Availability: Under certain conditions Gestational limit: 12 weeks Conditions: Allowed to save a woman's life, to preserve her mental or physical health or in the cases of rape or incest or foetal impairment. The procedure must be performed by an obstetrician or gynaecologist who has passed the national proficiency tests. After 12 weeks, abortions are allowed only if continued pregnancy would endanger the life or health of the pregnant woman. It must be performed in a hospital or clinic with the consent of the pregnant woman or her parents or guardian if she is a minor.

Mark NThreads: - Posts: 17 Joined: Jan 23, 07	Apr 10, 07, 19:17 / #
Quoting: Giles especially given the amount of mind control the catholic church has over Poles if it wasn't for the Catholic Church... Poland would probably still in communism.

Sedzia	Apr 10, 07, 19:30 / #
Ban abortion. Only expeptions should be if woman was raped or child has proved to be mentaly retarded and unable to survive a normal life.

1st generation	Apr 10, 07, 22:55 / #
Hi, I'm from the U.S. where many religious people oppose our abortion on demand. People vote for the President because he appoints the Supreme Court judges. Bush so far has appointed some good conservative judges. Maybe we can overturn the Roe vs. Wade decision. I never understood why abortion is such a feminist issue when 50% of the babies aborted are females. The father of the child has no rights either under the Roe vs. Wade abortion decision which centered on the privacy rights of the mother.

Patrycja19Threads: 79 Posts: 3,974 Joined: Oct 31, 06	Apr 10, 07, 23:28 / #
Quoting: 1st generation The father of the child has no rights either under the Roe vs. Wade abortion decision which centered on the privacy rights of the mother. I will approach with no sarcasm.. how many women do you think are out there with children who have no fathers? please, be honest, and strait.. in todays society, children are not brought up that religious.. many not having religion, and some who rebel religion, so that really has nothing to do with the fact that a good majority of women are alone raising children now a days.. its so easy for a man to walk away, take off havent you watched maury povich lately??? my god every other show trying to find the father, and if he is the father will he own up to it.. most of these so called young men sit there saying, Im not the daddy, no way, who cares.. when they read the results, its a big shock that they are the father because now they will be paying childsupport for the rest of their lifes instead of doing drugs!

truebritThreads: 3 Posts: 230 Joined: May 19, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:29 / #
A recent report stated that many Polish women are now coming to Britain for abortions.

Giles	Edited by: Administrator Apr 11, 07, 04:34 / #
I thought I'd include this report about El Salvador, just for food for thought. The report shows that a year and a half after El Salvador's new abortion law took effect in 1998, 69 cases involving illegal abortions had been brought before courts. Most involved poor, under-educated, young women who self-induced abortions by using clothes hangers, ingesting very high doses of birth control pills, antacids, caustic liquids or cytotec pills. In 23 of the cases, hospital personnel turned the women over to police after they arrived for medical treatment following incomplete abortions.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:38 / #
thanks for that Giles.. actually it was El Salvador and Guatemala that I had in mind.. these are countries that I regularly travel to and I work with women rights organisations there... the facts are pretty shocking.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:55 / #
well sometimes mistakes happen to those who are taking precautions Greg.

Giles	Apr 11, 07, 04:08 / #
if it wasn't for the Catholic Church... Poland would probably still in communism. That I doubt, and I'm not totally anti-catholic far from it. There are many, many good things that catholicism has given Poland, but relgion is a double edged sword. Hell, my missus is catholic, my mother baptized catholic. Just not me. Anyway heading off topic. daffy that map is very informative, thanks.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:24 / #
A woman should have the right to choose. I haved lived and travelled in countries where abortion is illegal.. this doesnt mean that it doesnt happen, it just means that women are forced to have illegal abortions in less than satisfactory conditions, putting their health at risk. Abortion may be illegal in Poland, but you can be sure that it is still happening and anyone who thinks otherwise is being naive. I am not advocating that abortion should be used as a form of contraception, but even if a woman has had consexual sex she should have the right to an abortion if the baby wasnt planned and it would be detrimental to either her or the child (or both) to have it.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:32 / #
i can believe that.. thats the choice they are faced with... have a dodgy backstreet illegal abortion or travel to another country where it is legal. As an EU member they would have the right to have a free abortion on the NHS here in the UK

Maxxx_Payne_g	Apr 11, 07, 04:44 / #
Quoting: daffy POLANDs current abortion policy Availability: Under certain conditions Gestational limit: 12 weeks Conditions: Allowed to save a woman's life, to preserve her mental or physical health or in the cases of rape or incest or foetal impairment. The procedure must be performed by an obstetrician or gynaecologist who has passed the national proficiency tests. After 12 weeks, abortions are allowed only if continued pregnancy would endanger the life or health of the pregnant woman. It must be performed in a hospital or clinic with the consent of the pregnant woman or her parents or guardian if she is a minor. Poland´s current abortion policy sounds ok.

Grzegorz_Threads: 81 Posts: 6,213 Joined: Nov 16, 06	Apr 11, 07, 04:51 / #
People, who are adult enough to have sex should figure out how to do that without getting pregnant - that's all for me.

Giles	Apr 11, 07, 04:55 / #
Yes Polands laws seem quite sensible, do the function in practise? Is there alot of social stigma attached to the whole thing still?

RazZThreads: 2 Posts: 244 Joined: Feb 15, 07	Apr 11, 07, 05:03 / #
well i think abortion is something that should be brought under control Except for some circumstance that happens. well in India even to this day there are some people who are asked to have a Abortion if the baby is a female or they just burried it alive. its just makes me nuke thoes bastards. abortion in islam is illegal, but i dont want to go in to details about this.

miranda	Apr 11, 07, 07:17 / #
I think that only women should discuss abortion rights since it directly concerns them. Somehow, men are the majority in making those policies and I don't think it's fair.

RazZThreads: 2 Posts: 244 Joined: Feb 15, 07	Apr 11, 07, 07:18 / #
well it depends on men too.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 07:22 / #
Quoting: RazZ well it depends on men too NO it does not! If you are in a relationship then of course the man should be consulted, but ultimately the decision lies with the woman. She is the one who has to carry it for 9 months, give birth, give up work (at least for a while) and ultimately take on the biggest burden of responsibility.

RazZThreads: 2 Posts: 244 Joined: Feb 15, 07	Apr 11, 07, 07:24 / #
this is a serious think. if a women want to get a abortion without the knowledge of her man then its not the right step. As I’ve said abortion will depend on the different situation.

RazZThreads: 2 Posts: 244 Joined: Feb 15, 07	Apr 11, 07, 07:26 / #
Quoting: sapphire She is the one who has to carry it for 9 months, give birth, give up work (at least for a while) and ultimately take on the biggest burden of responsibility. what if a man want to keep the baby, its his baby too and if he doesnt want to have her woman go for the abortion, what then would they still want to ahead with it

miranda	Apr 11, 07, 07:26 / #
RazZ, what I was trying to say was that women, as well as men should have a say in the abortion laws. Law is what I am talking about, not the personal cirumstances.

sapphireThreads: 28 Posts: 1,418 Joined: Dec 7, 06	Apr 11, 07, 07:28 / #
well as I said ideally the man should be consulted, but if the man wants the woman to have it and the woman doesnt want to, then she is the only one can ultimately make the decision. Its not good to bring a child into the world that you dont want or cant keep for whatever reason.

Giles	Apr 11, 07, 07:28 / #
I kinda agree its not really anything to do with us. After all many of us are merely Pandas.