Yard waste burning at night - such typical behaviour

nauczyciel

Edited by: nauczyciel Jul 21, 10, 22:59 #1

so today was a balmy 33'. tonight- now it is about 28 with no wind.

a close neighbour is out in his garden at 22:30 and start doing his rubbish/yard waste burning.

On one of the hottest nights of the year, when everyone in the neighbourhood has got their windows/doors open to try & cool down.

the area looks like it is covered in a low lying thick white fog.

So typical of the "i don't give a $hit about anyone but myself" Polish attitude.

i should just call the fire department & give a rough location within 50 meters. But knowing their astute skills- (fighting brush fires with brooms & no water) they wouldn't be able to find the place. :S

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,412 Joined: Aug 29, 07 ♂	Jul 21, 10, 23:01 #2
nauczyciel: i should just call the fire just do it!

pgtxThreads: 49 Posts: 6,327 Joined: Feb 14, 09 MEMBER ♀	Edited by: pgtx Jul 21, 10, 23:02 #3
nauczyciel: i should just call the fire department & give a rough location within 50 meters. i would do that... nauczyciel: so today was a balmy 33'. tonight- now it is about 28 with no wind. a close nrighbouer is out in his garden at 22:30 and start doing his rubbish/yard waste burning. i dream about living in Poland with no neighbors around... probably in Bieszczady... ;)

nauczyciel

Aug 2, 10, 11:33 #4

i think that cities, municipalities, provinces, or even the country of Poland itself should ban outdoor burning. I guess this backwards country doesn't give a $hit about "clean air".

this same jacka$$ neighbour has been burning every day for the last 5.

Friday & Sat & Sun starting about 17, just when ppl are enjoying a backyard grill, and have their home windows open to let out the heat.

He, along with a few others, are at it again today. Its muggy & no wind. The rain has just started so now the smoke is sitting about 3-50 meters off the ground and encompassing the whole area.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Aug 2, 10, 11:37 #5
nauczyciel: I guess this backwards country doesn't give a $hit about "clean air". There are quite strict laws in PL about smoke in built-up areas - depends which part of the country. One problem is that in some areas householders actually have to pay themselves for rubbish collection!! So people short of money burn their rubbish instead.

MagdalenaThreads: 5 Posts: 1,389 Joined: Aug 15, 07 ♀	Aug 2, 10, 12:35 #6
nauczyciel: He, along with a few others, are at it again today. Well, report it then! Moaning about it on PF won't change a thing!

♂

Edited by: enkidu Aug 2, 10, 12:59 #7

jonni:

One problem is that in some areas householders actually have to pay themselves for rubbish collection!!

exsme, but what so special about this? I mean - rubbish collection is a kind of service, so what so strange that if its been paid for?

nauczyciel:

i should just call the fire department & give a rough location within 50 meters. But knowing their astute skills- (fighting brush fires with brooms & no water) they wouldn't be able to find the place. :S

You shall go and talk to him like a man. Who knows - maybe you finally earn some respect that way?

nauczyciel:

I guess this backwards country doesn't give a $hit about "clean air".

If you don't like it - go back where you came from.

♂

Edited by: jonni Aug 2, 10, 13:11 #8

enkidu:

exsme, but what so special about this? I mean - rubbish collection is a kind of service, so what so strange that if its been paid for?

In most of Europe it's covered by local taxes, community charge etc - rubbish (and specifically its disposal) in built-up areas is a public health/nuisance matter concerning everyone, and not something you can just opt into or out of as your fancy (or income) takes you.

enkidu:

If you don't like it - go back where you came from.

Do you say the same to Poles living outside PL who comment on what's going on around them?

♂

Edited by: peterweg Aug 2, 10, 13:21 #9

jonni:

One problem is that in some areas householders actually have to pay themselves for rubbish collection!! So people short of money burn their rubbish instead.

Don't you have to prove that you pay for rubbish removal? my father-in-law was prosecuted for burning rubbish and he lives 1km from the neighbours. Failure to account for rubbish removal was the evidence, the fine was big, 1000zl or more.

We were forced to pay for rubbish removal at our farm house, even though we are still waiting 9months later for the first collection.

frdThreads: 8 Posts: 1,956 Joined: Feb 3, 09 ♂	Aug 2, 10, 13:24 #10
Just because you are unlucky to have such a neighbour it doesn't mean it's a standard for all Poland. Haven't seen any garbage burning anywhere in Poland for years. Not informing the authorities is being not right in the head.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Aug 2, 10, 13:30 #11
peterweg: Don't you have to prove that you pay for rubbish removal? In most places in Poland, yes, but a few people get round it omehow - also there are issues of how much rubbish a household generates etc. My heart sinks when I'm in a beautiful forest and find piles of vodka bottles, food tins etc. Poland is lucky to have such places - it would be sad if increased consumption spoilt them.

peterwegThreads: 35 Posts: 1,989 Joined: Feb 16, 07 ♂	Aug 2, 10, 13:41 #12
Its EU law, I find it highly unlikely burning rubbish is legal. Complain to the police, the council. A fine of several thousand Zloty's will stop them. Failing that, put the fire out yourself with water.

