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Red Hair - recessive gene from Poland?

olypstrksio     Mar 28, 2009, 11:44pm  #31

Jampat about Vikings.... weell Tacitus (Romasn writer) mentions lots in N Britain many centuries before vikings came into Britain. BTW Scot genes are very very similar to irish genes so it was probably native also.

olypstrksio     Mar 28, 2009, 11:52pm  #32

BTW Wiki article says Scots@ 13% but reference in article for it says Scots ( irish too) at up to10%

Calicoe Threads: 1
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  ♀   Edited by: Calicoe  Mar 29, 2009, 04:34am  #33

Jampat:
The Vikings spreading the gene around makes a lot of sense, as red hair evolved in far north climates to deal with small amounts of Vitamin D, and the Vikings spread their gene pool around northern Europe quite a bit, through simple settlement or raping and pillaging. I know I got part of the recessive gene from my scots-irish side, and the Vikings had quite a bit of red hair too... and they invaded a lot of the baltic, and Poland too.

That's right. But, it wasn't only the Vikings who had red hair in the far north; some tribes out of Siberia on the western side of the Urals also had red hair. Red hair was also associated with Russian Jews early on in the very beginning of Kiev and Rus, going back to Kharzaria.

PennBoy:
Supposedly 30,000 Scottich families settled in Poland back in the 17th century, i havn't met any Scottish Poles, did they evaporate lol ?? of course not, they've gotten completly asimilated into Polish society, therefore if you meet a red headed Pole, he's probably got some Scottish in him.

Except that the incidence of red hair in Eastern Europe was apparent way before the 17th Century, and developed independently of the Viking invasion as well. If red hair evolved due to a lack of Vitamin D, then it only follows and is actually supported that Siberian tribes independent of the Vikings also had this evolutionary gene. *(But, who knows if it was completely independent, because Siberian tribes in the far east never developed the same gene. But, they all have some degree of the eye fold to protect the eye from the glare of the sun). Due to various migrations out of the far north and into Central Asia and Eastern Europe, it is not a big surprise that red gene also naturally occurs to a lesser degree in Eastern Europe.

As for the Celtics tribes, it is my understanding that their settlements also originated in Eastern Europe somewhere around where the Czech Republic is now, until they migrated west, terrorized Gaul and crumbling Roman Empire for awhile, and crossed over. I have also met a few Czechs who have red hair.

I'll look for my links somewhere. I have them buried somewhere because I was conducting research on my own heritage from Eastern Europe and saved them.

*Edit:

olypstrksio:
Jampat about Vikings.... weell Tacitus (Romasn writer) mentions lots in N Britain many centuries before vikings came into Britain.

Yeah, probably that too. Aren't there still places in England with Viking names?

Calicoe Threads: 1
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  ♀   Edited by: Calicoe  Mar 29, 2009, 05:33am  #34

Ok, here are some quick links and excerpts (I couldn't find my other links at the moment, but these will do):

khazaria.com/khazar-history.html
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Russia

Kievan Rus'

David Christian, A History of Russia, Central Asia and Mongolia, Blackwell Publishing, 1998, pp. 286-288. ISBN 0631208143.

geographia.com/russia/rushis02.htm
redheads.ie/Origins-Red-Hair.htm
viking.no/e/england/danelaw/index.html

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  ♂   Mar 29, 2009, 06:08am  #35

Calicoe:
Except that the incidence of red hair in Eastern Europe was apparent way before the 17th Century, and developed independently of the Viking invasion as well

True, but it wasn't that Celtic shade of red, you know that almost orange red hair, Slavs were either blond of had this reddish-brown hair

osiol Threads: 57
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  ♂   Edited by: osiol  Mar 29, 2009, 06:12am  #36

Isn't hair colour caused by the interplay of more than one gene? There are so many shades of hair colour and a limited range of things that one gene can actually do. Redness occurs in all parts of Europe to some extent and that doesn't just mean Scottish or Irish people spilt some genes there at some point in history.

