Information Needed About Holocaust Related Travel: Krakow, Lublin, Warsaw

MJL:

1. Driving from Germany in a rented car should I encounter any problems or slow downs at the German/Polish border? Again, speaking no Polish will I get hassled?

MJL:

4. I collect militaria. Is there any place (shop, flea market, etc) that you can recommend where I can find older military items? I like Imperial Russian, Imperial German, Austro-Hungarian, early Polish and Soviet Great Patriotic War era stuff. Maybe some WWII German items but I am less keen on those. I like bayonets, knives, uniforms, helmets, hats, orders, medals, flags, etc

MJLThreads: 1 Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 7, 09	Edited by: Moderator Jun 7, 09, 14:35 / #
Hello, I found this site when doing some looking around on the internet. I come seeking any and all advice. Here is my scenario: I have been accepted as an academic fellow of a German institute and so will be traveling from the United States to Germany to do my work with them during the remainder of the month of June. Afterward I intend to rent a car in Frankfurt (to give me the flexibility to look about) to drive to Poland. A little background about myself; I am a High School historian/educator of American History and currently am a 43 year old graduate student in that field. My knowledge of the Polish language is non existent. My knowledge of Polish history is moderate. I am the decedent of Polish Jews who emigrated from Austro-Hungarian controlled Poland in the 1890s or earlier. My trip to Poland will serve several purposes. The primary reason I am coming to Poland is to visit the Holocaust sites at Auschwitz, Belzec, Majdanek, Sobibor and Treblinka. The secondary reason is to make some connection (cultural, historical, etc) with the Poland my people emigrated from. Thirdly this trip is a recon trip to set the stage for a later return with my wife and daughter so we can see the Holocaust sites in the future. Fourth, I am considering a Masters Thesis on the Holocaust so this trip will be an information gathering expedition for that as well. I realize a trip like this is not fair to the huge extent of Polish history and the rich culture of Poland so I am seeking guidance. I do have some questions I would like to ask: 1. Driving from Germany in a rented car should I encounter any problems or slow downs at the German/Polish border? Again, speaking no Polish will I get hassled? I am assuming this is not going to be like crossing from one EU country to another. What should I expect? 2. What are driving conditions like? How are the roads? Are petrol stations easily available? Any tips I should know about? How is driving after dark? Are the roads around Lublin OK? 3. I am diabetic and handicapped(spinal damage that makes me walk with a cane). I am not on insulin but control my diabetes by controlling what I eat. Please give me a clue what I can expect to find in Poland food wise? Are supermarkets widely available? Can someone please direct me towards low sugar low carbohydrate Polish foods that can be purchased in restaurants? I love Pirogi but they have way too many carbs for me. What are my other options? 4. I collect militaria. Is there any place (shop, flea market, etc) that you can recommend where I can find older military items? I like Imperial Russian, Imperial German, Austro-Hungarian, early Polish and Soviet Great Patriotic War era stuff. Maybe some WWII German items but I am less keen on those. I like bayonets, knives, uniforms, helmets, hats, orders, medals, flags, etc 5. I am a underpaid American educator. We had to take an unexpected pay cut last week so I have dramatically less money than I thought I would have. I am not asking for handouts but am asking for clues how to travel, stay, eat, etc cheaply. Remember, everything an educator sees, learns, eats, etc gets brought back into their classrooms. I fully expect to come back to my students with rapacious stories of Poland and would love to have assistance in that. 6. Any clues to Holocaust sites would be appreciated. 7. I intend to stay two days in Krakow Auschwitz-Briana), two days in Lublin (Belzec, Majdanek, Sobibor) and perhaps one or two days in Warsaw (Treblinka). Could you give me specific tips about these places? Places to stay, eat, shop for food, etc? Thanks so much in advance for any and all help you can give me. I am looking forward to my time in Poland with both concern and rapacious interest. I hope to come back to this forum upon my return with a report about my travels.

WroclawThreads: 74 Posts: 7,276 Joined: Apr 1, 06 [Moderator]	Edited by: Wroclaw Jun 7, 09, 14:58 / #
MJL: should I encounter any problems or slow downs at the German/Polish border? There is no border MJL: I am diabetic and handicapped This shouldn't be a problem MJL: I collect militaria. Check other threads on this site for more info MJL: am asking for clues how to travel, stay, eat, etc cheaply. buses and hostels are quite cheap Each of the camps has its own website. Just do a little search.