♂

Aug 2, 10, 13:44 #13

jonni:

In most of Europe it's covered by local taxes, community charge etc - rubbish (and specifically its disposal) in built-up areas is a public health/nuisance matter concerning everyone, and not something you can just opt into or out of as your fancy (or income) takes you.

Well - I pay about £100 per month in local taxes but my rubbish is rarely collected. And I can't do anything about it. I think I would prefered a Polish way where it is service like any other. In my home town in Poland there are a few companies dealing in this business. If one is unhappy with service or price, he can easily switch.
I understand your argument about public health. So - what about a water supply? Obviously - it's a matter of public health too. Why it is not covered by taxes?

jonni:

Do you say the same to Poles living outside PL who comment on what's going on around them?

I would say it to anyone who would call his new home country a "backward" on the basis of simple example of just one moron who are not follows the laws.

peterwegThreads: 35 Posts: 1,989 Joined: Feb 16, 07 ♂	Aug 2, 10, 14:03 #14
jonni: In most places in Poland, yes, but a few people get round it omehow - also there are issues of how much rubbish a household generates etc. No, they don't get round it, they are breaking the law. My father-in-law is the head of the local council, but he still got a very large fine for burning rubbish.

nauczyciel

Aug 2, 10, 20:08 #15

enkidu:

I would say it to anyone who would call his new home country a "backward" on the basis of simple example of just one moron who are not follows the laws.

well...
- Are you a native of PL?

- Have you opened a business in PL and dealt with other businesses trying to scam you any way they can?

- Have you ever dealt with government offices that ask you to keep producing the same documents even though they have seen them 4 times & made copies?

- Do you have to deal with immigration every year to live here and keep having to supply them with documents with impossible deadlines only to risk having your application declined and have to start again?

- Have you employees that are lazy and can't seem to do such simple jobs forcing you to have to find replacements every month?

- Ever tried to register a car in PL? It is a 2-3 day affair if you are lucky enough to get a "ticket" to see the clerks for any given day . Where I lived in Canada it was 30 minutes for registration & insurance and they did it in the dealership, & you can drive away with no hassles. 24/7.

- stamps & quadruplicate copies for everything.

♂

Edited by: enkidu Aug 2, 10, 20:53 #16

nauczyciel:

well...
- Are you a native of PL?

- Have you opened a business in PL and dealt with other businesses trying to scam you any way they can?

- Have you ever dealt with government offices that ask you to keep producing the same documents even though they have seen them 4 times & made copies?

- Do you have to deal with immigration every year to live here and keep having to supply them with documents with impossible deadlines only to risk having your application declined and have to start again?

- Have you employees that are lazy and can't seem to do such simple jobs forcing you to have to find replacements every month?

- Ever tried to register a car in PL? It is a 2-3 day affair if you are lucky enough to get a "ticket" to see the clerks for any given day . Where I lived in Canada it was 30 minutes for registration & insurance and they did it in the dealership, & you can drive away with no hassles. 24/7.

- stamps & quadruplicate copies for everything.

Except point no 4 - YES I did/am.

And once more. Man - if you are so unhappy and frustrated - go back where you belong. Don't stay in place that makes you so bitter. Pursue your happiness!
It's your right.

But don't call other people's Country a nasty names. They are live as they pleased. It's their right, dammit.

♂

Aug 2, 10, 21:14 #17

enkidu:

I pay about £100 per month in local taxes but my rubbish is rarely collected.

You should complain - your local councillor's surgery is a good place to go - it usually has a bit more effect than a letter or phoning and being put on hold. They're supposed to collect weekly. In some areas you have to separate waste and put the bins out though.

enkidu:

So - what about a water supply? Obviously - it's a matter of public health too. Why it is not covered by taxes?

In the UK it used to be - people paid water rates on the same financial basis as their local tax. The system of delivery was privatised, though as far as I know, policy about water supply is still a state matter.

peterweg:

No, they don't get round it, they are breaking the law. My father-in-law is the head of the local council, but he still got a very large fine for burning rubbish.

Only if a/ someone sees them, b/ someone reports them and c/ if there is proof.

♂

Aug 4, 10, 16:10 #18

jonni:

You should complain - your local councillor's surgery is a good place to go - it usually has a bit more effect than a letter or phoning and being put on hold. They're supposed to collect weekly. In some areas you have to separate waste and put the bins out though.

