Mixed-Blood Poles in America (Do we count?)

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Sep 8, 10, 01:46 #91

Eurola

Well, because your dad was from Englewood, his last name is anything but Sklodowski.
I can understand why you may not speaking polish, no reason to do so since your grandma still speaks 'polack english' as you said and your momma may not speak much polish being born here. Did the kids call you bad names in school? Offensive ones? (I hope your childhood was not miserable). It is you who can shed some light on that. Yeah, I am skeptical about your 'story'.

He could have easily taken his mother's last name. Not unheard of in the States. Naming conventions are not as strict in the US as they are in Europa.

EurolaThreads: 6 Posts: 2,647 Joined: Dec 2, 06 ♀	Sep 8, 10, 06:26 #92
shewolf: He didn't exactly say his dad was Polish. If you knew what West Englewood neighborhood is in Chicago, you'd know that his father was not polish... :) I can assure you of that wolfie. Besides, I'd love to hear any of his childhood stories, if he had them. josh sklodowski: My Mom's from Jefferson Park. My Dad's from West Englewood.

josh sklodowski

Sep 8, 10, 06:30 #93

Eurola:

Well, because your dad was from Englewood, his last name is anything but Sklodowski.
I can understand why you may not speaking polish, no reason to do so since your grandma still speaks 'polack english' as you said and your momma may not speak much polish being born here. Did the kids call you bad names in school? Offensive ones? (I hope your childhood was not miserable). It is you who can shed some light on that. Yeah, I am skeptical about your 'story'.

Well, my name was hyphenated. I'm really Sklodowska-Johnson. But, I was raised by my mother (and I'm a man). So, I took Sklodowski. My mother was born in Gdynia. She was not born here. She moved to England at age 5 and then to Chicago after her father died at age 12.

No one really called be anything offensive in school. I grew up in a hispanic neighborhood. They all either thought I was one of them or knew I was mulato. However, on occasion I would meet blacks who laughed at me and hated me when I told them I was half Polish, make fun of my name and what not. They thought I was trying to be white. I never really got made fun of by whites. I'm just a little paranoid that they laugh at me too. On top of that, I keep hearing that Poles are racist. My friend, for example, told me his mother constantly shouts ****** and warns him to make sure his black friends don't steal form him. So, I feel exiled by blacks, whites and poles alike. This would be fine. But, America forces people into categories and a mixed category has yet to be accepted.

I see blacks and whites alike clinging to a few drops of American Indian blood. Meanwhile, I was raised by my Polish Mother and Grandmother, am familiar with the language, culture and history, hope to learn the language fully and am not sure if I count.

What would poles/polonia say? That's what I'm interested in hearing.

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Sep 8, 10, 06:48 #94

josh sklodowski:

What would poles/polonia say? That's what I'm interested in hearing.

I think Polonia would be curious of you, especially if you started to speak some polish. Being brought up in a polish household, I suppose you developed a taste for pierogi and polish sausage, right? :) Have you ever been to any polish deli shopping? I'm sure there could be some puzzled looks, here and there but I can tell you - they would like it. Don't believe all the stuff you read here.

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Sep 8, 10, 07:06 #95

josh sklodowski

No one really called be anything offensive in school. I grew up in a hispanic neighborhood. They all either thought I was one of them or knew I was mulato. However, on occasion I would meet blacks who laughed at me and hated me when I told them I was half Polish, make fun of my name and what not. They thought I was trying to be white. I never really got made fun of by whites. I'm just a little paranoid that they laugh at me too. On top of that, I keep hearing that Poles are racist. My friend, for example, told me his mother constantly shouts ****** and warns him to make sure his black friends don't steal form him. So, I feel exiled by blacks, whites and poles alike. This would be fine. But, America forces people into categories and a mixed category has yet to be accepted.

You have no control of what people think of you. What's important is not what people think of you, but what you think of yourself. Biggest fear that white Americans have of Black Americans is the gun violence. Once they get past that you'll be fine. Be kind and friendly and people will return in kind. The Polish last name will be a curiosity for most. Use it to your advantage. It makes you a more interesting person. BTW, when it comes to race Polish people are more open minded than a lot of other nationalities.

