Polish engineer beheaded in Pakistan.

MrBubbles:

Whatever gave you that impression? Ha Ha! The fact is that the millions of Muslims in Indonesia live together with millions of people of other faiths and do not have a problem with them. A fact borne out by the Indonesians of all faiths who I have worked with. Now run back to your joss sticks and yoga videos little girl.

nrxThreads: 1 Posts: 42 Joined: Feb 8, 09	Feb 28, 09, 18:35 / #
Some good news http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSTRE51R0OE20090228?feedTyp e=RSS&feedName=worldNews&rpc=69&pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0

nrxThreads: 1 Posts: 42 Joined: Feb 8, 09	Mar 3, 09, 07:21 / #
and some really bad one :(, these people need to be brought to justice immediately, cricket is my other religion.. http://pkpolitics.com/2009/03/03/sri-lankan-tean-attacked-6-players-in jured/

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Mar 3, 09, 07:27 / #
MrBubbles: Indeed... George Bush was only too keen the whip the religious right into a fervour over the upcoming war with the Muslims, because let's face it, that's what it was sold as - not a war against Al Kaieda or Iraq. how's that.. it was yellow cake, WMDs, freedom, democracy and other reasons but sure never heard that it was about killing muslims.. you're making this up..

MrBubblesThreads: 13 Posts: 768 Joined: Nov 13, 07	Mar 3, 09, 08:40 / #
plk123: you're making this up.. Europe cringes at Bush 'crusade' against terrorists "On Sunday, Bush warned Americans that 'this crusade, this war on terrorism, is going to take awhile.'" http://www.csmonitor.com/2001/0919/p12s2-woeu.html George Bush and the Rise of Christian Fascism Rev. Rich Lang Trinity United Methodist Church Seattle. "For example: 1.. Mr. Bush consistently sends signals to his right wing religious base. In last year's State of the Union he exhorted: "there's power, wonder working power, in the goodness and idealism and faith of the American people". It's a phrase from a well known Communion hymn "there's power, wonder working power in the blood of the lamb". Bush brings together the holiness zeal of Christian evangelicalism with patriotic fundamentalism. The core belief system of this 'civic gospel' goes something like this: The United States was founded as a Christian nation with free enterprise as the only economic system truly compatible with Christian beliefs. These religious values are today under attack in America. The danger is that without faith in God America will lose its blessing. Therefore, the government needs to act to protect the nation's religious heritage. " http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5648.htm

free palestineThreads: - Posts: 61 Joined: Jan 14, 09	Mar 3, 09, 09:26 / #
De PEREIRA: there is no Religion that can condone this savagery and the mere fact that acts like this are filmed and posted makes it barbaric beyond words i am not condoning this barbaric behaviour by taliban but let me ask you this,is using chemical weapons on muslims(gaza)civilised or any different from what the taliban are doing?is bombing civilians at a wedding(afghanistan)and killing everybody there and claiming bad intelligence any different to taliban?no,i dont think so,the fact is afghanistan is a war zone,anybody helping the coalition who gets caught will be killed or tortured just like people who have been caught by the coalition,shipped to guantanamo and severly tortured and killed but ofcourse we are never shown the coalitions atrocities inflicted on the other side but we are shown the damage the enemy does.this is propaganda,todays wars are created,won and lost by the media,you control the media and you only paint a rosy picture of your part in the war and make the enemy look barbaric and vice versa.

nrxThreads: 1 Posts: 42 Joined: Feb 8, 09	Mar 5, 09, 06:54 / #
Pakistani and Afghani Taliban prepare to join in

King SobieskiThreads: 7 Posts: 1,106 Joined: Jan 22, 07	Mar 25, 09, 04:30 / #
MrBubbles: Whatever gave you that impression? Ha Ha! The fact is that the millions of Muslims in Indonesia live together with millions of people of other faiths and do not have a problem with them. A fact borne out by the Indonesians of all faiths who I have worked with. Now run back to your joss sticks and yoga videos little girl. my girlfriend is indonesian (of chinese descent), the stories she has told me about the riots give me the opposite feeling and the reason her parents sent her to australia to study. she says there is still an uderlying simmering of tensions and that chinese are still targets.

k98_man	Mar 25, 09, 04:38 / #
ShelleyS: This is a rather fluffy interpretation and we know the Koran is open to many many interpretation. Every religious book is open to interpretation. That's why you have orthodox Jews who (at times) want to outlaw Reform or Conservative Jews. I really don't believe (though I haven't, and probably should read it) the Koran is a violent religion. It's a religion that (like Christianity) offers "easy" salvation and usually comes with a lot of benefits (see Ottoman Turk policies, etc. etc.) for poorer people. Unfortunately poorer people are also the prey that religious fanatics love and that's where some of the problem lies. It could have easily been misintirpreted Christianity, but instead (because of foreign invaders) it seems to be Islam. No doubt the number of fanatics that use terrorism in Allah's name is higher than any other religion, but I'm not so sure that reflects on Islam.