Yep. I know I can complain. I just prefer the Polish way. I find it a little humiliating to beg for service that already has been paid for. On the whole - I find it rather funny the idea that the government is supposed to take care of my household waste.

jonni:

In the UK it used to be - people paid water rates on the same financial basis as their local tax. The system of delivery was privatised, though as far as I know, policy about water supply is still a state matter.

Gee... And some people here on PF were outraged when I said that the UK is more communist country then People's Republic of Poland ever been.

♀

Aug 4, 10, 16:21 #19

nauczyciel:

so today was a balmy 33'. tonight- now it is about 28 with no wind.

a close neighbour is out in his garden at 22:30 and start doing his rubbish/yard waste burning.

On one of the hottest nights of the year, when everyone in the neighbourhood has got their windows/doors open to try & cool down.

the area looks like it is covered in a low lying thick white fog.

So typical of the "i don't give a $hit about anyone but myself" Polish attitude.

i should just call the fire department & give a rough location within 50 meters. But knowing their astute skills- (fighting brush fires with brooms & no water) they wouldn't be able to find the place. :S

You think that's a Polish attitude? Before they moved, I had neighbors that barbequed on days with 45 mph wind and a burn ban. Another neighbor was burning **** in his yard and that's not even legal where I live under any circumstances! It was like, so scary, I was waiting for my house to catch fire.

♀

Aug 4, 10, 17:59 #20

enkidu:

Well - I pay about £100 per month in local taxes but my rubbish is rarely collected. And I can't do anything about it

I suggest you check what your council tax covers, it's not just the rubbish you generate so £100 is not just for rubbish collection - you have every right to complain about not having your bins emptied (you are paying for a service) - ALL of mine are done EVERY week without fail, so I have no idea what kind of place you live.

jonni:

You should complain - your local councillor's surgery is a good place to go - it usually has a bit more effect than a letter or phoning and being put on hold. They're supposed to collect weekly. In some areas you have to separate waste and put the bins out though.

This would be the logical thing to do, although he evidently thinks complaining on a forum will do something ;0)

enkidu:

Yep. I know I can complain. I just prefer the Polish way. I find it a little humiliating to beg for service that already has been paid for. On the whole - I find it rather funny the idea that the government is supposed to take care of my household waste.

What's the Poilsh way? What's humiliating about demanding a service what you pay for? Oh and its the not goverment who are doing anything, its your local council, they have their own budgets, it's them who you pay your money to, not to the government, but you thinking it was the government was definately a funny idea!

enkidu:

Gee... And some people here on PF were outraged when I said that the UK is more communist country then People's Republic of Poland ever been.

UK communist? Just because we had state owned companies, that doesnt make us communist.

jonni:

In the UK it used to be - people paid water rates on the same financial basis as their local tax. The system of delivery was privatised, though as far as I know, policy about water supply is still a state matter.

You mean the ratable value of a property determined the cost of rates and water rates in tandum? Not always the case though Jonni - it was slightly more complicated.

As for water being a state matter...oh no its not:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Utilities

♂

Aug 4, 10, 19:01 #21

Amathyst:

I suggest you check what your council tax covers, it's not just the rubbish you generate so £100 is not just for rubbish collection - you have every right to complain about not having your bins emptied (you are paying for a service)

Yeah I know that the council tax covers much more. But the only service I use is waste removal. From my point of view I pay hefty money for poor service. And I have got no other option than complain.

Amathyst:

What's the Poilsh way? What's humiliating about demanding a service what you pay for?

Exactly that. I find it humiliating the need to complain, writing letters, making phone calls and enquires (wasting my precious time in short) only to get what I paid for. I would gladly change the service provider instead. We were learned that this is what makes difference between communism and capitalism. Freedom of choice and "invisible hand of the market", you know.

Amathyst:

Oh and its the not goverment who are doing anything, its your local council, they have their own budgets, it's them who you pay your money to, not to the government, but you thinking it was the government was definately a funny idea!

Central government or local governing body - It still a bunch of bureaucrats, isn't it? In Polish: the Władza.

Amathyst:

UK communist? Just because we had state owned companies, that doesnt make us communist.

Nay. I meant the communism on the lowest level. Government intervention in almost every aspect of private live of the citizens. Like - waste removal for example. Do you know that they are installing electronic chips in the bins? And sometimes they are checking what kind of rubbish do you produce. Come on. This level of spying was unimaginable in the old communists Poland.

