$3,000-$4,000 a month - would we have enough money to live?

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Jan 12, 11, 22:31 #1

I am American And Wife is Polish. We have been married for 11 years and have a beautiful son (Lukas) who is six. My Son Speaks English as well as Polish (even translates for me when we visit. Currently we live in Highlands Ranch, Co and have our own business. Our business is one that we could still run from anywhere in the world.

Ok so now for the problem I need help with. My wife's parents are getting very old and her father's health is going down. Even though she has 2 brothers the in the same city as her parents, (Gdynia) She wants us to put all of our stuff in storage and move to Gdynia for a year or two. I speak VERY little Polish and my wife is worried that I would not like it (to live) in Poland being that I was raised in the USA and being 43 that I am set in my ways. She tells me that Poland is VERY different (even though I have been there 3 times to visit. Like I said we have our own business and would have (varies) between $ 3000.00 and 4000.00 Dollars a month in income. We also have 2 other businesses that we would have to give up. Sooooo Is it really that different ? Do you think I could make it (as a 43 year old Man(and kinda set in my ways)) Would we have enough money to live? Would people be less than nice to me? I would love to be able to do this for my wife and her parents and can not afford to send her and son for two years and me stay here in the US.

Anything you have to offer as far will be appreciated !

s2good2

Sorry my post was a little scattered but I have a lot going threw my head right now.

Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57 Posts: 5,470 Joined: Jul 3, 09 MEMBER ♂	Jan 12, 11, 22:44 #2
If you have to give up the income from the US businesses forget it. No chance to make money in Poland what so ever as a foreign national unless at corporate level. If you can buy a Hotel or something maybe.

cinekThreads: 1 Posts: 264 Joined: Nov 16, 07 ♂	Jan 12, 11, 22:55 #3
Dont worry at all. Gdynia is not a small village, it's a civilised place and 3000$ is more than enough to rent a flat and live at quite good level. Cinek

s2good2Threads: 1 Posts: 84 Joined: Jan 12, 11 ♂	Jan 12, 11, 23:08 #4
I would have to give up 2 of the three businesses but I keep 1 and run it from Poland I would be able to keep the one that pays the 3000.00 to 4000.00 /month

ThreegigsThreads: - Posts: 22 Joined: Apr 17, 08 ♂	Jan 12, 11, 23:54 #5
s2good2: move to Gdynia for a year or two You've got 3 months which you can stay on your passport, and within the first 45 days you'll have to apply for a residence permit or a one year visa. Have your wife give the Polish consulate nearest you a call to see what you'll need to do to be able to stay in Poland for more than 90 days.

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Jan 13, 11, 00:13 #6

Your wife is Polish and you have an income of 3000$ a month. What can be so worrisome?
You will love Poland! And don't pay attention to the "less-than-optimists" that tell you things like "no chance of making money as foreign national". There is as much opportunity in one place than another.
But I don't have to tell you this, because you already know it. You have three businesses, which means that you know the secret of money and apply it well. I congratulate you.
Just do it. Go to Poland and be with your wife that needs you more than ever. It will be good for you.
One more adventure in your life that as far as we know... It is only one and it's short.
Now... Let's cut to the chase. At least give us a tip... What is this business of yours that can be run from any part of the world?

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Edited by: warszawski Jan 13, 11, 00:22 #7

s2good2:

My wife's parents are getting very old and her father's health is going down

You don't have much option s2good2, your wife is Polish, she wants to spend time with her parents, if you hold her back your life is going to be sh1t anyway. The only issue I see here is your son and will he adjust to Polish life and schooling in Polish, because on 3,000 USD a month a private international school is out of the question. Get the Polish phrase book out...

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Edited by: s2good2 Jan 13, 11, 04:47 #8

We are Commercial Cleaning Contractors, With National Contracts for retail (most Malls) We save Sub-contractors that actually go out and do the work. All of our work is done on the phone and we have an International (works where ever) Cell, So when our contractors call (Colorado) it will ring where ever we are. We also have a 1-866-xxx-xxxx fax number, so when someone sends a fax to that number it sends it via email to us. Sub-Contractors are faxed work orders and when they complete the job they fax back the signed work order... Kinda simple huh?

My son did go to school in Poland (briefly) 5 weeks, Last time he was there. I know that is not a lot of time but he did very well at adjusting and LOVED it! Maybe just because it was only five weeks ??? do know but you bring up a great point! thank you!

Threegigs: Thank you did not know that ! Thought that since my wife was Polish and we are married I could just stay ! Good info .. Will check into that tomorrow !

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Jan 13, 11, 05:28 #9

s2good2:

Ok so now for the problem I need help with. My wife's parents are getting very old and her father's health is going down. Even though she has 2 brothers the in the same city as her parents, (Gdynia) She wants us to put all of our stuff in storage and move to Gdynia for a year or two.

Money probably isn't the problem. The problem is going to be your relationship with your wife, her relationship with her brothers, her relationship with her parents. The brothers probably don't want anything to do with the parents or don't help enough, etc., etc. It will all fall on your wife's shoulders. That's what daughters are for, looking after aged parents. Been there done that. Better off steering clear.