Calicoe Threads: 1
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  ♀   Edited by: Calicoe  Mar 29, 2009, 06:25am  #37

True, but it wasn't that Celtic shade of red, you know that almost orange red hair, Slavs were either blond of had this reddish-brown hair

True, it is a different shade of hair color, but we are talking about origins and evolution of the first genes here. As for the origins of the red-haired gene, the jury is still out as to whether it originated from the Iranic tribes of the steppes or Neanderthals in Central Europe. But even going back as far as the Neanderthals, won't settle the argument of "purity."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal

Modern human findings in Abrigo do Lagar Velho, Portugal of 24,500 years ago, allegedly featuring Neanderthal admixtures, have been published.[84]"

Rafal_1981     Apr 1, 2009, 02:49pm  #38

Randal:
We’re a discriminated minority! I demand special protections!

But this is good…

He goes on to say "redheads are most likely be successful in life." [57]

Red head are most likely to be successful in life because of the discrimination.

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  ♂   Apr 1, 2009, 03:58pm  #39

i was told by genetic studiers once that red hair is mostly distinct genetic deviation that can occur in celtic genetics, sounds like sounds offensive i guess but i have ehard many time all over from some people so if its just so then its so i guess, it does explain most of the gingers people areas of populations, mainly where celts still exsist, scotland, Ireland, wales, south west side of uk

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  ♂   Apr 1, 2009, 04:58pm  #40

Rafal_1981:
Red head are most likely to be successful in life because of the discrimination.

Why? It drives us to succeed? Maybe we're discriminted against because we're successful?

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  ♂   Apr 1, 2009, 05:00pm  #41

better be carfull with comments like that, people will start treating like the masons society

Rafal_1981     Apr 1, 2009, 05:46pm  #42

Randal:
Why? It drives us to succeed? Maybe we're discriminted against because we're successful?

Simple:
What does not kill you, will only make you stronger.

Discrimination can either drives you to success or 'kill you'.

Those who survive are the ones that adapt or 'fit' best and quickly to their environment.

miranda     Apr 1, 2009, 05:49pm  #43

Rafal_1981:
What does not kill you, will only make you stronger.

is usually not strong enough to kill you;)
Rafal_1981:
Discrimination can either drives you to success or 'kill you'.

or kill the opponent. I usually go for the kill;)

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  ♂   Edited by: Randal  Apr 1, 2009, 06:11pm  #44

Rafal_1981:
What does not kill you, will only make you stronger.

Discrimination can either drives you to success or 'kill you'.

Those who survive are the ones that adapt or 'fit' best and quickly to their environment.

Hmm.

I’m not particularly successful. I do ok, I’m not complaining, but I wouldn’t say I was unusually successful by the usual measures as compared to brownheads or others.

I think that through the years I have indeed experienced a degree of discrimination due to my red hair. See, having red hair is not as common here as it is in places like Scotland, we’re seen as a bit of a novelty. As a kid I was teased some and authority figures maybe saw me as trouble. Lol… Even as an adult in the working world I think it is a distraction and it causes people to maybe not take you as seriously. My youthful appearance which makes me look years younger than my actual age doesn’t help here either. But I’ve been able to overcome and assert my professionalism and earn respect.

So maybe this discrimination has indeed caused me to strive some? I never really thought about it before now.

But you still don’t hear us bitching and whining about being discriminated against –real or imagined- like we constantly hear other minority groups. We suck it up! Us Reds are tough!

And we do have to be more conscious of clothing color choices than others do! It’s like having a built in clashing device! Lol…

Jampat Threads: 1
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  ♀   Apr 2, 2009, 02:38am  #45

Well it seems possible that I got one side of the recessive combination from Poland... it seems like no one is really sure where red hair originated from or it originated from several places. As for discrimination... I really havn't faced any other than being jokingly called a ginger by my friends. It might have something to do with living in a part of the world with a very high concentration of scots-irish people, or the fact that picking on a 6'1 broad shouldered man isn't the best idea.

