Help Translating DOWÓD TOŻSAMOŚCI

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Jan 30, 11, 12:00 #1

Hi,

I would appreciate your help translating the attached images.
These snippets were taken from a document titled: "DOWÓD TOŻSAMOŚCI"
this document is dated from 1950 and i would appreciate any information you can provide that will shed some light on the legal meaning of this document.

Thanks!

Residence

Birth City

MagdalenaThreads: 5 Posts: 1,389 Joined: Aug 15, 07 ♀	Jan 30, 11, 12:05 #2
It's an ID card. I don't understand what you need translating, as the image names correspond to the original entries - Residence, Birth City (or rather birthplace).

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Jan 30, 11, 12:10 #3
Kłodzko the other one is difficult to read: bildziugi / bilelziugi ... (which means ?)

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Jan 30, 11, 12:14 #4

First thanks,

I'm sorry i wasn't clear enough -
I managed translating the TYPED letters using google translate, but the handwritten letter are almost impossible for me to recognize...

i would appreciate the help on identifying the names of the places written there and the meaning of the whole document.

I'm not sure if this is a regular ID Card, as on the bottom of the document is written:
"dowod niniejszy uprawnia do przekroczenia granicy polskiej po otrzymaniu wizy panstwa izrael"
which google translated as:
"proof of this entitles them to cross the Polish border after receiving a visa state of Israel"

Thanks again!

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Jan 30, 11, 12:33 #5
muskito: i would appreciate the help on identifying the names of the places written there check the last post by Wroclaw again.

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Jan 30, 11, 12:42 #6

Place names:

KŁODZKO
BILDZIUGI

muskito:

I'm not sure if this is a regular ID Card, as on the bottom of the document is written:
"dowod niniejszy uprawnia do przekroczenia granicy polskiej po otrzymaniu wizy panstwa izrael"
which google translated as:
"proof of this entitles them to cross the Polish border after receiving a visa state of Israel"

Well, unless we can see a scan of the whole thingy, it's really hard to say what the document is. DOWÓD TOŻSAMOŚCI = ID CARD, anyways.

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Jan 30, 11, 14:41 #7

Hi All,

I Appreciate your quick help!
Since this "ID CARD" document contains personal information, i don't know if it is ok to upload the whole scan of the document.
i can describe the document in general details -
the header shows:
rzeczpospolita polska
ministerstwo administracji publicznej
underneath there is:
Nr D. O. XXXXX (5 digit handwritten number)

on the right upper side, there's my grandmother's signature + Personal head photo + 3 head photos of the children.

the body contains birthdate, place of birth, father name, mother name, city of residence,
maritial status, description of outer look (face, hair, body and eyes)
list of children.

validity date, issue date,
the remark i wrote above:
dowod niniejszy uprawnia do przekroczenia granicy polskiej po otrzymaniu wizy panstwa izrael

on the bottom left, written: Seria G NNNNN (NNNNN = 5 digit number printed in red ink)

on the right bottom, round purple stamp with eagle inside and surounding text:
ministerstwo administracji publicznej

and signature.

I Hope this info helps to bring us closer...

Thanks!

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 30, 11, 14:51 #8

Magdalena:

Well, unless we can see a scan of the whole thingy, it's really hard to say what the document is.

Isn't it just the document that was issued by the PRL authorities to allow people to emigrate to Israel? I'm not sure about the laws in the early 50's, but I'd be shocked if people had documents allowing them to cross the frontier freely - hence the existence of this document to allow them to leave for Israel.

enkiduThreads: 18 Posts: 983 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jan 30, 11, 15:01 #9
Sad times. It seems that this is a "one way ticked" to Israel. Probably issued around 1968. Kłodzko - is the small town in the western Poland. 100% hit. Bildziugi - it's a place in Belarusia.

muskitoThreads: 1 Posts: 5 Joined: Jan 30, 11 ♂	Jan 30, 11, 15:29 #10
enkidu: Probably issued around 1968. It was issued at the 6th of September 1950 and the validity date is for two months: 6th of November 1950.

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Edited by: delphiandomine Jan 30, 11, 15:33 #11
muskito: It was issued at the 6th of September 1950 and the validity date is for two months: 6th of November 1950. Makes perfect sense then - it's a document allowing the holder to cross the State frontier provided they have a visa for entry into Israel. The short term validity would be to ensure that it wasn't used by people coming/going from Israel - once they're out, they're gone.

muskitoThreads: 1 Posts: 5 Joined: Jan 30, 11 ♂	Jan 30, 11, 15:34 #12
delphiandomine: Isn't it just the document that was issued by the PRL authorities to allow people to emigrate to Israel? PRL Authorities = ? And does it mean that the person carrying this certificate had a Poland Citizenship?

enkiduThreads: 18 Posts: 983 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jan 30, 11, 16:06 #13
muskito: PRL Authorities = ? Polska Rzeczpospolita Ludowa - People's Republic of Poland. Official name during communists times. muskito: And does it mean that the person carrying this certificate had a Poland Citizenship? Probably but not necessarily.

muskitoThreads: 1 Posts: 5 Joined: Jan 30, 11 ♂	Jan 30, 11, 16:14 #14
Thank you very much for all your help! You guys are awsome.

♂

Edited by: grubas Jan 30, 11, 19:04 #15

delphiandomine:

Isn't it just the document that was issued by the PRL authorities to allow people to emigrate to Israel?

Damn right it is.

muskito:

And does it mean that the person carrying this certificate had a Poland Citizenship?

Yes that person held Polish Citizenship until he/she crossed the border.This is kind of ONE WAY passport.Don't you even try to get Polish Citizenship with this piece of paper.This person VOLUNTARILY gave up Polish Citizenship.

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Jan 30, 11, 19:16 #16

grubas:

Yes that person held Polish Citizenship until he/she crossed the border.This is kind of ONE WAY passport.

In the 1950 it is not necessarily true. In the '50 law it was impossible to automatically deny Polish citizenship to everyone emigrating to Israel. Most of these people were forced to "freely" give up citizenship. But not all of them. That's why this person we are talking about may or may not to be a Polish citizen.

In 1968 it was automatic process. The "one way passports" issued then clearly states: "This person IS NOT the citizen of the PRL". The citizenship was renounced on the moment the person crossed the border.

Sad and bloody times.

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 30, 11, 19:40 #17

enkidu:

In the 1950 it is not necessarily true. In the '50 law it was impossible to automatically deny Polish citizenship to everyone emigrating to Israel. Most of these people were forced to "freely" give up citizenship. But not all of them. That's why this person we are talking about may or may not to be a Polish citizen.

Hmm, wouldn't it come under the law of 1920? The "new" law on Polish nationality wasn't enacted until 1951, while the Israeli Law of Return came into force into 1950 (which came into force in July 1950 - so compatible with the September 1950 date of issue of the ID card). In this case, I'd say that the person was almost certainly stripped of Polish citizenship upon emigration to Israel - as they were automatically considered Israeli citizens upon arrival.

Incidentally, the same law of 1951 on Polish nationality also strips people of Polish citizenship if they obtain a foreign citizenship - article 11 makes this clear.

LenkaThreads: - Posts: 240 Joined: Nov 17, 09 ♀	Edited by: Lenka Feb 2, 11, 21:53 #18
polishdc: do not help zny Zionist jews !! They just want to still our property of the Polish people And how Polish ppl got it?Usually* they took Jews properties. *Maybe not usually bot often enough.

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