Family History - Deborski family - Brodnica and Rypin Area

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Nov 29, 11, 20:54 #1

I am trying to find links to my Polish ancestors without much success. My gg father was Frank Klimowski, born about 1843. I know nothing about his wife. His children were: Katherine, born 1859; Kostanty, born 1863; Frank, born about 1866; Joseph, born about 1870. From family stories, they were all born in Brodnica.

Katherine married Frank Deborski, he was born about 1859. Their children were: John, born 1883 in Poland; Helen, born abt 1884 in Poland; Costek, born 1888 in Poland; Mary, born 1889 in Poland; Alice, born 1890 in Poland; Sophie, born 1899 in Colorado, USA; Frank, born 1901 in Colorado, USA. Costek is my grandfather. On a WWI draft registration form for Costek, his plce of birth is listed as Stutora, Poland - I have found nothing close to this on any maps of Poland.

Kostanty Klimowski married Julia Cymanski in Poland. Their children were: Lenora, born 1884 in Poland, Burnard, born 1888 in Poland; Wacie, born 1890 in Rypin, Poland; 6 more children were born after they moved to the USA. Some of these use the name Klimoski, without the soft w.

From this, I am assuming that both families came from the Brodnica/Rypin area. I also assume that the Deborski name was changed somehow from its Polish original. All the Deborski's I have found in the USA are directly related to Frank Sr. above. I think the original name may have sounded (in English) like Deborski - perhaps Taborski, or Diborski, etc., but this is just speculation. At one point, an "expert" in Polish surnames indicated that the original name might have been Dęborski, which might have been said as Demborski in English. One family tale says the name was something like Tyburski.

I would very much like to hear thoughts from people in Poland about the possible name variations and anyone knowledgeable about Brodnica and/or Rypin.

Please send me a message with any information or thoughts.

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Dec 15, 11, 21:56 #2

Is there a place called Stutora in Poland? Or anything even close? That appears as the place of birth of my grandfather on his WWI draft registration (US). It is very difficult to read and he was somewhat difficult to understand when he spoke, which wasn't often. Other close relatives seem to have come from Brodnica, or perhaps Brodniczka, Rypin and Śweidziebnia - all pretty close together in Kujawsko-Pomorskie.

Patrycja19Threads: 79 Posts: 3,974 Joined: Oct 31, 06 ♀	Dec 20, 11, 02:46 #3
I found a mary Klimowski coming over with a frank dembinski? her birthdate is 1889 in the manifest, he is 20 years old so I dont know if this would be one of yours.. sounds kinda like it tho. :)

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Dec 20, 11, 03:31 #4

Frank W Deborski Kate Superior, Boulder, Colorado abt 1867 Russia Poland

I am little confused, this is a record of them, his birth at 1867, I found a frank coming over from canada
his birth 1877, could be wrong Birth for him, but I see you have 1859 which is 8 years earlier then what
Frank told the person writing down the cencus.

The frank I found his fathers name was Adam, I can copy this to you.

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Dec 20, 11, 17:50 #5

gadeborski:

John, born 1883 in Poland; Helen, born abt 1884 in Poland; Costek, born 1888 in Poland; Mary, born 1889 in Poland; Alice, born 1890 in Poland

In genealogy, you have to stick to historical facts or you will mess up your family tree. So, provided that they were all born in the town that is called Brodnica today, it should be:
John, born 1883 in Strasburg, Westpreußen, Deutsches Reich; Helen, born abt 1884 in Strasburg, Westpreußen, Deutsches Reich; ...

Des EssientesThreads: 11 Posts: 2,318 Joined: Feb 6, 10 ♂ [Suspended]	Dec 20, 11, 17:58 #6
TheOther: Deutsches Reich Wrong, the land was Poland. Occupied Poland but Poland nonetheless.

TheOtherThreads: 5 Posts: 1,584 Joined: Jul 13, 09 ♂	Dec 20, 11, 18:07 #7
Des, don't go there. We've had this discussion before. Poland didn't exist as a country, and you won't change that.

Des EssientesThreads: 11 Posts: 2,318 Joined: Feb 6, 10 ♂ [Suspended]	Dec 20, 11, 18:10 #8
TheOther: Des, don't go there. Don't presume to tell a Polonian what to do on a Polish discussion forum. Poland has existed since the tenth century and it doesn't matter if some Germanic and Russian despots claimed otherwise.

TheOtherThreads: 5 Posts: 1,584 Joined: Jul 13, 09 ♂	Edited by: TheOther Dec 20, 11, 18:15 #9
Des Essientes: Don't presume to tell a Polonian what to do on a Polish discussion forum. You're an American, not a Pole. So don't give me that pseudo-patriotic crap. ;) And besides, we're talking genealogy here.

Patrycja19Threads: 79 Posts: 3,974 Joined: Oct 31, 06 ♀	Dec 20, 11, 18:15 #10
Des Essientes: Don't presume to tell a Polonian what to do on a Polish discussion forum des, pipe down, borders did change and how can one be helpful to another if they are all up in someones thread trying to say poland was always Poland? he is trying to find his towns name.. this area should be off limits for arguments. PERIOD!

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Dec 20, 11, 18:59 #11

I think what you've found is the 1920 census record with the birth ~1867. In all the other census record, his birth is ~1860. The 1859 date comes from what was put on his tombstone. I have found the families in the 1900, 1910, 1920 and 1930 census records - the information can vary all over the place as can what the census taker wrote down for the family names!

