Does Poland count in Europe or is it ignored?

Amathyst:

Oh no its not, look at who committed the London bombings, its wasnt 1st generation pakistanis, it was 2nd or 3rd, its hard to tell because they "import" one of the parents from the homeland (yes they do call it that, Ive heard it said)...There is always an influence from "back home" because they dont like to marry someone too westernised...its the same with the Turks in Germany.

PlasticPole:

I can't tell the difference between the Aussie accent and the British one nor the Canadian and American.

pawian:

Yes, exactly the same happened in Poland occupied by partition powers, more exactly by Russians and Germans. At some point of history the Polish language was forbidden by occupant authorities, in vain hope that after a few dozen years the Polish nation would vanish from the area.

AmathystThreads: 30 Posts: 3,967 Joined: Nov 10, 06	Edited by: Amathyst Dec 26, 09, 16:20 / #
Im going to get jumped on for this remark, but I can no longer leave this thread alone Of course Poland is recognised as being part of Europe, at present they are more like the poor relative, but of course that will change. Torq: Progress, insolent teenager, is the engine of humanity. If you don't develop, don't become richer and more powerful, then and only then you fall into decadence and your fall is only a matter of time. As long as your power and wealth grow, you're safe. We only have to look at history to know that this is true, the wealthy countries who strived, progressed, whilst those who did not fell by the wayside. But progression also brings with a whole host of problems, usually social problems and erosion of core values because "all things shiney" become more important - always a price to pay. Ive only ever visited Poland as tourist but didnt see any difference in its cities to any in France or Spain or any other european city I have visited (apart from miserable terrible service)...I also hear about how people who live in Poland complain about the public sector..well..after taking 2 hours to get through to the council tax department, I cant really see a difference in our countries...ALL public sector departments are CRAP! Nathan: It is, I agree. I am surprised you would love country you were born in less than country of your parents. But is it true to all or you just generalize? Oh no its not, look at who committed the London bombings, its wasnt 1st generation pakistanis, it was 2nd or 3rd, its hard to tell because they "import" one of the parents from the homeland (yes they do call it that, Ive heard it said)...There is always an influence from "back home" because they dont like to marry someone too westernised...its the same with the Turks in Germany.

NathanThreads: 33 Posts: 1,846 Joined: Feb 13, 09	Dec 26, 09, 19:31 / #
Amathyst: Oh no its not, look at who committed the London bombings, its wasnt 1st generation pakistanis, it was 2nd or 3rd, its hard to tell because they "import" one of the parents from the homeland (yes they do call it that, Ive heard it said)...There is always an influence from "back home" because they dont like to marry someone too westernised...its the same with the Turks in Germany. So, as far as I see it, they see themselves foreign even when they were born in a country foreign to their parents. The same happened in France with those two guy who got burnt running from police and the riots which ensued. It is a very difficult issue. There is a huge psychological gap based on traditions, religion, culture, language etc. When I migrate to a foreign country, I feel obligated to respect and cherish that country since that country accepted me in. I am grateful and I won't do anything to hurt its citizens. But when I am born in that country - that's it - it is MY country forever. I think in-taking countries should make programs starting from the kindergarten where the immigrants' children are started to be integrated into the society, so that they feel from the very beginning that they are part of the process and essential part of the society. Parents at home won't be as powerful later to change that perception. PlasticPole: I can't tell the difference between the Aussie accent and the British one nor the Canadian and American. Because you were born in Poland, right? You learnt English as a second language, correct? I just make assumptions here (hope they are correct). But this is what English is for me. To learn a language is a challange; to be able to catch and reproduce that language's nuances is still more challenging. Don't say that you cannot make a distiction between American and British accent - it is too obvious. Aussis also have an easily recogniable way of speaking, not to be mixed with others. Once I watched a movie with a couple of young people and she said:"Oh, that guy is, probably, Welsh, the way he speaks". For me he sounded as American as it is possible. And this is because we were never exposed to these different cultures before. Btw, I had a bit difficulty (very minor) at the beginning to switch from British English (taught in schools in Ukraine) to American English, which is used in the US. I think with time and as you hear them more, you will be able to distinguish these accents. pawian: Yes, exactly the same happened in Poland occupied by partition powers, more exactly by Russians and Germans. At some point of history the Polish language was forbidden by occupant authorities, in vain hope that after a few dozen years the Polish nation would vanish from the area. Yes, language is a huge power, which keeps people and their culture together.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07	Dec 26, 09, 21:20 / #
PlasticPole You can't? The american and the english dialect are quite easily to distinguish...at least for me....

Grzegorz_Threads: 81 Posts: 6,213 Joined: Nov 16, 06	Dec 27, 09, 12:58 / #
BrutalButcher: Wouldn´t it be better if humanity cared about its spiritual level instead of striving for richness and status? What kind of Jew are you ??

BrutalButcherThreads: 1 Posts: 623 Joined: Nov 10, 09	Dec 27, 09, 13:22 / #
Grzegorz_: What kind of Jew are you ?? A Sephardi XD No really, Ashkenazi Jews are more interested in status than us.

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 871 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Dec 27, 09, 13:41 / #
BrutalButcher Not true. I hate status. I was told that I have none.