Plusa10Threads: 3 Posts: 41 Joined: May 22, 10 ♀	Sep 8, 10, 07:29 #96
I'm an Irish-Polish mix. grandma came from Poland, moved to Chicago and met grandpa, who came from Ireland. myself and my family have a taste for both Polish and Irish cuisine. we were given American names to "fit in", but still appreciate our Polishness and Irishness. I have only a basic understanding of Polish, but am working on learning the whole language.

canadianchopin

Sep 8, 10, 09:24 #97

Josh,

It's an interesting topic here--what is it that makes up one's identity? Is it genes? Birthplace? Cultural factors? Residency? A feeling of belonging or acceptance by others in the group? It seems that unlike gender or perhaps even sexual orientation, this kind of identity is socially constructed. For this reason, I doubt that you will find a clear-cut answer anywhere.

I think it is clearly the case that some mixed-race Poles consider themselves to be Polish and are regarded by other Poles to be Polish. For example, take a look at this English language interview where Polish actor Omar Sangare discusses his experience as a mixed-race Pole (youtube.com/watch?v=t-c2UxDfS-I). For other examples of mixed race Poles look at Omenaa Mensah (youtube.com/watch?v=zkUrvX0emtc&p=C02CD7B535D894FB&playnext=1&index=2 8 ) and Ola Szwed (youtube.com/watch?v=i75EqR71-e4&feature=related).

Here in Canada, my buddy Rob is half-polish and half-Ghanan. He speaks Polish, works in the same company as a ton of other Polish people, is up-to-date with what's going on in Poland, knows the cool new Polish slang words, and has a lot of Polish friends. We're in Canada. I've never met anybody who would not consider him to be Polish. Of course people who do not know him are at first surprised that he is polish when he starts talking.

You're asking about how a mixed-race American would be perceived. From what I can tell the mixed race bit is a non-issue (obviously ignoring the bigoted viewpoints). What's most important, I think, is a connection to things that are somehow Polish. For people living outside of Poland this is obviously very difficult to maintain, and these ties weaken with time. For this reason few 3rd generation immigrants really participate in Polish things--they lose touch and at some point it becomes just a part of their heritage. When they learn about their heritage, these Canadians or Americans try to reconnect with their polish roots, but since so much time has passed and the grandparents are no longer around, it is hard to do unless one's living in an area where there are many other Poles to meet who could transmit the Polish identity (I'm thinking about somewhere like the Polish neighborhoods in Toronto). It doesn't help that Polish people tend to assimilate very well into their host societies, so often contact with the 1st generation is essential.

Since you grew up in what appears to be a polish home with your mom and grandmother, you've essentially got the most important thing to being polish, just like all the other 2nd generation polish people in Canada and the US. In this regard you're really no different than anybody else in the 2nd generation because you've got what matters.

That's my two cents.

a77

Sep 25, 10, 09:16 #98

Wow... just found this thread on Google. Yes you're half Polish, but you're half black. Most people in Poland will NOT consider you as a Pole, and neither would I. You're a mongrel.

I'm half Polish and half Ukrainian but I'm 100% white...

You could have been born in Poland, and lived in Poland for your whole life but you're still not Polish. In order to be Polish, you must be white and have Polish ancestry.

It's sad to see all these foolish liberals on this forum. Silly liberals, Polska dla Polakow (Poland for Poles)!!!

Peace!

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Sep 26, 10, 00:36 #99

delphiandomine:

If you can't speak the language and know next to nothing about the country apart from what you read on a few (badly advised) websites, you aren't part of that countries heritage. Trust me, no-one in Poland considers 3rd/4th generation Polonia to be Polish - in fact, most people here are ashamed of the fact that they are going around, calling themselves TRUE POLES when the only word they know is "busha".

I agree with you on one point if you wish to call yourself Polish you should really make it a point to understand the true history of Poland . I would agree with you in Polish but don't speak the language ... I am a second generation mutt from Poland and Ireland. I don't think because I can't speak the language this disqualifies me from calling myself Polish.

[quote=PennBoy]my friend a Polish girl has two kids with a Jamaican guy, and my other friend a Polish guy has a kid with a Puerto Rican girl, besides them i don't know any other mixed Polish people. Most Poles in America date or marry other Poles or white Americans, Irish, Italian.

PennBoy:

Most Poles in America date or marry other Poles or white Americans, Irish, Italian.

In modern America this is simply not the case, unless you live in a densly populated Polish/American community it is hard to find Polish people to date. I think most Americans are spoiled and date whomever they found appealing to the eye regardless of race or ethnicity.

Chicago Pollock:

Doesn't mean didly. If you wanna be Polish MOVE TO POLAND.

