MERKEL BEGS ISRAEL FOR FORGIVENESS ? IS TUSK LINED UP NEXT ?

celinski:

an Israeli historian said Monday.

isthatu:

minority ethnic groups

celinski:

isthatu:
minority ethnic groups

isthatu:

I mean,radical muslims (a small minority of muslims may I add)

isthatu:

Israelis murdered many hundreds of British soldiers in terrorist campaigns in the late 40s?

celinski:

but by anti-Semitic sentiments

isthatu:

Did you know for instane

isthatu:

the many thousands of British jews who fought ,at all ranks,in the British armed forces...

WAKEUPPOLAND2:

isthatu:
the many thousands of British jews who fought ,at all ranks,in the British armed forces...

Thousands? Over how many years ? Pls enlighten me...?

isthatu:

1939-1945,you do the maths.

Crnogorac:

The Nationalist Socialist Party of Germany's "final solution" to the Jewish question was to send all the Jews to Madagaskar. When this became impractical, due to problems with logistical issues, many were placed in detention centers no different then what the US did to it's Japanese citizens after the attack on Pearl Harbour. What reasearchers and historians need to find out using scientific means is whether the Holocaust which is a myth did or did not occur and on what scale?The Zionists if they claimed 6 billion were killed nobody would believe it, if they said 6,000 were killed they could'nt capitalize on such a figure, so by consensus the number 6 million was put out which is an ESTIMATE and not a FACT.

77% of Israel's infrastructure was built up from the extortion of Germany which after 1945 was forced to pay 4 billion USD annually and will continue to pay this amount until 2030.

isthatu:

Do you seriously think it makes a difference whether it was 6 million innocent people murdered or the more generaly acepted 5.2 milion estemated murderd? seriously? If any one does they are beyond redemption an not worthy of the label human being.
I will read the link though,sun tsu or some such said its always a good idea to know what your enemy is thinking,no matter how fuked up(ok,that was me not sun tsu)

joepilsudski:

All facts should be brought to light...in a war,no one is blameless in moral terms...not Poles, not Russians, not Ukranians, not Jews, not Germans, not the UK, not the US...but the question must be asked: why is open discussion on this particular aspect of WWII not permitted, especially in Europe?...

joepilsudski:

(my dad was in the US Air Force, where he was a mechanic, stationed in Blackpool UK)..

Grzegorz_:

Tusk is going to beg Germany for fogiveness !

joepilsudski:

I agree with your points...and I will post a link to what is one of the best exposes of this 6 million claim that I have read:URL

isthatu2:

That pamphlet keeps quoting early 1930s figures for the Jewish population of Europe

joepilsudski:

I feel that determining the truth would be a liberation to Poles, Jews, Germans and anyone else who died there...but, there will never be an impartial examination in our lifetime...so, we are left to mostly Internet 'chat-room' debate...and, yes:

TUSK IS NEXT

celinski:

Tusk's" Grandfathers role in history may account for "Tusk's" need to beg for forgiveness.

WARSAW -- Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk, scheduled to visit Israel, says he didn't know his grandfather had ties to the Nazis.

Crow:

WARSAW -- Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk, scheduled to visit Israel, says he didn't know his grandfather had ties to the Nazis.

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Edited by: isthatu Apr 2, 08, 16:15 / #
celinski: an Israeli historian said Monday. Oh,well,it must be true then....lets get one thing straight,Isrealis dont seem to be able to tell the difference between anti semitism and anti Isreali 'ism....yes,there are many people here who have a dislike of the state of israel but I would say the "jew haters" definatly belong to one of our,ehem,minority ethnic groups. Britain is rather caught between a rock and a hard place in this one Carol, The Arabs blame Britain for "giving " Palastine to the post war Jewish refugees,the Israelis have done not a lot but p iss on us ever since. Did you know for instane that the Israelis murdered many hundreds of British soldiers in terrorist campaigns in the late 40s? Did you also know that the as then newly formed Israeli air force shot down 4 RAF planes in one day in 1948? 2 Pilots who had fought against the nazis butchered by people who would have gone up in smoke if it hadnt been for the allies....

celinskiThreads: 83 Posts: 2,800 Joined: Nov 14, 07	Edited by: celinski Apr 2, 08, 16:19 / #
isthatu: minority ethnic groups What do you call it when you want to blame everyone that questions history of Roman Catholic? Anit-Cathitism, how about Anti-Politism or Anti-isthatuitism?

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 2, 08, 16:21 / #
celinski: isthatu: minority ethnic groups that was tongue in cheek,I mean,radical muslims (a small minority of muslims may I add) please see my above edit for a bit of background

WAKEUPPOLAND2Threads: 1 Posts: 63 Joined: Jan 12, 08	Edited by: WAKEUPPOLAND2 Apr 2, 08, 16:25 / #
isthatu: I mean,radical muslims (a small minority of muslims may I add) OMG you are what a real Anti-Semite in its true sense is....lol ;-) only kidding...but seriously you know what i mean....huh ?