BrutalButcherThreads: 1 Posts: 623 Joined: Nov 10, 09	Dec 27, 09, 15:17 / #
yehudi: I was told that I have none. We are told many things. How many from them are true? Ma nishma?

pawianThreads: 90 Posts: 5,387 Joined: May 30, 08	Edited by: pawian Dec 27, 09, 20:18 / #
There are various groups of people in Europe for whom Poland does count. One of them are hunters. I don`t support hunting, I think hunters are murderous butchers, sickly fascinated with firearms. The following post is of informative nature, without intention of popularising anything. Poland is a good destination for hunting trips. We still have a lot of forests and game in it compared to Western Europe. See the animals that can be hunted in Poland: http://www.pzllowex.com.pl/index_en.php?id=3a E.g., Wildboar (Sus scrofa) Wildboar can be found in whole areas of the country with exception of high mountains. The most numerous population exists in the West, however it is possible to meet largest individuals in central and eastern Poland. Trophies of Polish wildboars belong to biggest in Europe. See prices: http://www.hubertus-jagdreisen.de/europa/polen_masuren.htm Shooting a wild boar whose tusks are 20 centimeters long will cost 899 euros. The most expensive is red deer with antlers weighing 8 kilograms: 2590 euros. For people interested in hunting here, there are many sites with info. http://www.polandhunting.com/boar_hunting_gallery.htm Real rarities, not only in Europe, are European bison hunts: The largest concentration of bison is found in the Bialowieza National Park in Poland. These animals, known as zubr in Polish, have their welfare monitored by the Polish organisation known as 'Operation Zubr'. Poland Hunting is able to offer a very rare opportunity for the trophy sportsman to take one of these special animals. We have a small allocation of bulls and cows which can be taken as a result of herd management. This is a unique opportunity. http://www.polandhunting.com/deer_hunting.htm

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,024 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER	Edited by: Torq Dec 27, 09, 20:29 / #
pawian: I think hunters are murderous butchers, sickly fascinated with firearms. Do you know many hunters that fit your description, Pawian? Men in my family were hunters for many generations and I used to go hunting with my father just like he used to hunt with his. I wouldn't describe any of us as a "murderous butcher, sickly fascinated with firearms" (however, the skill in using firearms proved to be very useful on too many occasions in Poland's and our family's history). It's sad that you consider Stefan Batory, Henryk Sienkiewicz, Józef Piłsudski and countless other Polish artists, military leaders and politicians to be "murderous butchers, sickly fascinated with firearms".

NathanThreads: 33 Posts: 1,846 Joined: Feb 13, 09	Edited by: Nathan Dec 27, 09, 20:42 / #
pawian: I don`t support hunting, I think hunters are murderous butchers, sickly fascinated with firearms. They should go out and shoot each other for the benefit of nature and our society instead of murdering rare species of animals.

Guest	Dec 28, 09, 07:54 / #
Unfortunately, Poland doesn't count. In theory Poland is free to veto against more immigrants to protect Polish culture and society. In reality Poland will be punished by the rest of the EU (thanks to Britain, France, Germany and Spain) if doing so.

pawianThreads: 90 Posts: 5,387 Joined: May 30, 08	Dec 27, 09, 22:57 / #
Torq: Do you know many hunters that fit your description, Pawian? To be frank, not too many. I know one dentist whose daughter I used to teach English. He is a big burly guy with a harsh voice and a face of Frankenstein`s monster. Yuk! Men in my family were hunters for many generations and I used to go hunting with my father just like he used to hunt with his. I wouldn't describe any of us as a "murderous butcher, sickly fascinated with firearms" (however, the skill in using firearms proved to be very useful on too many occasions in Poland's and our family's history). You told me your story, I`ll tell you mine. In 1996 I went on holiday to the lakes with my girlfriend, today my wife. I had borrowed a fishing license and a rod from my sister`s boyfriend. Camping at the lake, I went fishing one early morning. After an hour or two I caught a fish. I pulled it off water. When I saw it springing on the planks of the fishing bridge, I decided to let it go. What is more, I decided to give up fishing completely and never kill a wild animal for my personal pleasure. People who kill for pleasure are sick. It's sad that you consider Stefan Batory, Henryk Sienkiewicz, Józef Piłsudski and countless other Polish artists, military leaders and politicians to be "murderous butchers, sickly fascinated with firearms". I don`t care about surnames. Every hunter who enjoys killing is sick in his head to me.

pawianThreads: 90 Posts: 5,387 Joined: May 30, 08	Edited by: Moderator Dec 27, 09, 23:19 / #
Poland in foreign eyes 27.12.2009 15:30 Pope John Paul II, Lech Walesa and Nicolas Copernicus – these are the three Poles who are mentioned most frequently in history textbooks in various countries. According to a report on Polish communities abroad, compiled by the Polish Foreign Ministry, in most countries the problems of Poland are taken up in the context of the outbreak of World War Two, the Holocaust and the collapse of communism. Generally speaking, Poland is given marginal treatment in both history and geography texbooks. France is singled out in the report as a country where the presentation of Poland is negligent and outdated. http://www.thenews.pl/international/?id=122671