lareincestmoi     Apr 6, 2009, 04:03am  #46

aBSOLUTELY YOUR RED HAIR COMES FROM POLAND. There's only 4 places in the world where red hair occurs naturally-England, Scotland, Ireland and Persia-Iran. When you research the history of the peoples who swept through Poland AND BIOLOGICALLY SETTLED THERE-the Magyas, Khazars, KabaRs-it turns out the Khazras/Kabars had RED HAIR

Veelacrosse     May 11, 2009, 07:01am  #47

I'm a redhead and I have extremely tolerant to pain. I'm partially insensitive to pain. (fully insensitive means you can't feel pain at all.) I'm mostly polish and a tiny bit english, maybe irish.

lookingformyfam     Jun 9, 2009, 06:21am  #48

My Grandmother was Polish with striking red hair. I have brown hair with natural red highlights.

Crash     Aug 17, 2009, 06:43pm  #49

I remember a recent study showing that the gene for red hair occured within the last 10,000 years toward the end of the ice age. If that is true, then you are likely descended from this person. The fact that certain populations have red hair (the picts, scots and irish, etc.) is meaningless if the gene originated at a time when ice covered most of Europe.

It is possible, however, that since you are Scottish and Polish, that you happened to get your red hair from your Scottish ancestry by way of Poland. During the 16th and 17th century, tens of thousands of Scots came to Poland to work (try googling "Scots In Poland"). There are a lot of Poles with Scottish blood.

hancock Threads: 1
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  ♂   Nov 2, 2009, 03:09pm  #50

Nov 15, 09, 02:02 - Thread attached on merging:
How Many People with Red Hair in Poland.

Who could guess how many people may have red hair in poland.

Lodz_The_Boat Threads: 41
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  ♂   Edited by: Lodz_The_Boat  Nov 2, 2009, 03:12pm  #51

I got... more like auburn....

hancock Threads: 1
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  ♂   Nov 2, 2009, 03:29pm  #52

It seems the country with the most red hair In the world is Scotland. Excepting USA.
They imported all of theirs from everywhere else.

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  ♀   Nov 15, 2009, 01:43am  #53

My Polish ancestors from the Nowy Targ area had red hair.
Last name Kadłub, or Kadlub. I heard there is a village called Kadłub, but I don't know anyone of my ancestors being from there.

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  ♂   Nov 15, 2009, 01:46am  #54

I have red hair and I am in Poland. I am Scottish though :)

osiol Threads: 57
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  ♂   Nov 15, 2009, 01:47am  #55

There's already a thread about this somewhere. I know this because I started it. That was before I learnt that some (perhaps many) Polish people pinch themselves when they see a ginger because they're supposed to bring bad luck.

galwayman Threads: 1
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  ♂   Nov 15, 2009, 05:15pm  #56

Im Irish - and i can tell you now that if your a red head " Ginger" its
Scots - Irish .

Plus - the Flying Geese came to help Poland in the 16th Century.
Irish Army !!

LAGirl Threads: 9
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  ♀   Nov 16, 2009, 09:38pm  #57

I have a friend from Poland he had reddish orange hair and freckles and very white he looks so much Irish he tells me that on St Paddys day he gets free drinks from the bars here.

jasinski Threads: 13
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  ♂   Nov 19, 2009, 10:32pm  #58

ive wondered that too, about some poles being red haired. There was scottish immigration to poland. i cant remember when exactly it was, but iam pretty sure it was during the commonwealth. poland had a high number of scottish immigrants. this could have something to do with it.

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  ♂   Nov 19, 2009, 10:39pm  #59

There was scottish immigration to poland

There was a Scottish immigration to Prussia:

electricscotland.com/history/prussia/index.htm
electricscotland.com/history/germany/scotsndx.htm

jasinski Threads: 13
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  ♂   Nov 20, 2009, 12:02am  #60

yes your right. it was when prussia was a part of the polish commonwealth. the northern lands along with pomerania, livonia i think often changed hands. So prussia was polands at different times. And the scottish immigrants were there during atleast one of those times.very early sixteen hundreds



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Red Hair - recessive gene from Poland?

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