Grzegorz_Threads: 80 Posts: 6,104 Joined: Nov 16, 06	Jun 7, 09, 15:07 / #
MJL: 1. Driving from Germany in a rented car should I encounter any problems or slow downs at the German/Polish border? Again, speaking no Polish will I get hassled? No... There's no border anymore... MJL: 4. I collect militaria. Is there any place (shop, flea market, etc) that you can recommend where I can find older military items? I like Imperial Russian, Imperial German, Austro-Hungarian, early Polish and Soviet Great Patriotic War era stuff. Maybe some WWII German items but I am less keen on those. I like bayonets, knives, uniforms, helmets, hats, orders, medals, flags, etc According to Polish law you can't take out of the country any item made before 1945 without special permission.

BzibziohThreads: 6 Posts: 3,648 Joined: Oct 15, 08	Edited by: Bzibzioh Jun 7, 09, 15:14 / #
MJL: Auschwitz-Briana Getting the names right would be a good start. Auschwitz-Birkenau, Mr-Masters-Thesis-on the-Holocaust. While in Poland look for Oświęcim-Brzezinka. MJL: and perhaps one or two days in Warsaw (Treblinka). Warsaw Ghetto Uprising, hallo?

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 816 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Jun 7, 09, 15:23 / #
Here's a bit of advice: If you focus only on the camps, your trip will be very depressing and you will be burnt out after a few days. If you're interested in the Poland that your Jewish ancestors emigrated from,I suggest that you see some remnants of the Jewish world that existed there before the war. Visit the towns your people came from and look for the Synagogue (if it's still there), visit the market squares and imagine what it was like back then. Visit the Jewish cemeteries and see monuments that are hundreds of years old. Ask old people you encounter to show you where the Jews used to live, ask where the ghetto was during the war (try to get a Polish speaker to travel with you). Not everyone will want to talk to you, but some people will be very open and interested to talk. Whether they like Jews or not, old people in poland are a living link with the Jews that once lived there. Everyone has a story to tell, if you can communicate with them. In Krakow visit the old Jewish neighborhood of Kazimierz. That's one of the only places in Poland where there is a functioning synagogue and it gives you a small taste of what once was there. Also go to the camps (with a Jewish tour group and not on your own if possible) but balance that out with some less morbid places.

MJLThreads: 1 Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 7, 09	Jun 7, 09, 15:24 / #
Bzibzioh: MJL: Auschwitz-Briana Getting the names right would be a good start. Auschwitz-Birkenau, Mr-Masters-Thesis-on the-Holocaust. MJL: and perhaps one or two days in Warsaw (Treblinka). Warsaw Ghetto Uprising, hallo? Thanks for the sarcasm. Is this what I have to look forward to in Poland? I had been told that Poles are warm and inviting so I truly hope you are not the norm. The spelling was the result of an American English spell checker that spit out Birkanau (I have it turned off now) and inserted Briana (?). My MA is in American History, not the Holocaust, but I am working a possible angle regarding Polish surviviors in the South Florida area. Thus I am trying to "walk the land" of some of the events I have been told about by these survivors and by members of my own family so I can get a feel for the places I have been told about.

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Jun 7, 09, 15:34 / #
MJL: What are driving conditions like? How are the roads? Are petrol stations easily available? Any tips I should know about? How is driving after dark? Are the roads around Lublin OK? I don't know about Lublin but most main roads throughout Poland are under construction, E.U. gives a lot of money towards infrastructure. MJL: Are supermarkets widely available? Yes MJL: I am diabetic I cannot honestly help you there. MJL: walk with a cane No problems there, as far as I know. MJL: I collect militaria. Is there any place (shop, flea market, etc) that you can recommend where I can find older military items? "Antyki", Antique shops are you best bet, you will love some of the really interesting stuff they have here, it is paradise for someone who likes it. MJL: am asking for clues how to travel, stay, eat, etc cheaply. Try to stay just outside cities, it is cheaper to stay in the country and you should be able to drive in to the city if needs be. Buy your food from the farmers market or green grocers, not the supermarkets. It is cheaper and better quility from the farmers themselves. These can be found in all towns. MJL: I fully expect to come back to my students with rapacious stories of Poland and would love to have assistance in that. I live near Krakow, here you have schindler's factory, the Jewish quarter, the Jewish Getto and of course Auschwitz. When you come here I would be happy to help you out, if I can. It is very important for people to know what happened, so it never repeats. This will be an experience you will never forget. MJL: Could you give me specific tips about these places? Places to stay, eat, shop for food, etc? If you like I have a house 35km south of Krakow, you can stay for free.

