Poland's going forward while Britain is still trying to wake up

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Jul 9, 10, 13:50 #1

Poland never fell into recession.
Small businesses pay 19% tax.
There is a social net, but no social bd for people to lie in, like in the UK.

True, loads of work for the next few Polish govts to do but there is general agreement between the parties on overall policy.

Poles can build their own houses - Brits can't, because of planning restrictions and the stranglehold the big construction boys have (gained partly through corruption). So Poles with houses live much better than their British counterparts with their poxy rotten teeny-weeny wooden windows, stinking carpeted floors and creaking floorboards.

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Edited by: delphiandomine Jul 9, 10, 14:13 #2

Varsovian:

but there is general agreement between the parties on overall policy.

Still posting nonsense, are we?

I'd say the fact that PO wants to dismantle the welfare state in Poland while PiS and the SLD want to keep it is a rather large fundamental difference.

Varsovian:

Poles can build their own houses - Brits can't, because of planning restrictions

Meanwhile, Poles see their house flooded because they bought cheap flood plain land - and now they want the Government to bail them out because they couldn't afford insurance. Komorowski's already pointed out how terrible the uncontrolled development is in Poland.

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Jul 9, 10, 14:24 #3

OK, let's throw a fair percentage of the unemployed from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia into Poland (all EU). The Baltic brethren! :) Now for some stats. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_unemployment_rate, they almost average 20%. Poland is a bigger country by 3 times than GB. So, let's pave the way for 3 million to come :) Where would Poland be then?

Oh, Tusk and Kommie are looking to cast Poland's net out wider so why not throw some Zimbabweans (90% unemployed) and some Turkmenistan (70% unemployed) folk into the mix? Poland could use some refugees :)

Poland attracted FOREIGN investment, Varsovian. Without that money and EU funds, Poles would be haggling like mad-hatters at markets to keep their economy ticking over ;) ;)

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Jul 9, 10, 15:07 #4

Foreign investment is good - shame it's leaving the UK ... as she sinks under her debt burden.

I hear the ConDems are having problems selling their policy to INCREASE the National Debt by ONLY GBP 470 billion over the next 4 years. Ha ha ha - and Brits kept on lining up for more of the same from Bliar/Brown. What berks!!

And as for Poland - go there to see some real nice houses - they've sprouted everywhere. As for flooding, at least it wasn't deliberately caused - as it was in Cumbria recently. But you wouldn't know that, would you? Information is so well CENSORED in the UK it makes me laugh.

time meansThreads: 9 Posts: 2,306 Joined: Apr 21, 08 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 15:11 #5
Varsovian: it makes me laugh. As you do me :-) Thanks by the way. Life can sometimes be tough but if a fcuktard like yourself can bimble away through it then there is hope for us all. I look forward to more of your inane ramblings.

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Jul 9, 10, 15:11 #6

People don't elect shadow governments, Vars, they elect governments. Much of what went on behind-the-scenes was not controlled by Blair or Brown.

Censorship is again desirable amongst the paranoid. It was a Rockefeller who said that the internet is one of the most damning things out there but, then again, he would say that.

Britain is a prime target for the plans of the few. Poland will be too and the process is already underway with PO at the helm. After Smolensk, you saw Belka replace Skrzypek. That will manifest itself soon enough. Poland will be caught out in due course!

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Jul 9, 10, 15:17 #7

Varsovian:

Poland never fell into recession

Nope, because it was never on top of things anyway :) Without having been at the top, you cannot fall back, eh?

But anyway, this is yet another nonsense thread - what's the purpose of this thread? When PL joined the EU, there were some towns in the East of PL that didn't even have a sewage system yet. So what the heck are we talking about anyway.

I'm getting tired of all those "let's put the UK down and all the rest of the West for that matter". If the West is such a shytty hole that's going down, why do so many Poles come here to work? I really hate ungrateful b*stards like that: they come here to grab the money and look down upon the countries that gave them a chance to outgrow the shythole they came from and build sth of a decent future. A future they would not have had if they'd stay where they were.

>^..^<

M-G (thank God most Poles don't think like that)

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Jul 9, 10, 15:18 #8

Brown and Blair engineered the debt mountain on purpose. and they rode the tide of euphoria as everyone signed up to it. Thankfully, Poles are more circumspect about personal debt and here PFI is on the public books.