BTW - the problem with my household waste is more complicated. First - I live in the borough where waste segregation is obligatory.
But some time ago the price of recyclable materials are dropped and our council ceased to collect it. But they didn't change the law. I still suppose to segregate my rubbish or face a fine. I complained about it but they said they can't do anything about it. (Well at least any time soon)
Then the global prices went up again and the council resume collections.
But they did not collect mine. Why this time?
Because of Health and Safety regulations the binmen was not allowed to bend his back and take from the ground heavy box with neatly segregated paper (or glass, cans, plastic) without something called "Risk assessment".

What can I do?
There are a few options:
- I can wait for the truck and put these bloody containers myself. (not sure if that allowed)
- I can drop the recyclables to the common bin and face the risk of a fine.
- I can bribe the binmen.
- I can burn it in the backyard (ILLEGAL!!!)

None of this options are seems good. I would prefer to pay somebody else £100 per month and get rid of this bloody containers. But I can't do it. And this is exactly this point where memories from the old communists Poland comes to mind.

Of course - my front yard doesn't look very nice at this moment thanks to this waste. But my council has got a solution! They have got a special car (Smart btw) with the huge camera on the roof. They are making photos. I think they are going to prosecute me.
That is what I call bloody communist attitude.

♂

Edited by: peterweg Aug 4, 10, 19:35 #22

enkidu:

Gee... And some people here on PF were outraged when I said that the UK is more communist country then People's Republic of Poland ever been.

Hell, you should see the USA, the entire banking and mortgage system is socialist. Water supply is in many case's public-ally owned, unlike the UK where all water companies are private businesses.

They like to claim the same about the health system under Osama, however its basically a private system with government rules tacked on

Yeah I know that the council tax covers much more. But the only service I use is waste removal. From my point of view I pay hefty money for poor service. And I have got no other option than complain.

You don't walk the streets at night (street lighting), call the police, fire brigade, use public parks or any of their services? I find that unlikely. Most of it is spend on education for children, so get breeding.

PlasticPoleThreads: 10 Posts: 5,429 Joined: May 28, 09 ♀	Aug 4, 10, 19:57 #23
peterweg: Hell, you should see the USA, the entire banking and mortgage system is socialist. US has always been a socialist nation with tinges of capitalism.

nauczyciel	Aug 6, 10, 19:22 #24
peterweg: They like to claim the same about the health system under Osama, however its basically a private system with government rules tacked on yup.. there it is!! Proof that Osama is controlling the USA!! Finally!!

♂

Aug 6, 10, 20:41 #25

Unfortunately, Poles think they save money by burning rubbish instead of having them taken away.
They don`t realise they lose much more money on dealing with their health problems caused by burning later on. Poland is the country with the highest cancer rate in Europe. Why?

The camping site owner, after the season ended, burnt this rubbish: cardboard, plastic and panels, ignoring the fact the smoke drifted onto his summer house and his family.

]

enkiduThreads: 18 Posts: 983 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Aug 8, 10, 03:12 #26
Amathyst where are you? Don't you want enlighten me (poor immigrant) about the ways I shall take to solve my problem with my council? You were so wise. And suddenly, You become so quiet. Why? Pawian - do you really believe that burning paper and wood pose any health risk? Come on.

♀

Aug 8, 10, 04:21 #27

nauczyciel:

yup.

I dont blame you.. if you have any animal crap in the yard, I would pile it close to his

window and light it up right around supper time on a good hot and muggy day and
ask him if he has any other garbage he would like to donate to your can this way
he doesnt have to do it .. yeah make sure its in close prox of his kitchen window.
return the neighborly favor. its the least you can do ..

right now we have our neighbors dog who is small, she likes our dog and our yard
and she sneaks under the fence daily to take her craps. Well I would never throw
poop over the fence, but since we have discussed it with them and nothings been
done except a couple of chuckles, we have added our dogs to the over the fence
exchange program. his is much more formed and larger in size.

hague1cmaeronThreads: 21 Posts: 1,650 Joined: Mar 30, 10 ♂	Aug 8, 10, 04:27 #28
nauczyciel: should just call the fire department & give a rough location within 50 meters. But knowing their astute skills- (fighting brush fires with brooms & no water) they wouldn't be able to find the place. :S I agree do it, it will teach them a lesson for next time, I know i would.

♂

Aug 8, 10, 04:51 #29

[quote=enkidu]Exactly that. I find it humiliating the need to complain, writing letters,

If that would be the attitude everyone had, how on earth would the country improve?

You need to be an active citizen, sitting on your ass is not going to change anything, things only get better with an active citizenry that cares about:

1. their family

2. their local community

3. their country

It is the test a a true patriot. As the Poles in eastern Prussia new very well.

nauczyciel	Edited by: nauczyciel Aug 8, 10, 12:58 #30
pawian: Poland is the country with the highest cancer rate in Europe. Why? you backed up that statement with what? try this on for size

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