Marek11111Threads: 49 Posts: 1,954 Joined: Aug 6, 09 ♂	Edited by: Marek11111 Jan 13, 11, 05:38 #10
who knows maybe you can start something in Poland, I do it if I were you you only go around ones why not new adventure

skysoulmateThreads: 41 Posts: 3,039 Joined: Jan 10, 10 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 06:04 #11
s2good2 - I can't give you any advice as I moved from Poland when I was a kid. I just wanted to say that it's very admirable of you to even consider this. Moving to a different country is a major undertaking and as a man I'm impressed with your thoughtfulness. My hat is off to you.

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Edited by: Richfilth Jan 13, 11, 10:26 #12

PennBoy:

I think in 3rd grade I've had less spelling mistakes.

I had, not I've had. Past simple, not present perfect.

This forum is not the place to criticise other people's language abilities; the message is important, not the quality of spelling through which it is conveyed.

s2good2, if you've got an entrepreneurial spirit you might find a market for yourself in Poland, especially in Gdynia (which is one third of the TriCity/TroiMiasto of Gdynia, Gdansk and Sopot).

$3000 a month certainly won't give you an American standard of living, but you won't go hungry either. You'll simply be cutting down on luxury items like sports equipment, foreign holidays, nights out in fancy restaurants (if that's your kind of thing.) But if you can bring any capital over here as an investment, you mind find a niche that you can exploit.

dtaylor5632Threads: 49 Posts: 4,459 Joined: May 2, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 11:43 #13
Richfilth: $3000 a month certainly won't give you an American standard of living $3000 a month in Poland will give you quite a decent life. I know Americans in Krk who live a good life on $1000 per month.

OlafThreads: 8 Posts: 1,369 Joined: Oct 29, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 11:51 #14
alexw68: Jeez guys, enough with the OCD already. And pass me the alcoholic handwash when you're done ... Hahahahhha, good one. Yes, 3000 PLN will be enough, but if you share a flat or other expenses then it can only be better. Students however are able to survive on much smaller amount. This unique ability is lost while aging:D

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Jan 13, 11, 12:09 #15

Richfilth:

$3000 a month certainly won't give you an American standard of living, but you won't go hungry either. You'll simply be cutting down on luxury items like sports equipment, foreign holidays, nights out in fancy restaurants (if that's your kind of thing.) But if you can bring any capital over here as an investment, you mind find a niche that you can exploit.

I could never understand how people can say that for 9000 PLN a month they can't live in luxury! Man, oridinary people here can only dream about such incomes!

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 12:29 #16
puella: I could never understand how people can say that for 9000 PLN a month they can't live in luxury! Man, oridinary people here can only dream about such incomes! It all depends on what you consider luxury.

puellaThreads: 9 Posts: 319 Joined: Jan 10, 11 ♀	Edited by: puella Jan 13, 11, 12:34 #17
convex: It all depends on what you consider luxury. Ok, let's assume that Polish costs of life = American costs of life. So what would be the average American salary in PLN (approximatedly)?

OlafThreads: 8 Posts: 1,369 Joined: Oct 29, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 12:48 #18
convex: It all depends on what you consider luxury. Oh, come on! Caviar, hookers and champagne isn't that expensive!

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Edited by: warszawski Jan 13, 11, 12:58 #19

puella:

I could never understand how people can say that for 9000 PLN a month they can't live in luxury! Man, oridinary people here can only dream about such incomes!

puella, it is a family of three NOT one person.

Breakdown of costs:

Apartment/house rental - 2,500 to 3,000 PLN ( 1,000 USD)

Medical insurance - 500 PLN ( Basic package for Medicover)
Car/petrol/insurance - 1,000 PLN
Food - 2,000 PLN
Extra classes/boy - 500 PLN
Divers - 1,000 PLN

Total +/- - 8,000 PLN standard living not inc holidays.

This above figure should only be used as an indication of monthly costs/outgoings

This is a family that is used to a normal life, not someone that wishes to scrape the barrel.

puellaThreads: 9 Posts: 319 Joined: Jan 10, 11 ♀	Jan 13, 11, 13:21 #20
warszawski: Food - 2,000 PLN max. 600 PLN... 2000 PLN would be if they ate at the restaurant 2 times a week. But you're the foreigner... warszawski: Medical insurance - 500 PLN ( Basic package for Medicover) per a month? warszawski: Divers what's that?

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Edited by: warszawski Jan 13, 11, 13:34 #21

puella:

2000 PLN would be if they ate at the restaurant 2 times a week. But you're the foreigner...

Food- should really read monthly shopping/groceries costs.

puella:

max. 600 PLN...

if I lived in the countryside buying local produce only I could get by on 600 PLN, but unfortunately I live in a city.

puella:

per a month?

Yes the basic package for a family of 3 at Medicover would be about 500 PLN

puella:

what's that?

Other costs not accounted for.

puella:

But you're the foreigner...

That is correct, therefore I have first hand experience of costs that apply.