Oh and Platforma didn't sign up to the "stimulus" fallacy - one of their best moves ever. They're not my favourite people sometimes (and I dislike PiS too) but occasionally they get thiongs right ...

MareGaeaThreads: 45 Posts: 5,527 Joined: Feb 6, 08 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 15:22 #9
Oh, and btw: IF PL is going forward, then it's mainly due to the input they get from the EU AND the ppl who bring home the pay they earned in the West. :) Without the West you would be nowhere :))) A little more gratuity would be in place. >^..^< M-G (haec hactenus)

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Jul 9, 10, 15:28 #10

MareGaea:

that gave them a chance to outgrow the shythole they came from

I for one did not come to the UK to outgrow any shytholes, I was perfectly happy in Poland, but because I couldn't visit the UK as an English Studies graduate, and I had fallen for British propaganda about how wonderful the UK was (I mean culture, architecture, music, art, literature, the people as such), I understandably wanted to check it out for myself. Several years and many disappointments later, I can only say the UK is just another country. Nothing to write home about, most of the time. I wouldn't call it a shythole (yet), but it's getting there. Hopefully your new government will be able to rescue at least something along the way.

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Jul 9, 10, 15:29 #11

Varsovian:

And as for Poland - go there to see some real nice houses - they've sprouted everywhere.

By "nice", you mean "terribly tacky and garish", not subject to any planning laws whatsoever, right? I mean, for a country that relies so much on her natural beauty, letting people build whatever they want, where they want is definitely the way forward, isn't it?

Varsovian:

Information is so well CENSORED in the UK it makes me laugh.

What, like your own country that threatens people with prison terms for making fun of the President? At least in the UK, you're free to call the Prime Minister whatever the hell you want.

MagdalenaThreads: 5 Posts: 1,389 Joined: Aug 15, 07 ♀	Jul 9, 10, 15:31 #12
delphiandomine: By "nice", you mean "terribly tacky and garish", You're so defensive it's almost touching.

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Edited by: enkidu Jul 9, 10, 15:35 #13

MareGaea:

When PL joined the EU, there were some towns in the East of PL that didn't even have a sewage system yet.

Exactly! But at least Poles are slowly accustomed with the idea of the toilet paper. I also heard that a soap poisoning levels caused by attempts to eat it are in the sharp drop.

The average household in Poland is equiped with one of these:

Here is a mobile toilet in Polish style. Please note evil smile on its face.

Traditional Polish sign for the toilet is not "WC" but:

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Edited by: MareGaea Jul 9, 10, 15:38 #14

Magdalena:

I for one did not come to the UK to outgrow any shytholes, I was perfectly happy in Poland, but because I couldn't visit the UK as an English Studies graduate, and I had fallen for British propaganda about how wonderful the UK was (I mean culture, architecture, music, art, literature, the people as such), I understandably wanted to check it out for myself. Several years and many disappointments later, I can only say the UK is just another country. Nothing to write home about, most of the time. I wouldn't call it a shythole (yet), but it's getting there. Hopefully your new government will be able to rescue at least something along the way.

Why understandably you wanted to go to the UK to check things out? I read also about how great things are in certain countries, yet I don't feel the need to go there, except for hols, as I am perfectly happy where I am now. If you were so perfectly happy in PL, why feel the need to go somewhere else? And besides, even New York city will seem like just another city after you lived there for a couple of years.

But that wasn't the point. The point was that many Poles indeed come to the UK or any other country to simply make money, which a lot of them then take home to buy a house or whatever. It's ok if they want to do that, I have nothing against that, but it pysses me off when the next thing you hear them say is that the West is such a shytehole and that PL is the greatest, most glorious country in the world, lightyears ahead of the West. That's very ungrateful. And that was the point I made.

enkidu:

Exactly! But at least Poles are slowly accustomed with the idea of the toilet paper. I also heard that a soap poisoning levels caused by attempts to eat it are in the sharp drop.

You didn't get it, didn't you?

>^..^<

M-G (haec hactenus)

enkiduThreads: 18 Posts: 983 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 15:44 #15
MareGaea: (...) MareGaea - is that you? The everyone-equal-everyone-free person, suddenly call a certain people a bastards and their country a shithole and asked them to shut up and show gratitude? Shock. What about your social sensivity?