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 2, 08, 16:27 / #
er,yes,lets not go down the hair splitting route blah blah all the peoples of that area are semites blah blah...'cept,of course,the vast majority of British muslims arnt semites,they are from the Indian sub continent......

celinskiThreads: 83 Posts: 2,800 Joined: Nov 14, 07	Apr 2, 08, 16:30 / #
I am just messing with you, if you recall last week it was Poland and USA, did you think they would leave you out. Carol isthatu: Israelis murdered many hundreds of British soldiers in terrorist campaigns in the late 40s? "British intellectuals fail to understand the long-term impact of this phenomenon" "During World War II, the British refusal to rescue the Jews of Europe and their decision to close the gates of Palestine stemmed not only from a policy of realpolitik but by anti-Semitic sentiments, he said." http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1206632378756&pagename=JPos t%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 2, 08, 16:37 / #
Basically Carol,this "man" is p issing on the memory of all those who died fighting a war they didnt need to. Id be surprised if this "man" was interend in Belsen,liberated by the British,I would also like to see what his thought are regarding the fact that the British armed the jewish refugees and helped defend them against p issed off arabs in the 40s...like I say,there are some in Israel that make an art out of biting the hand that fed them. celinski: but by anti-Semitic sentiments I wont deny there were plenty of out and out anti semites in pre war Britain, Oswald Mosely and his black shirts were not exactly mates of the goldsteins down the road,but , if Britain was so anti semitic Id like his explanation of such things as the Kinder Transport,No 10 inter allied commandos jewish section not to mention the many thousands of British jews who fought ,at all ranks,in the British armed forces...

celinskiThreads: 83 Posts: 2,800 Joined: Nov 14, 07	Apr 2, 08, 16:50 / #
isthatu: Did you know for instane No most of this I was not aware of. This was the same in eastern Poland when the "Jewish" pointed out the locations of the Polish military families. Better than the artical read the talkback's at the end. Well the majority of the Talkbacks are in Brit's favor.

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Edited by: isthatu Apr 2, 08, 17:24 / #
Thats good to hear Carol,no,I always prefer to have a little faith in people,I really do feel those with extreme views,whatever the angle,are in a minority. HHHmm,lets see; "Shakespeare, " Wasnt he the fella that wrote along the lines of If you prick me do I not bleed etc etc This guy is grasping at straws if he thinks any modern anti sematism comes from people reading frikkin milton et al ( I wish the average Brit was so well read ) " Wistrich said that today's British media had taken an almost universally anti-Israel bias, " Would that be the same media that anti semites claim is dominated by secret jewish cabals? "Under no circumstance will a Palestinian act of terrorism be referred to as terrorist, " Thats a downright lie! sour grapes because we in Britain didnt condone the israeli invasion and cluster bombing of lebbanon 2 years ago. "The historian noted that the straying of the British from their Christian roots has also created a changed reality in the Anglo-Israeli relationship with no Bible-based reasons or raison d'etre for a Jewish presence in the Holy Land. " Good,its the friggin 21st century,no one should support represion and ocupation just coz the bible says its OK...gggrrrr,what a flump. "He cited the recent support of the archbishop of Canterbury for the adoption of parts of Sharia, or Islamic law, in Britain - the same country, which, he noted, was once the birthplace of the US evangelical movement. " What he hasnt "noted" is that Jewish law has been allowed to be practiced here for centuries without interference..again...gggrrrr Sometimes these guys are their own worst enamies. Anyhoo,sod what he says,I'll still eat my bagels,by the odd copy of the Jewish chronical and look back fondly on having played various parts in 3 versions of Fiddler on the Roof (just better not mention that in one I was the Cossak captain eh? ;) )

WAKEUPPOLAND2Threads: 1 Posts: 63 Joined: Jan 12, 08	Apr 2, 08, 17:26 / #
isthatu: the many thousands of British jews who fought ,at all ranks,in the British armed forces... Thousands? Over how many years ? Pls enlighten me...?

DtLebowskiThreads: 2 Posts: 36 Joined: Jan 4, 09	Jan 7, 09, 14:55 / #
I just love the logic that goes on under this thread. We all know that in WWII brave Poland lost 5-6 million of her inhabitants. 3 million of this number was Polish Jewry killed by the Nazis. In areas of USSR under German invasion they killed some 2 million Jews more. And many many other people too. So how it is so hard to believe that the Nazis destroyed these some 5-6 or 5,5-6 million Jews amongst all other people they killed? Surely you believe that under Stalins USSR people we´re killed en masse too, and we all know about Ukrainean Holodomor, year 1937 NKVD-madness and Katyn? But Jewish Holocaust, no? Your pseudo-intellectual doubt about Holocaust, while in the same time you push for the Communist crimes, just shows your bias. I believe in freedom of speech, even if the opinion one claims is simply idiotic and wrongly based, yes we all have freedom to believe in what we want, even if we spit on dead peoples graves. Personally I just like to think your kind of people as little people, thinking those little things in your little minds. And last but not least, my deepest respects for the Polish nation that defended her freedom in WWII by arms, by Underground Universities and by helping their haunted countrimen, Catholic or Jewish.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Dec 7, 09, 00:40 / #
There is some interesting reading here. Tusk is very much onside with the Israeli cause.

