Are Christians prosecuted in Poland (and Europe in general)?

lesser:

I consider EU Commissioners to be parasites like Soviet Commissioners earlier. So, I definitely don't sympathize with Christian leaning socialists, still I think that this was great scandal showing only how intolerant is EU leftist establishment. They refuse to cooperate even with socialists if they don't hide their Christian faith. Imagine how those bureaucrats must hate people like myself! :)I should add that primarily France is to blame for Buttiglione case.

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Administrator Sep 28, 08, 09:54 / #
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocco_Buttiglione His being proposed as a European Commissioner resulted in controversy, as some political groups opposed him for his Roman Catholic views on homosexuality, despite his assurances that these were only his personal convictions and would not dictate his administration. Is it not possible to be european politician and being Chritisian ? This politician is sign that Christians have problems in europe. Why it is not possible to have personal christian views ? Finaly he isn't commisioner in European commision because he is Catholic.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Sep 28, 08, 09:57 / #
Lukasz: Why it is not possible to have personal christian views ? It's ze Germans again...all the fault of those pesky Germans, I tell ya!

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 10:05 / #
It is prossecution. I am Catholic and I have christian views on life. Why I can't be agricultural commisioner or why I can't be responsible for industry in Europe ? It is discrimination. I can't make carrer in european politics because I am Catholic. Very SAD and DEPRESING. What is more it seems that it will be worst and worst.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Sep 28, 08, 10:07 / #
Lukasz: I can't make carrer in european politics because I am Catholic. Did you ever try? :)

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 10:25 / #
Thank you for helping me with adding new post. Where we are ? Boruc has been penaltied for making cross sign in UK. Ok there is strange situatiuon between protestants and catholics. Here we have Rocco who had very religous views but but it was only his opinion. He is great expert he speaks 6 languages. ... Barosso wanted him to be member fo commision. Why in europe it is not possible to have personal christian views without hiding it ? In which direction europe goes ?

DaisyThreads: 16 Posts: 2,172 Joined: Apr 28, 07	Sep 28, 08, 10:27 / #
Lukasz, do you mean prosecution of persecution?

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Sep 28, 08, 10:27 / #
Lukasz: Thank you for helping me with adding new post. I'm a nice guy under my helmet! :):):)

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 10:49 / #
Both terms are good. What is wrong with being Catholic. I am not racist, I will never adivce my partner to do abortion, I try to be good. I have different view on being Catholic than Rocco I'd say much different but it was his personal opinion. There are different views on life. Atheists are better than Chritisians or what ? I like Barosso but unfortunately one of his candiates couldn't be commisioner because of his personal believes.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Edited by: lesser Sep 28, 08, 11:09 / #
I consider EU Commissioners to be parasites like Soviet Commissioners earlier. So, I definitely don't sympathize with Christian leaning socialists, still I think that this was great scandal showing only how intolerant is EU leftist establishment. They refuse to cooperate even with socialists if they don't hide their Christian faith. Imagine how those bureaucrats must hate people like myself! :) I should add that primarily France is to blame for Buttiglione case.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Sep 28, 08, 11:38 / #
lesser: I should add that primarily France is to blame for Buttiglione case. And who is behind France? Right....those devious Germans! It's all their fault I tell ya!

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Sep 28, 08, 12:46 / #
Yeah, but why thrust religion into the limelight? Keep ur private views to yourself, who cares what religious denomination u r? Tension has existed for a long time in Scotland. Gazza was fined for making a flute gesture, highly inflammatory. It works both ways, he made a Protestant gesture. We don't need Christian parades. I don't wanna know if sb is Catholic or Protestant or otherwise. That's their private belief which shouldn't touch on the public domain. Do u really think Muslims or Hindus are more accepted in Europe? As for Rocco, he has VERY religious views as u said. An instant turnoff.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Edited by: lesser Sep 28, 08, 12:54 / #
I wrote this here many times. The EU is and the SU was run by bureaucracy represented by commissioners. These are closely related systems, just two different styles. Both regimes organize elections but in fact this have not any impact on policies of political establishment. Famous Russian dissident based in the UK, I mean Vladimir Bukovsky wrote even book about this issue, EUSSR: The Soviet Roots of European Integration.

Lodz_The_BoatThreads: 57 Posts: 2,316 Joined: Sep 7, 08	Sep 28, 08, 13:06 / #
Lukasz: It is time to organise Christian parades. I dont think so. In Europe we have other religion people too...other ethnicities present too. I think there needs to be secularism.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Sep 28, 08, 13:15 / #
Lodz_The_Boat: I dont think so. In Europe we have other religion people too...other ethnicities present too. I think there needs to be secularism. How about homo-parades?