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Jul 9, 10, 15:46 #16

enkidu:

MareGaea - is that you? The everyone-equal-everyone-free person, suddenly call a certain people a bastards and their country a shithole and asked them to shut up and show gratitude? Shock. What about your social sensivity?

What does me being annoyed by ppl complaining and putting down the country that made it pssble for them to earn some decent money have to do with my opinion that everybody is equal?

>^..^<

M-G (has nothing to do with one and another)

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Edited by: enkidu Jul 9, 10, 15:46 #17

MareGaea:

enkidu:
Exactly! But at least Poles are slowly accustomed with the idea of the toilet paper. I also heard that a soap poisoning levels caused by attempts to eat it are in the sharp drop.

You didn't get it, didn't you?

Nah I am still trying, but I just can't help it. Its like a addiction. The soap i sooo tasty.
But I'm working on it.

MareGaea:

country that made it pssble for them to earn some decent money

First there is this cry: "Aaaa all they want is money! They are doing it only for money! How shameful!"
And now you want the Poles to shut up. Because they earn a good money.

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Jul 9, 10, 15:51 #18

MareGaea:

Why understandably you wanted to go to the UK to check things out?

Because I am an English translator / interpreter? Because I thought it would be nice to have a look at the country whose language and culture I had been studying for so many years? Because I am an educated human being endowed with the capacity to feel curiosity about places I had read about, but not seen?

MareGaea:

that the West is such a shytehole and that PL is the greatest, most glorious country in the world, lightyears ahead of the West

Sadly, most of them first go West convinced of the absolute opposite. If it only takes a short stay abroad for them to turn round and start praising Poland, I would say this means that the West is indeed sorely over-advertised.

MareGaea:

That's very ungrateful.

Nobody is going to thank you for the mere possibility of living in your precious country. I don't see any of our Polish-based PF members grovelling on their knees and thanking Poland for letting them stay. On the contrary, they are also often sharply critical of Poland, and when this offends someone, they say that criticism should be welcome as it helps Poland improve.

Therefore, Polish criticism of the UK should be taken as seriously. Most of the time we do have a point.

wildroverThreads: 180 Posts: 8,188 Joined: Jun 7, 07 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 15:53 #19
My Polish farm has a toilet like the ones in the picture...but not as nice...!

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Jul 9, 10, 15:58 #20

MareGaea:

IF PL is going forward, then it's mainly due to the input they get from the EU AND the ppl who bring home the pay they earned in the West. :) Without the West you would be nowhere :))) A little more gratuity would be in place.

If Poland wouldnt go into EU it would be either ok. Wouldnt have to change regulations and laws into ones which are not always good. Now we have to obey EU regulations.
To get money from EU a petitioner have to fulfill somethimes really absurd demands. Whithin few years the money will stop go to Poland and we will have to pay much more money into EU. Im not sure if we will more in plus or in red in the overall balance...

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Edited by: MareGaea Jul 9, 10, 16:11 #21

Magdalena:

If it only takes a short stay abroad for them to turn round and start praising Poland, I would say this means that the West is indeed sorely over-advertised.

Over advertised? You are aware that in Polish job-agencies UK and Ireland are praised for being the places where you can find work, right? I don't know who has put those ads there, perhaps the Polish authorities in this field, perhaps the British or Irish, but fact is that most countries in the EU knew what was going to happen when Poland would join the EU and all closed their borders, except for the UK, Sweden and Ireland. They were the only countries you could go to as a Pole back then. So frankly, I don't buy that argument that you went there out of educational or cultural deliberations. It was the only country you COULD go to back then, there were besides IRL and SE.

David_18:

Go to school fool...

Seeing the way you write, I would suggest you do the same :)

Magdalena:

The initial discussion was PL versus the UK

As are nearly all the threads. Like the UK is the only country with masses of Poles within her borders. And besides that, the principle remains the same.

>^..^<

M-G (and yes, I am not English)

szarlotkaThreads: 14 Posts: 3,349 Joined: Feb 20, 07 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 16:13 #22
Varsovian: So Poles with houses live much better than their British counterparts with their poxy rotten teeny-weeny wooden windows, stinking carpeted floors and creaking floorboards. You must come round for tea one day - you might change your mind.

time meansThreads: 9 Posts: 2,306 Joined: Apr 21, 08 ♂	Jul 9, 10, 16:16 #23
Magdalena: My mistake I bet that wasn't easy for you :-) Say it again only a bit louder please :-)))

MagdalenaThreads: 5 Posts: 1,389 Joined: Aug 15, 07 ♀	Jul 9, 10, 16:17 #24
MareGaea: I am tired of ppl who think it's ok to criticize the hell out of another country, but don't you dare say sth about Poland. My thoughts exactly, just substitute "UK" for Poland and we're good to go. We either both have the right to criticise other countries, or no right at all. I refuse to lick your boots just because you feel superior.