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 2, 08, 17:37 / #
WAKEUPPOLAND2: isthatu: the many thousands of British jews who fought ,at all ranks,in the British armed forces... Thousands? Over how many years ? Pls enlighten me...? 1939-1945,you do the maths.

WAKEUPPOLAND2Threads: 1 Posts: 63 Joined: Jan 12, 08	Apr 2, 08, 17:44 / #
isthatu: 1939-1945,you do the maths. Thanks for the enlightment....

joepilsudskiThreads: 44 Posts: 2,529 Joined: Apr 27, 07	Apr 2, 08, 17:46 / #
Crnogorac: The Nationalist Socialist Party of Germany's "final solution" to the Jewish question was to send all the Jews to Madagaskar. When this became impractical, due to problems with logistical issues, many were placed in detention centers no different then what the US did to it's Japanese citizens after the attack on Pearl Harbour. What reasearchers and historians need to find out using scientific means is whether the Holocaust which is a myth did or did not occur and on what scale?The Zionists if they claimed 6 billion were killed nobody would believe it, if they said 6,000 were killed they could'nt capitalize on such a figure, so by consensus the number 6 million was put out which is an ESTIMATE and not a FACT. 77% of Israel's infrastructure was built up from the extortion of Germany which after 1945 was forced to pay 4 billion USD annually and will continue to pay this amount until 2030. I agree with your points...and I will post a link to what is one of the best exposes of this 6 million claim that I have read:URL

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Edited by: isthatu Apr 2, 08, 17:50 / #
Do you seriously think it makes a difference whether it was 6 million innocent people murdered or the more generaly acepted 5.2 milion estemated murderd? seriously? If any one does they are beyond redemption an not worthy of the label human being. I will read the link though,sun tsu or some such said its always a good idea to know what your enemy is thinking,no matter how fuked up(ok,that was me not sun tsu)

joepilsudskiThreads: 44 Posts: 2,529 Joined: Apr 27, 07	Apr 2, 08, 18:37 / #
isthatu: Do you seriously think it makes a difference whether it was 6 million innocent people murdered or the more generaly acepted 5.2 milion estemated murderd? seriously? If any one does they are beyond redemption an not worthy of the label human being. I will read the link though,sun tsu or some such said its always a good idea to know what your enemy is thinking,no matter how fuked up(ok,that was me not sun tsu) Here's what I think: It is important to get all the facts on the table, as much as is possible...then a proper discussion can be engaged in...I think that Germans have been unfairly blamed in this matter...but then the 'victors' get to write the history... All facts should be brought to light...in a war,no one is blameless in moral terms...not Poles, not Russians, not Ukranians, not Jews, not Germans, not the UK, not the US...but the question must be asked: why is open discussion on this particular aspect of WWII not permitted, especially in Europe?...are the events we speak of still too close for comfort?...is there another reason?..and who would object to an open and honest look at this important historical event?...myself, I wasn't even born at the time of WWII (my dad was in the US Air Force, where he was a mechanic, stationed in Blackpool UK)...so my interest is a student of history...I have no axe to grind...as I've said many times, the victims in any war are the little people who have no way of escaping.

isthatuThreads: 4 Posts: 1,627 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 3, 08, 06:50 / #
joepilsudski: All facts should be brought to light...in a war,no one is blameless in moral terms...not Poles, not Russians, not Ukranians, not Jews, not Germans, not the UK, not the US...but the question must be asked: why is open discussion on this particular aspect of WWII not permitted, especially in Europe?... I couldnt agree more,but,there is a vast difference between serious researcg/debate and the sort of complete insanity/nastiness/denialism that cromagnon man spreads. Lets face it,David irvine has been prvoved beyond reasonable doubt to be a complete nut job and nazi sympathiser,I just find it sad that on a Polish forum his pro nazi teachings aare being spread. joepilsudski: (my dad was in the US Air Force, where he was a mechanic, stationed in Blackpool UK).. Hey,My Grandad spent a short while with the RAF in Blackpool during the war:)