So I suppose if I move to China, I will suddenly become a bad driver and develop excellent math skills. Being Polish is in the genes. What does it mean to be a True Pole? Some on this site argue that Poland didn't exist at one point. Does this mean that if you can't trace your lineage prior to 1795 give or take your not a true Pole. Please.

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Sep 26, 10, 07:16 #100

markskibniewski:

So I suppose if I move to China, I will suddenly become a bad driver and develop excellent math skills. Being Polish is in the genes. What does it mean to be a True Pole? Some on this site argue that Poland didn't exist at one point. Does this mean that if you can't trace your lineage prior to 1795 give or take your not a true Pole. Please.

If your moving to China learn the language, know something of the culture, enjoy the food, find yourself a Chinese wife. I'd recommend the same if moving to Poland. The "genes"? Hitler devastated Poland over "the genes". Please yourself and read "Democracy in America" by Tocqueville.

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Sep 26, 10, 18:20 #101

Chicago Pollock:

If your moving to China learn the language, know something of the culture, enjoy the food, find yourself a Chinese wife. I'd recommend the same if moving to Poland. The "genes"? Hitler devastated Poland over "the genes". Please yourself and read "Democracy in America" by Tocqueville.

What does "Democracy in America" by Tocqueville have anything to do with the topic at hand??? I suppose if I was moving to another country I would learn the language but you missed the point. You don't have to speak the language to be Polish.

IronsideThreads: 59 Posts: 6,783 Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂	Sep 26, 10, 18:36 #102
Well, why not!?

Chicago PollockThreads: 10 Posts: 638 Joined: Apr 10, 10 ♂	Sep 27, 10, 05:05 #103
markskibniewski: What does "Democracy in America" by Tocqueville have anything to do with the topic at hand??? He's was a very perceptive Frenchman who described YOUR culture.

TymoteuszThreads: 7 Posts: 694 Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂	Sep 27, 10, 05:23 #104
Chicago Pollock: He's was a very perceptive Frenchman who described YOUR culture. Should be mandatory reading for Americans. Here are some quotes: (good and bad) http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/a/alexis_de_tocqueville.html Keep in mind that they are devoid of any context.

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Sep 28, 10, 00:09 #105

Chicago Pollock:

He's was a very perceptive Frenchman who described YOUR culture.

I consider myself half Polish and half Irish. America is a melting pot of many cultures. Because I didn't grow up on the family farm in Podbielko doesn't make my blood any less Polish. I do agree it is very important to learn about one's culture and I have strived to learn both about both my families history and Polish history. I would like to learn the language, it may have to wait as I must provide for my family first. I will try to visit with family over the next 2 years.

josh sklodowski

Jun 28, 11, 21:43 #106

I keep hearing that Poles are racist. My experiences have been good. But, afraid to engage with the community for fear of what they'll think. I'm afraid they'll say, "Wtf is this blakc kid doing here? He's not one of us. Go away." lol you know? I already get **** from some blacks because they think I'm trying to be less black when really I am black AND polish, you know? It's my ancestry. If I were polish and Russian, non one would bother me. But, because race is in the way all of a sudden it's a bad thing.

When I was younger, my grandmother would comfort me by telling me about her mother who was from southern France and supposedly could tan really well.

Idk. I've been made so racially self-conscious. I'm not complaining. I know I've had it easy. Race relations are better, regardless of what people say. But, it bothers me that my own people wouldn't want anything to do with me.

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Jun 28, 11, 21:55 #107

markskibniewski:

[quote=PennBoy]my friend a Polish girl has two kids with a Jamaican guy, and my other friend a Polish guy has a kid with a Puerto Rican girl, besides them i don't know any other mixed Polish people. Most Poles in America date or marry other Poles or white Americans, Irish, Italian.

markskibniewski:

In modern America this is simply not the case, unless you live in a densly populated Polish/American community it is hard to find Polish people to date. I think most Americans are spoiled and date whomever they found appealing to the eye regardless of race or ethnicity.

No there are some Poles here but not that many. It doesn't really have anything to do how many Poles live in your area but the total population of the are, how much more others there are. I was in northern New Jersey a few months back and in one day saw two separate Polish men with black girls!! I have never seen that here in PA and there are much fewer Poles here. Most Poles date other Poles/Slavs or white Americans whichever background they may be.