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Jan 13, 11, 13:55 #22

Thank you ALL so much for the GREAT info.. Please keep it coming !! Can you also address the living situation? From what I have seen, While visiting, The flats seem to be very small. How hard it is to adjust to the smaller living conditions? The house we living right now is about 2800 Sq ft. and the largest place I was in (when we were visiting) had basically 3 or 4 rooms. My wife grew up in a flat that had only 1 "Big room" That was the bedroom for mom and dad and two brothers. It was also the living room and the dining room. Then there was a small room (wife's bedroom) which also doubled as the playroom. A small kitchen and small bath under 800 sq ft. for 5 people. I still have a hard time believing how they did it! I am sure I can adapt just wonder how you are not on each others toes all the time. Is this the norm? or was I just introduced to the smaller places?

Again, thank you for all the info ! It is appreciated !

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 14:12 #23
s2good2: The house we living right now is about 2800 Sq ft. and the largest place I was in (when we were visiting) had basically 3 or 4 rooms. You won't be making enough to afford to rent a house. Time to get used to apartment living...it's not too hard. Just get a place over 100m2 and you'll adjust just fine, especially if you're not dragging a bunch of stuff over.

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Jan 13, 11, 14:22 #24

for between 2000-3000PLN per month you will get a three-room (so two bedrooms) apartment in Gdynia around 100-120m2 (1075-1300sq ft). Remember that on top of the rent is something Poles call "czynsz", which covers water and heating charges, and may also have something called "fundusz remontowy" (general repairs fund) included, or it might be an additional cost. On an apartment of 100m2, this can be over 500zl per month.

In Warsaw, it was common for families of four or five to be squeezed into 40m2 (430sq ft) apartments for the whole duration of Communism, and for a decade afterwards.

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Jan 13, 11, 14:23 #25

I think most people in Poland would think that you are joking if you ask if $4000 a month is enough to get by in Poland. I don't know what kind of standard of living you are used to but $4000 a month can accommodate a very high standard of living in Poland.

Sweden is much more expensive than Poland but a large number of the Swedish population get by on about 1500 zloty a month excluding aid to pay for the rent. The GDP per capita is higher in Sweden than in the United States.

Health care and medicines are subsidized in Sweden. Dental care is expensive though. The food in Poland is half as expensive as in Sweden. Public transportation in Sweden is almost four times as expensive as in Poland.

I think life in Poland will be very different from your life in the United States. Personally I think your wife has reason to worry if you will cope with the adjustment.

Gdynia is not bad though. I think Gdansk is nicer and because of the proximity to Gdansk it would be no problem for you and your family to live there. Of course, it is a matter of taste and you will have to see for yourself what city you prefer. Your wife most certainly knows the two cities better than me.

warszawskiThreads: 60 Posts: 2,386 Joined: May 21, 10 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 14:24 #26
Richfilth: In Warsaw, it was common for families of four or five to be squeezed into 40m2 (430sq ft) apartments for the whole duration of Communism, and for a decade afterwards. It was common in all cities in Poland, not just Warsaw.

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Jan 13, 11, 14:44 #27

warszawski:

It was common in all cities in Poland, not just Warsaw.

I knew it was for a lot of towns, but didn't want to speak outside my field of experience ;)

To clarify again, for $3000 you'll live fine to Polish standards, but not to American standards. Clothes, tools, holidays, fuel, kids toys, electronic equipment and services all cost more here than they do across the pond. But if you can adapt to the Polish way of thinking, you'll manage fine.

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Jan 13, 11, 16:02 #28

Richfilth:

To clarify again, for $3000 you'll live fine to Polish standards, but not to American standards. Clothes, tools, holidays, fuel, kids toys, electronic equipment and services all cost more here than they do across the pond. But if you can adapt to the Polish way of thinking, you'll manage fine.

I am American and I agree. Some people may scoff at the idea that $3000. doesn't allow for an "American" lifestyle but it is true. Having said that, you can easily adapt esp. since (as you described it) it is only temporary.

I also moved to Poland to work for an American co. for 2-3 years. It is more than 10 years later and I'm still here. I never intended to live here but each decision I made further entrenched me here (esp the Polish husband part). But I am not complaining, just talking about intensions and the effects of our decisions.

I have found that Polish women tend to be quite close to their families (But I think you got that considering your wife has brothers but she still needs to help out). I think that you both can be prepared for a lot of mixed feelings during this time about where you want to live, where is home, etc.

Good luck to you and your family

Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57 Posts: 5,470 Joined: Jul 3, 09 MEMBER ♂	Jan 13, 11, 16:28 #29
puella: warszawski: Food - 2,000 PLN max. 600 PLN... 2000 PLN would be if they ate at the restaurant 2 times a week. But you're the foreigner... Its possible but i really would struggle with that menu.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Jan 13, 11, 17:09 #30
Wroclaw Boy: Its possible but i really would struggle with that menu. My feelings too. 600zl a month for a whole family isn't much - that's 150zl a week on food, which wouldn't go a long way in PL, especially if someone's used to buying imported or ready-made stuff.

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