CrowThreads: 367 Posts: 7,316 Joined: Feb 14, 07 [Suspended]	Edited by: Crow Apr 3, 08, 11:41 / #
Grzegorz_: Tusk is going to beg Germany for fogiveness ! its crazy but its truth

isthatu2Threads: 13 Posts: 5,225 Joined: Apr 3, 08	Apr 4, 08, 06:20 / #
joepilsudski: I agree with your points...and I will post a link to what is one of the best exposes of this 6 million claim that I have read:URL Joe old buddy,If thats the best you can come up with your on a hiding to nothing...having sat down and actualy read that pseudo "historical research" Im sort of lost for words as to just how plain wrong it all is and just how ilogical the central logic is... One example,I think the main one is; That pamphlet keeps quoting early 1930s figures for the Jewish population of Europe. These figures were obtained by collecting the data on the amounts of people who claimed a Jewish faith,ie people who claimed to be Jewish/practicing Jews........did no one ever point out to you that the nazis didnt give a fig if people claimed to be Jews or not? Did no one ever enlighten you to the fact that the nazis went back about 4 generations to find Jewish people or people with the most tenious "blood jewishness"? Also,the "facts"" spread by that dangerous peice of crap I can imagine would maybe,just maybe convince one or two people,but only if they knew nothing of Poland,example,it claims that the first the west knew about the ill treatment of europes Jews was when some Jewish fella wrote an exposee in 1944.Im guessing you have never heard of the Polish Catholic hero Jan Karski then have you? Dangerous and pitifull stuff all in all.

joepilsudskiThreads: 44 Posts: 2,529 Joined: Apr 27, 07	Edited by: joepilsudski Apr 5, 08, 17:27 / #
isthatu2: That pamphlet keeps quoting early 1930s figures for the Jewish population of Europe The figures in the pamphlet are taken from the World Almanac...how could the world's Jewish population be 13000000 or so in the late 1930's then rise to approximately 18000000 in 1947-48 if 6 million were killed?...this is an impossibility...and the pamphlet quotes from many Jewish sources as to the supposed occurence of events, and the number killed...I found this document to be a very good summation of the whole '6 million' myth...there are many more in depth studies, but the pamphlet 'puts it in a nutshell'...no one is denying the atrocities committed in WWII, just the exagerrations, and the 'reasoning' behind these exagerrations...why, for instance, has the number of those who perished at Aushwitz consistently gone down over the years, from an initial claim of 4 million to the present claim of 1 1/4 million?...Were they just lying in the first place?...the Red Cross in 1945 estimated the total daed from all causes at Aushwitz to be 47 THOUSAND!...the Red Cross went in before the Soviets barred journalists and historians from going in...was the Red Cross way off base?...I feel that determining the truth would be a liberation to Poles, Jews, Germans and anyone else who died there...but, there will never be an impartial examination in our lifetime...so, we are left to mostly Internet 'chat-room' debate...and, yes: TUSK IS NEXT

WAKEUPPOLAND2Threads: 1 Posts: 63 Joined: Jan 12, 08	Apr 5, 08, 18:34 / #
joepilsudski: I feel that determining the truth would be a liberation to Poles, Jews, Germans and anyone else who died there...but, there will never be an impartial examination in our lifetime...so, we are left to mostly Internet 'chat-room' debate...and, yes: TUSK IS NEXT Well there are people who think and question because one can only know where they are going if they know where they have been...and they unfortunately are a dying breed... then there are those who are 'educated' and conformed and look only to to the future...but they have no idea what the future holds. And these are on the rise.... WHICH ONE ARE YOU? ISTHATU ? ISTUSKNEXT ?

celinskiThreads: 83 Posts: 2,800 Joined: Nov 14, 07	Apr 8, 08, 10:13 / #
Tusk's" Grandfathers role in history may account for "Tusk's" need to beg for forgiveness. Polish PM: I understand that for many Jews, Poland means Auschwitz http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/972224.html

CrowThreads: 367 Posts: 7,316 Joined: Feb 14, 07 [Suspended]	Apr 8, 08, 11:50 / #
celinski: Tusk's" Grandfathers role in history may account for "Tusk's" need to beg for forgiveness. you mean this... Polish PM didn't know of Nazi ties 8 April 2008 \| 11:29 \| Source: UPI, Ha'aretz http://www.b92.net/eng/news/world-article.php?yyyy=2008&mm=04&dd=08&na v_id=49205 WARSAW -- Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk, scheduled to visit Israel, says he didn't know his grandfather had ties to the Nazis.

joepilsudskiThreads: 44 Posts: 2,529 Joined: Apr 27, 07	Apr 10, 08, 16:15 / #
Crow: WARSAW -- Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk, scheduled to visit Israel, says he didn't know his grandfather had ties to the Nazis. Tusk father was a Nazi!...this is outrageous...he should immediately be consigned to the dust-bin of history by the Polish nation, and replaced by the Jewish ex-president Krazniewski...surely Krazniewski man had no Nazi ties!