I have seen the record of a Frank coming in through Canada, but discounted it because of the ages of his children. If born in 1877, he would have been only ~6 when his oldest son was born.

I'll take a look at the Klimowski/Dembinski manifest.

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Apr 15, 12, 18:45 #12

Patrycja19:

Is there a place called Stutora in Poland? Or anything even close? That appears as the place of birth of my grandfather on his WWI draft registration (US). It is very difficult to read and he was somewhat difficult to understand when he spoke, which wasn't often. Other close relatives seem to have come from Brodnica, or perhaps Brodniczka, Rypin and Śweidziebnia - all pretty close together in Kujawsko-Pomorskie.

All this names sounds quit familiar to me but maybe it is just coincidence. My family originally have come form this area. Stutora would it be "Szczutowo" nearby Rypin as well Świedziebnia and it is very difficult word to every English. My grandfather and gg father last name was Temborek and if someone want to make this much more noble can change Temborek to Temborski. Even the surname of my gg father was Frank and his oldest son surname was Jan ( John), he was obvious not the same person as your gg father. Frank Temborek remained in Poland and died during WWII. At the and of XIX c. there were more family named Temborek near Szczutowo. But now we have two villages with name Szczutowo and the distance between them is about 30 km or less. The one more south had then a Church and the palace of birth of your grandfather would it be the place of baptism.
Jerry

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Apr 16, 12, 16:20 #13

Jerry,

Thank you for your thoughts. Since my last post, I have found the record of my great grandmother's birth and christening in the parish of Świedziebnia and it lists Szczutowo as the place of residence of her parents. Her name is Katarzyna Klimowska, parents Jan Klimowski and Agieszka Krajiński. I have also found records of her brothers and sisters in the same parish, all also from Szczutowo.

Your thinking about the possibility of the great grandfather's surname being something like Temborski is also close to what I think it may have originally been. I have found the passenger list for the immigration of Katarzyna and her 5 oldest children into the port of Galveston in1898. Her surname is listed as Tuburski. I think Tyburski, Tiborski, etc. etc. are all possibllities as Deborski seems to be an exceedingly rare name in Poland. I think the name Deborski may have come from how the Polish pronunciation of the original sounded phonetically to "American ears".

Katarzyna's brother Konstanty Klimowski married Julianna Cymański.

I have not yet found any records that lists my great grandfather, Frank. I had hoped to find a record of their marriage in the Świedziebnia parish records, bu no luck so far!

I am very excited to hear from someone who knows the area around Świedziebnia, Rypin, etc.

Do any of these surnames sound familiar to you?

Thanks you again,

Gary Deborski

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Apr 17, 12, 02:36 #14

Hi Gary,
Now there are about 600 poeople with the surneme Klimowski in Poland. In central Poland the most of them live still near Brodnica and Rypin but less then one hundred.
In my primery school ( little village - Gójsk - 5 km form Szczutowo ) even in the same class, was Piotr Klimowski. His father worked in the lokal church. When I was 14 I fell in love with the girl which surname was Tyburska she went to the same small primery school.

"Her name is Katarzyna Klimowska, parents Jan Klimowski and Agieszka Krajiński. I have also found records of her Hi brothers and sisters in the same parish, all also from Szczutowo."

Can you tell me if the information about your's gg mother brathers and sisters above are correct or not. It is importent what are the names of relatievs remains in Poland.

Best Regards,
Jerry

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Apr 17, 12, 10:00 #15

Gary,
I get the e-mail from Tomasz Klimowski from my old village ( now he live in Sweden ). He said his great grandfather lived and worked long time in USA but next came back to Poland and settled in Budy Mileskie nearby Raciąż ( about 40 km east from Szczutowo ). Part of his family remained in America. They were in touch even in 60's and then the aunt from USA visit his grandfather in Poland. He promise to send me more information, but it would be a little difficult, his father has passed and his aunts are so old that is not ease to contact them.

Jerry

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Apr 17, 12, 15:25 #16

Jerry,

Here is what I have learned from the Świedziebnia parish records:

Jan Klimowski, born ~1832, wife Agnieszka Krajiński, born ~1835 their children were -

Katarzyna, born June 1859
Jan, born May 1862
Konstanty, born August 1863
Franciszek, born April 1866
Maryanna, born April 1868

All of them were born in Szczutowo

Katarzyna Klimowska was my great grandmother. She was married to Frank Deborski and they had 5 children (that I am aware of) before leaving Poland for the USA. Frank came first (I have not yet found a record of his passage). Katarzyna came across in late 1898 with the children:

Helena, born ~1884
Jan, born ~1888
Constanty, born ~1893
Maryanna, born ~1894
Leokadya, born ~1895

This is how they were listed on the ship manifest and are listed with the surname Tuburska. Constanty was my grandfather. We knew him as Gus or Costek.

I have not found any parish records for this part of the family. I hoped to find a record of marriage for Katarzyna and Frank, but nothing so far.

I do not know of any contact between my family in the US and any relatives in Poland. Family stories say that Frank had some brothers and sisters. One version is that they all remained in Poland, but another says that Frank had a brother in the Chicago area. I have not found anything certain for either version.

There are no records of a Tomasz, but he may be a cousin? It will be interesting the see if any of the folks you know have knowledge of these people.

Best regards,
Gary Deborski

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