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Jul 9, 10, 16:21 #25

MareGaea:

You must be very tired of yourself, then :)

No, i can be very critical about some issues in Poland. But the way you talk about that Poland owes "West" something is purely retarded.

Poland worked really hard the past 20 years and is still catching up. UK had it relatively easy to build up her economy after the ww2 with billions comming from the US, while Poland had to struggle with the commies.

time meansThreads: 9 Posts: 2,306 Joined: Apr 21, 08 ♂	Edited by: time means Jul 9, 10, 16:22 #26
David_18: the ww2 with billions comming from the US Lol you haven't got a clue have you. Do some research fool.

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Jul 9, 10, 16:23 #27

Magdalena:

I refuse to lick your boots just because you feel superior.

Where do I state that I feel superior? I only vent my annoyance by that constant nagging about what a shytehole the UK is, how they pale in comparison with the Motherland, how low and intolerable the British virtues are, compared to the Polish ones. That's all.

Besides, it's an easy argument you're using now. Any critisism on Poles criticizing the UK or any Western country for that matter is being dealt with that the person in particular must feel superior to Poles. Too easy and nonsensical.

>^..^<

M-G (If I don't like it somewhere, I leave)

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Edited by: Magdalena Jul 9, 10, 16:24 #28

MareGaea:

Where do I state that I feel superior?

You told me where I come from. You told me that I should be grateful. Superior enough for me.

MareGaea:

Any critisism on Poles criticizing the UK or any Western country for that matter is being dealt with that the person in particular must feel superior to Poles

I did not say that.

time means:

I don't think he said you specifically and if he did it still has nothing to do with the UK.

Of course not. He just said something nasty about the Polish nation in general, nothing to get worked up about personally.
And about it having to do with the UK:

MareGaea:

I only vent my annoyance by that constant nagging about what a shytehole the UK is, how they pale in comparison with the Motherland, how low and intolerable the British virtues are, compared to the Polish ones. That's all.

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Edited by: szarlotka Jul 9, 10, 16:35 #29

MareGaea:

and now I don't wanna hear anything about it anymore

I don't wanna discuss it - what a marvellous lyric from Cream, from the days when we had art, culture and music before we descended into the primeval depths of depravity, poverty, shoddy windows and smelly carpets.

Can some of us get real and recognise that all countries have good and bad. There is no Nirvana and any compariosn will be coloured by the experiences of the individual concerned. If people were to preface their comments with 'in my experience' and elucidate what that was' instead of generalising either unintentionally or by deliberately flaming the thread then I promise I will stop making one line snidey replies - such as who is the Polish Eric Clapton (last one promise)

Have a good weekend everyone and if you are in the UK don't forget the sunblock.

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Jul 9, 10, 16:37 #30

MareGaea:

I am tired of ppl who think it's ok to criticize the hell out of another country, but don't you dare say sth about Poland.

I think that this is fair to criticise. And its fair to discuss this.
What is not fair? Obviously on this forum only to criticise Poland is allowed.

I live in the UK. And I kind of like this country. Well - maybe I even starting to consider is as my home. But I am not going to pretend that everything is perfect here. Because it isn't.

And I wont shut up simply because I have got some £ in my pocket. This would be dishonest.
But my criticism is mild. I wouldn't go that far as calling someone else's country a "Shithole". What I am talking about is exactly what you can hear in the local pub among the English gentlemen. Well - sometimes they even talking a worse things.
I am not talking anything new. Anything unusual.

So why my remarks are met with a hysteric reactions from some of you for most of the time?
Because I am Polish. I shall count a pounds in my pocket and shut up. I shall show "gratitude", bow all the time and not express my views. The freedom of speech and liberties are not good enough for us - sub humans. The only thing you expect to hear from us is "Yes, master" or "No, master". The second one - only in theory.
The Old Empire still exist.

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