MJLThreads: 1 Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 7, 09	Jun 7, 09, 15:38 / #
yehudi: Here's a bit of advice: If you focus only on the camps, your trip will be very depressing and you will be burnt out after a few days. Yehudi, Sage advice and something I have twisted about for some time now. Without revealing too many details I am assuming the Germans will be presenting themselves to me in the best possible light. I have, for some time now, considered going to either Poland or France/Belgium after my fellowship is completed in Germany. Members of my family fought with the United States Army from Normandy into Belgium and then into Germany. I have a few resting in cemeteries in France from both World Wars and one in Luxembourg that I have wanted to pay my respects to. Yet, time is very short and I need to make a quick run of this. I have about 7-8 days tops to make a dash into Poland to see what I need to see. Thus, for now, I am avoiding places like the Warsaw ghetto uprising or the later Warsaw uprising against the Germans as these will wait for another trip with my family. The same goes for the Jewish areas of cities like Krakow where I believe my Maternal family may have come from. For now I actually WANT the depressing and deeply personal experiences at the camps by myself so I can come to grips with some emotions and lingering feelings I have had. I have been advised to hire a Polish guide to the camps and even read about this in a book I bought but I don't see that I will have the money to do this. To me a visit to the camps will be more about feelings and emotions than snapshots and pictures. I am fully aware of what lays ahead for me but seek to confront some of these issues so I can better understand what has been said to me by people I have been talking to in the USA. I need to walk the ground, smell the smells and get a feeling of the places.

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Jun 7, 09, 15:39 / #
yehudi: If you focus only on the camps, your trip will be very depressing and you will be burnt out after a few days. If you're interested in the Poland that your Jewish ancestors emigrated from Excellent suggestion!. MJL: Thanks for the sarcasm. this is the internet, expect smart arses

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Edited by: SeanBM Jun 7, 09, 16:07 / #
MJL: so I can come to grips with some emotions and lingering feelings I have had. What emotions and feelings are they?. Do you know what I think would be really interesting. If you were to keep a journal on here about your trip. To start it now, about what you think and how you feel about what you have learnt and what you have heard. And about your concerns and rapacious interest about what you expect. I know you suggested coming back to this forum upon your return with a report about your travels but it would be more interesting if we could go on this trip with you, if you know what I mean?. I get the impression that history has been a little rewritten in the U.S. about the holocaust, of course i could be wrong, so it would be good if we could dispel some myths.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07	Jun 7, 09, 17:05 / #
Israel looks truly beautiful. For the author of the thread, don't forget about Prof Omer Bartov. You may be able to get hold of the transcripts of his speeches. He was in Wellington, capital of NZ, last month.

AndyGM1TBW	Edited by: Moderator Jun 28, 09, 13:30 / #
Hi If you can, get hold of a book published by the BBC Books called Auschwitz - The Nazis & The Final Solution by Laurence Rees - ISBN 0-563-52296-8. I think it's well worth a read. Andy, N.E. Scotland

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 816 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Jun 7, 09, 16:23 / #
Don't expect to come to grips with your emotions and feelings. Expect to acquire new emotions and feelings.

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Jun 7, 09, 16:33 / #
I take it you've been here yehudi?. Is your family from Poland?. How did you end up in Jerusalem?.

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 816 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Jun 7, 09, 16:50 / #
Yes I've been there. It was an intense experience. So intense that i end up spending time on this Polish forum. My grandfather was from Poland. He came to Tel Aviv in the 1930s. My mother's family left Ukraine for Jerusalem in the 1920s.

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Jun 7, 09, 17:00 / #
Did you have much contact with you Polish grandfather or your mother's family from Ukraine?. How is Poland perceived in Jerusalem?. I was in Jerusalem once many years ago, very interesting place.