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 11:43 / #
lesser: I consider EU Commissioners to be parasites like Soviet Commissioners earlier. So, I definitely don't sympathize with Christian leaning socialists, still I think that this was great scandal showing only how intolerant is EU leftist establishment. They refuse to cooperate even with socialists if they don't hide their Christian faith. Imagine how those bureaucrats must hate people like myself! :)I should add that primarily France is to blame for Buttiglione case. To avoid one pathetic figure on this forum who try to ridiculise this discussion to Germans... In my opinion in the nearest future only Christian parades will help us. We don't bite !!! We have personal views but we are human. Sarkozy plan to make union less bureaucratic is very nice. I agree that now we are in union where politicians should be atheist so it is very simillar to communism and indoctrination we had.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Sep 28, 08, 11:57 / #
Manno...I thought you would like my contributions! :( slinks dejectedly into corner

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 12:28 / #
Thread attached on merging: Similarieties between European Union and Soviet Union on Polish example. I will give first example. 1) Christians are persecuted. When Poland was part of Soviet Union all politicians were atheist - good communists. Now in European Union we have simillar tendentions. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocco_Buttiglione His being proposed as a European Commissioner resulted in controversy, as some political groups opposed him for his Roman Catholic views on homosexuality, despite his assurances that these were only his personal convictions and would not dictate his administration. Is it not possible to be european politician and being Chritisian ? This politician is sign that Christians have problems in europe. Why it is not possible to have personal christian views ? Finaly he isn't commisioner in European commision because he is Catholic. Where we are ? Boruc has been penaltied for making cross sign in UK. Ok there is strange situation between protestants and catholics. Here we have Rocco who had very religous views but but it was only his opinion. He is great expert he speaks 6 languages. ... Barosso wanted him to be member of commision. Why in europe it is not possible to have personal christian views without hiding it ? We had similar system durring communism. It is time to organise Christian parades. Christians don't bite! Anny other examples ?

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 12:57 / #
This post is small exception. I will answer you ! You spread your religion on this forum. Atheists or pagans spread their personal believes. Rocco is expert he speaks 6 languages he is educated and he has his personal believes. We need Christian parades! Christians don't bite! It is possible to be christian and expert and work in EU commision.

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 13:20 / #
Why Christians can't be politicians in EU? Where is this freedom. In my opinion Christian parade in Brussel would be very good idea. With big transparents "I am Catholic I am expert Why I can't be commisioner ? "

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Edited by: Seanus Sep 28, 08, 13:28 / #
So, u have nothing against sin? Sin is good, what Hitler did was good, right? Come on laddie, look at what u have just written. Maybe it's the very fact that they keep announcing their Catholic status that turns people off. Ever thought of that? People don't wanna hear tedious musings from religious folk. Point me to a law forbidding Christians from being an EU politician. Do u think they are all from other religious denominations or atheists/agnostics? Do u think being Christian necessarily allows them to do their job better? Aha, u edited ur post, well done

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07	Sep 28, 08, 13:45 / #
Poland was/is subjugated to both- Soviet Union and to European Union. Try to resist to EU and you would be annexed same way how Soviet Union annexed you. Try not to obey and refuse directives from EU and you would be demonized in media, isolated and suffer same way as you suffered in the era of Soviet Union. i know, some would say -`but we wanted EU!`. It`s relative what people want. Great deal of Polish people was deluded with communism and they also `wanted something`... and they got Soviet Union.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Sep 28, 08, 13:54 / #
Bratwurst Boy: And who is behind France? Right....those devious Germans! It's all their fault I tell ya! No, since French revolution the left gained a lot influence in this country. They wish to see the EU to be like France. They gained ideological brothers in other countries and steadily building their pathetic project. Those nationally minded Germans whom think that their state duo to the largest size dict conditions to all others are delusional. This is primary project of the French left (which include also UMP).

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Sep 28, 08, 14:06 / #
Crow: Poland was/is subjugated to both- Soviet Union and to European Union. Try to resist to EU and you would be annexed same way how Soviet Union annexed you. Try not to obey and refuse directives from EU and you would be demonized in media, isolated and suffer same way as you suffered in the era of Soviet Union. I agree we are seing it now.

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07	Sep 28, 08, 14:39 / #
Lukasz: I agree we are seing it now. you didn`t sow anything yet. its just the beggining

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Sep 28, 08, 14:43 / #
Come on, Poland joined the EU in 2004, not 1957 when it was the EEC. Reasons for that aside, extensive thought went into joining it. Poland tried to accede b4 but didn't meet certain environmental standards. Crow, every ratifying nation relinquishes a lot of power to supranational Brussels. Poland is no different in this regard, not a special case.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Sep 28, 08, 14:52 / #
Seanus: Seanus Why this Italian was rejected? Because he claimed to be a Catholic.

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 28, 08, 15:04 / #
Why it is not possible to talk about it on main page ? ADMIN ?? :))) Dicussions about paganism are ok ? About Christianity are wrong ?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Sep 28, 08, 16:39 / #
Discussions about Christianity are fine. I don't think that the EU is so strict in this way. Look at Mary Robinson, an Irish woman, she occupied a prominent position in the EU. I think she was Catholic. I have nothing against innocent Christians carrying out their traditions. It just perplexes me why the EU would take such a stance as u suggest Łukasz. Being Catholic doesn't preclude the possibility of being pro-EU.

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07	Sep 28, 08, 18:04 / #
Seanus: Being Catholic doesn't preclude the possibility of being pro-EU. Who decide what stands are pro-EU and what stands are anti-EU?

SwiteziankaThreads: - Posts: 525 Joined: Jun 17, 08	Edited by: Switezianka Sep 28, 08, 18:46 / #
Christian should be kept quiet when they don't want their religion remain in the private domain. Look what's happening in Poland or the US - religious fanatics influence the legislation. Christians have imposed their religion long enough on others. They think everyone else should follow their ethics (as most major religions claim except judaism), so we should be careful if someone who's got some power talks openly about their views. It's dangerous when politicians make a public thing of religion. Such people will never learn religion is something private. Anyway, this case is not about religion itself but intolerance towards homosexuality that Catholic Church happens to propagate.