Polish Education Grading and Uk Edu. Grading?

Seanus:

Sławek, you do a course. As an experienced teacher, I disagree. There are many students with FCE and CAE that really aren't up to scratch. Those certificates don't cut the mustard a lot of the time.

It will give you some confidence with the language but it's just the start of your learning curve. It's like the CELTA, it's a baseline course and there are many ways to build on it. You come out of it with a basic awareness of methodological issues but, truth be told, you barely scrape the surface.

It depends what you need. Your English is more than good enough for communicating. Your article use is a little askew but, then again, I can say the same about Polish teachers of English.

Slawek076Threads: - Posts: 87 Joined: Nov 4, 09	Edited by: Slawek076 Nov 11, 09, 01:36 / #
Seanus: Sławek, you do a course. As an experienced teacher, I disagree. There are many students with FCE and CAE that really aren't up to scratch. Those certificates don't cut the mustard a lot of the time. It will give you some confidence with the language but it's just the start of your learning curve. It's like the CELTA, it's a baseline course and there are many ways to build on it. You come out of it with a basic awareness of methodological issues but, truth be told, you barely scrape the surface. It depends what you need. Your English is more than good enough for communicating. Your article use is a little askew but, then again, I can say the same about Polish teachers of English. AS I SAID BEFORE, I'M STILL WORKING ON MY ENGLISH. QUESTION IS: WHY TO GET GCSE IN ENGLISH (LOWER THAN CAE) IF YOU'VE GOT CAE? WHY DO ENGLISH EMPLOYERS ACCEPT ONLY GCSE?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Nov 11, 09, 01:44 / #
I don't think it's as clear cut as you think. English O grades and A grades are seen as higher than their Scottish counterparts, S Grades and Higher (Revised) Grades. Simply put, FCE and CAE are general proficiency courses done by foreigners but GCSE's are done by natives. Sorry, I've been a mentor of CAE and FCE groups and taught them for 4 years. I know what I'm talking about, Scottish Highers are much harder thematically than them. FCE and CAE would have been a walk in the park for me at 16 but Highers can really put you to the sword. I have to say, even weaker students in Scotland have better written English than some of the writing assignments I read. Speaking? No comparison.

Slawek076Threads: - Posts: 87 Joined: Nov 4, 09	Nov 11, 09, 01:52 / #
Seanus At least someone who knows the difference. Thank's for explanation. Now, it's more clear for me. I think, that's good idea to get GCSE in English either.

frdThreads: 8 Posts: 1,956 Joined: Feb 3, 09	Edited by: frd Nov 11, 09, 01:54 / #
Seanus: Polish education is seen as higher and I can testify, first hand, that young Poles are generally very bright and sharp. hehe, trying to put the thread back on the track :) I think the problem with perceiving who is more or less educated is the bias. If you're encircled with people with high education you might tend to extend that point of view on the whole population. If the first people you meet are uneducated boors ( dresiarze) it can induce a feeling of being superior to them and their countryman.. All of my friends are highly educated, well mannered people and sometimes, unknowingly - during a heated debate, I tend to stretch these traits onto other Poles... Seanus: My question is, what happens to them? Nothing happens, if they want they shine :) If somebody wants to study and gather knowledge, he will despite the odds. Of course there's a difference in luxury between polish and british schools. Laboratories are not as well equipped and teachers are not as friendly and some of the things they teach are close to being depracate, but still, the knowledge is there and if somebody has the strength to reach for it, he will. Slawek076: . I think, that's good idea to get GCSE in English either. I think it's good to have any certificate you can get ;) Of course if you've got the money to get them. Some employers won't care, some will test you at the job review anyways, but some will take a look at your CV and your skillset and it might make a difference.

Slawek076Threads: - Posts: 87 Joined: Nov 4, 09	Nov 11, 09, 01:57 / #
frd: If somebody wants to study and gather knowledge, he will despite the odds. Of course there's a difference in luxury between polish and british schools. Laboratories are not as well equipped and teachers are not as friendly and some of the things they teach are close the being depracate, but still, the knowledge is there and if somebody has the strength to reach for it, he will. AGREE

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Edited by: Seanus Nov 11, 09, 02:00 / #
The other side of the coin is that it is seen as investing in learning and they are respectable enough qualifications (FCE and CAE). The fact is, you can go beyond GCSE's to first degree level, then second degree level and still struggle to get a job. Everyone must build from somewhere and the Cambridge qualifications provide basic guarantees to employers. Also, some say that CPE is worth having. Even then, yes and no. It gives your English undoubtable polish but is seen as redundant by some. I have also taught CPE and found it useful though not everyone sees it that way. It could be perceived as sth akin to being overly academic. I also think it depends on monitoring personal development. This is true in a career sense through Continuing Professional Development (CPD) and also on the learning curve in general. Yes, I got seven Highers but didn't do that well, only getting BBBCCCC. However, one year later, I was doing much harder legal modules like Jurisprudence and scoring much higher (my undergrad). I got a few first-class passes and that spurred me on even more. So, the point is that you should be proud of your foundation from which to build. You are in a position to grow now as I was after doing my CELTA. You learn by doing ;) Keep up the good work, Sławek :) Frd, super commentary!!! Right on the mark!!! Reflection happens a lot.

nincompoop_notThreads: 4 Posts: 229 Joined: Nov 3, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:02 / #
Slawek076: Seanus At least someone who knows the difference. Thank's for explanation. Now, it's more clear for me. I think, that's good idea to get GCSE in English either. after 5 years living here? welcome home xweetie

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Nov 11, 09, 02:05 / #
What is your point, nincompoop_not? I don't get it.

Slawek076Threads: - Posts: 87 Joined: Nov 4, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:08 / #
nincompoop_not: after 5 years living here? welcome home xweetie Well, I was a little busy here and my English has been good enough and it is still to work on well paid position and live here. darlin' :)

frdThreads: 8 Posts: 1,956 Joined: Feb 3, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:11 / #
Seanus: Also, some say that CPE is worth having. Heard a few sad stories about how some polish employers price fce and cae more because they don't know what cpe is exactly...

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Nov 11, 09, 02:14 / #
I think many people would struggle with CPE unless they have been exposed to living English. A lot of it is slang, idiomatic and replete with figurative expressions. It cannot be worked out by logic that often, sometimes you either know or you don't. FCE and CAE show dedication and, in today's rat race, seeing out the course with a B is quite respectable and shows your staying power.

Slawek076Threads: - Posts: 87 Joined: Nov 4, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:15 / #
frd: Heard a few sad stories about how some polish employers price fce and cae more because they don't know what cpe is exactly... Are you kidding me?

nincompoop_notThreads: 4 Posts: 229 Joined: Nov 3, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:16 / #
Seanus: What is your point, nincompoop_not? I don't get it. you've lost your point (not there was nay) slawek got it right

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Nov 11, 09, 02:19 / #
What would that be? I didn't lose any point.

nincompoop_notThreads: 4 Posts: 229 Joined: Nov 3, 09	Nov 11, 09, 02:43 / #
Seanus: What would that be? I didn't lose any point. no, you didn't. slawek said/you explained/ I did say somethign etc slawek got his point after your explanation and i was like - come on, took you five years to get it? a mere misunderstanding with quotation

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Nov 11, 09, 02:46 / #
Hmm...if you say so. It just looked like a provocational effort ;) ;)