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Mar 25, 09, 06:27 / #
MrBubbles: MrBubbles ok, i'll give you that he whipped up the religious freaks on the right but this still wasn't a crusade.. although bush did use those words more then once. regardless, it was a freaking big waste just like everything else bush touched. thank goodness that's over now.

z_dariusThreads: 22 Posts: 5,091 Joined: Oct 18, 07	Mar 25, 09, 06:52 / #
Strange country, this Pakistan. Perfectly good Hindu people turned into islamic nuts. About the only solution I see is for Pakistan and the like is what Atatürk did in Turkey. No screwing around, no nice talk, PC or so called human rights of some assholes against human rights of the whole.

ElbprinzThreads: - Posts: 12 Joined: Mar 21, 09	Mar 25, 09, 19:05 / #
z_darius: for Pakistan and the like is what Atatürk did in Turkey. Might be the answer, but apart from practical problems of feasibility, how would you react to the conceptual criticism of Kemalism? Presidential adviser and scholar Samuel Huntington argues that Kemalist Westernization always results in "torn" countries doomed to failure, because the cultural values (enlightenment, decalogue, democracy, tolerance, freedom of thought, etc.) imposed on them are alien to them. "Western intervention in the affairs of other civilizations is probably the single most dangerous source of instability and potential global conflict." (Clash of Civilizations) The problem is Islam itself. An enlightened Islam is a contradiction in terms and not doable, because (unlike the bible) the Quran is God's original command and not interpretable. Perhaps the best solution really is cultural relativism? We are we and the others are the others? p.s. Gee, I forget the crude oil ;)

ElbprinzThreads: - Posts: 12 Joined: Mar 21, 09	Edited by: Elbprinz Mar 26, 09, 10:53 / #
plk123: plk123 yes, thank you, plk, for your informative remarks. I think is was clear from what I wrote in the first place that I was referring to a Kemalist approach to the worldwide phenomenon of Islam.

nrxThreads: 1 Posts: 42 Joined: Feb 8, 09	Mar 28, 09, 23:40 / #
Elbprinz: Quran is God's original command and not interpretable First half is true, second half is not if I assume that by saying that Quran is not interpretable, you mean that there is one and only one possible interpretation. Unlike some other religions, Islam does not endorse a central authority like a Vatican. Every reader is responsible for his/her own interpretation and Quran itself acknowledges and anticipates multiple interpretation sometimes contradictory, sometimes driven by personal/political interests and sometimes out of total honesty. Sure you can look towards scholars for guidance and there are some rules of the game but in essence nobody can claim a final interpretation and thats why the most important and most repetitive message in this book is to educate and explore. The problem is the followers or in this case, the Muslims. Its a human nature, everywhere that a majority prefers to follow the herd like sheep. You can tell them anything in the name of religion and they won't question you. As for the Ataturk approach, well it has already been tried and it failed. Musharraf idealized him and tried to redo the whole thing is Pakistan, the result was extremely counterproductive. We didn't see extremism as a problem until early 2000s.

Shawn_H	Apr 29, 09, 17:36 / #
The body of a Polish engineer killed by Taliban militants in Pakistan in February was returned to his family in Poland on Wednesday. Source

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Mar 25, 09, 19:58 / #
pakistan doesn't have crude, elb. but yes, west's meddling over there is the problem, imho.

ElbprinzThreads: - Posts: 12 Joined: Mar 21, 09	Mar 25, 09, 20:06 / #
plk123: pakistan doesn't have crude, elb I was referring to Elbprinz: Pakistan and the like and "the like" do have the oil, and that's a big prob.

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Mar 25, 09, 20:14 / #
the like are afghanistan, india.. they don't have oil either. the caucuses have oil but i wouldn't say they are "the like"

ShelleySThreads: 18 Posts: 3,647 Joined: Jun 26, 07	Mar 26, 09, 12:16 / #
nrx: Pakistani and Afghani Taliban prepare to join in More Dead Pakistan ask for help Whilst everyone is going on and on about Afaganistan and Iraq, there is a war going on in Pakistan, thousands of Pakistani soldiers and police have been murdered by the taliban over the last few years - unregulated madrasa are a cause for concern. Extremists Finally in the UK we are cutting ties: way forward

mephiasThreads: 15 Posts: 812 Joined: Nov 14, 08 MEMBER	Mar 29, 09, 00:21 / #
nrx: As for the Ataturk approach, well it has already been tried and it failed. Why do you believe in that ? Why it has failed ?

freebirdThreads: 3 Posts: 638 Joined: Jun 8, 07	Apr 29, 09, 17:48 / #
Grzegorz_: Polish engineer beheaded in Pakistan. this is what religious fanatics are able to do

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07	Edited by: plk123 Jun 6, 09, 05:06 / #
pakistan_children_of_the_taliban_part_1_of_4/ make sure to check out all 4 parts.