Nick the Greek

Jun 28, 11, 23:56 #108

The gold chain analogy...I use it to explain Greek-Hellenic continuity or Greekness in modern speak, but it could so easily apply to mixed Poles and their relationship to the Polish version of Hellenism!

Hear me out......Just insert the Polish word in place of Greek-Hellenic or Hellenism!

If a gold chain stretched out in a straight line represented Hellenism, and the series links of that chain represented continuity to them...how would that chain appear to us, I mean, would the first links in that chain sparkle, being made out of pure gold representing the first Greeks, would those links lose their sparkle as they stretched out having inherited impurities along the way.

If Hellenism was visualized in that fashion, that chain, from start to finish would still be hallmarked Hellenism, no matter how impure or less sparkling those links became as they stretched out...representing time continuum.

The sparkle of the first Greeks no modern people can compare, those ancient Hellenic dudes set the standards, their Ideals and core values still resonate...don't they ???

Todays Greeks represent the ending part of that chain, they occupy the last few link places of that hallmarked chain, their sparkle may have diminished somewhat but Greeks they are, and Greeks they remain, no matter how impure, even with that fragmention todays Greeks are still the closest living modern people to the ancient Greeks.

Todays Greeks are obligated...both morally and legally to protect and defend Hellenism. Todays Greeks may have incurred impurites along the way but they have not become detached from the original chain, the last links of that hallmarked chain are just as Greek as the first links.

Hellenism...Trade Mark or a Hallmark belongs to Greeks, right!

legendThreads: 9 Posts: 819 Joined: Apr 23, 11 ♂	Jun 29, 11, 04:03 #109
as long as you got some Polish blood your Polish enough.

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Edited by: PennBoy Jun 29, 11, 04:37 #110

josh sklodowski:

I keep hearing that Poles are racist. My experiences have been good. But, afraid to engage with the community for fear of what they'll think. I'm afraid they'll say, "Wtf is this blakc kid doing here? He's not one of us. Go away." lol you know? I already get **** from some blacks because they think I'm trying to be less black when really I am black AND polish, you know? It's my ancestry.

Don't worry about it. Former Polish president Aleksander Kwasniewski was in New York some years back and was greeted by a African-American/Polish mix girl in a Krakowianka outfit he was most shocked when she started speaking Polish to him. True story.

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Havok Jun 29, 11, 05:51 #111

josh sklodowski:

My Mom's from Jefferson Park. My Dad's from West Englewood. I'm Polish and Black. I've always considered myself Polish-American (Half Polish when under pressure.) Do I count? How accepting is the Polish-American community on such issues surrounding mixed race Poles?

Personally I think you're Polish-American unless you know the county of the origin of the other half, but seriously you need to check with delphiandomine, he truly calls all the shots on any Polishness issues on this forum.

modafinilThreads: - Posts: 831 Joined: Jun 28, 11 ♂	Jun 29, 11, 07:16 #112
josh sklodowski: I've read about the social differences in regards to mixed-race individuals in the UK, for example, and the US. In the UK you are more likly to be 'classed' by your actions than what your parents were/are. When Einstein came up with his theory of relativity, he said of the German people, "If I am right, they'll say I'm a German, if proved wrong, a Jew".

confuseddotcom

Jun 29, 11, 10:44 #113

josh sklodowski:

keep hearing that Poles are racist. My experiences have been good. But, afraid to engage with the community for fear of what they'll think. I'm afraid they'll say, "Wtf is this blakc kid doing here? He's not one of us. Go away." lol you know? I already get **** from some blacks because they think I'm trying to be less black when really I am black AND polish, you know? It's my ancestry. If I were polish and Russian, non one would bother me. But, because race is in the way all of a sudden it's a bad thing.

When I was younger, my grandmother would comfort me by telling me about her mother who was from southern France and supposedly could tan really well.

Idk. I've been made so racially self-conscious. I'm not complaining. I know I've had it easy. Race relations are better, regardless of what people say. But, it bothers me that my own people wouldn't want anything to do with me.

Why don't you just be "American"?

markskibniewskiThreads: 4 Posts: 357 Joined: May 31, 09 ♂	Jan 13, 12, 14:53 #114
PennBoy: I was in northern New Jersey a few months back and in one day saw two separate Polish men with black girls!! I have never seen that here in PA and there are much fewer Poles here I don't mean to burst your bubble but there are a hell of a lot more Polish Americans in Pa than there are in NJ. Philly has over 65,000 of them alone.

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