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 816 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Jun 7, 09, 17:33 / #
SeanBM: Did you have much contact with you Polish grandfather or your mother's family from Ukraine?. How is Poland perceived in Jerusalem? I new my grandfather pretty well but I was too young to ask too many questions. Too late now. My grandmother from Ukraine (Podolia) didn't speak much Hebrew, mostly Yiddish, so conversation was limited. Now I have a lot of questions I would have asked her. Perception of poland in Israel: I have to say it's not the first topic on the agenda here. While most high school kids go on a trip to Poland in grade 11 or 12, theyr perspective is very limited because they are going to see historic poland from a jewish perspective not modern poland. As a modern country, poland is not more relevant to them than Portugal or Canada. There's a Poland-Israel cultural event going on this year, but i don't know of anyone who actually knows about it.

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Edited by: SeanBM Jun 7, 09, 17:55 / #
yehudi: most high school kids go on a trip to Poland in grade 11 or 12 I never knew that, I mean I have seen groups of young Jewish tourists around Krakow but I did not know that it was most kids who came here. yehudi: going to see historic poland from a jewish perspective not modern poland. I have to say for myself personally I did it the other way round. I wanted to see modern Poland and only now am I looking into it's deep and sometimes very dark history. I still have never been to Auschwitz, for example. I have been to other such horrendous places in other countries but not here, not yet. yehudi: There's a Poland-Israel cultural event going on this year, You must let us know if you go.

inkrakow	Jun 7, 09, 18:10 / #
MJL: The secondary reason is to make some connection (cultural, historical, etc) with the Poland my people emigrated from. The Jewish Community Centre in Kazimierz has a Shabbat night dinner every Friday to which all are welcome, Jewish or not. It's a good place to make a connection with Jewish life in Krakow today and to meet some people who remember WW2.

ukpolskaThreads: 51 Posts: 2,159 Joined: Oct 23, 06 MEMBER	Jun 15, 09, 14:36 / #
If you contact me when you come to Lublin I will be happy to show you around Majdanek. My wife's Grandmother was in there and I have a lot of personal stories from that place and I have been there many times showing my English family around when they come over.

MJLThreads: 1 Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 7, 09	Jun 18, 09, 18:27 / #
I am in Schwerin, Germany at the moment fulfilling a fellowship to the German government. I shall be in Poland in late June or early July. I still dont have a place to stay in Krakow and Lublin and would love to hear suggestions. Thanks SO much to all the warm people here who have helped me. I am thinking about going to the Jewish fest in Krakow. Worth going to § I will try to check in here again but email is really hard for me to get to.

BzibziohThreads: 6 Posts: 3,648 Joined: Oct 15, 08	Jun 19, 09, 00:25 / #
inkrakow: The Jewish Community Centre in Kazimierz has a Shabbat night dinner every Friday to which all are welcome, Jewish or not. It's a good place to make a connection with Jewish life in Krakow today and to meet some people who remember WW2. Also synagogue Remuh on Szeroka street - which is working synagogue, not a museum - is a good starting point; there are 111 Jews registered there as worshipers (at least last time I was visiting there).

yehudiThreads: 1 Posts: 816 Joined: Jul 27, 08	Jun 19, 09, 11:57 / #
Bzibzioh: Also synagogue Remuh on Szeroka street I second that. I prayed there on my visit and it's very moving to see it come back to life. I would recommend the Eden Hotel which is around the corner from there.

MJLThreads: 1 Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 7, 09	Jun 28, 09, 02:15 / #
Well, I'm in Krakow. I got a room at the Campanile Hotel via the internet and spent an embaressing 4 or more hours looking for the place. I finally got a cop to show me the way....that is another story. I am staying through Sunday and maybe Monday to see the camps and a bit of the old town. The trip into Poland was very interesting but more on THAT later when I write up my thoughts. Any good cheap ( I am a broke teacher) places to eat around my hotel that come recommended?

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,647 Joined: Mar 10, 08	Jun 28, 09, 12:11 / #
Hello MJL, For info on the Jewish cultural festival Click here. I don't know where your hotel is, so I don't know where there are cheap places to eat. If you are still around on the 2nd of July can help you get around. Best regards,

BzibziohThreads: 6 Posts: 3,648 Joined: Oct 15, 08	Jul 1, 09, 22:41 / #
MJL: Any good cheap ( I am a broke teacher) places to eat around my hotel that come recommended? Always look for "BAR MLECZNY" when in need of cheap food in Poland.