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Chcę and chce


posts: 21

ZoeThreads: 1
Posts: 1
Joined: Jul 21, 11 ♂ 		 Sep 17, 11, 16:26    #1
Both are pronounced same, right? How can we distinguish?
ZazulkaThreads: 4
Posts: 111
Joined: Aug 13, 11 ♀ 		Edited by: Zazulka  Sep 17, 11, 16:37    #2
Both are pronounced same, right? How can we distinguish?

No, they are pronouced differently
ę en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%98

Ja chcę ( I want)
On chce (He wants)
catsoldierThreads: 90
Posts: 697
Joined: Sep 27, 09 ♂ 		Edited by: catsoldier  Sep 17, 11, 16:45    #3
Both are pronounced same, right? How can we distinguish?

In theory both are not pronounced the same but in practice they are. In theory you should pronounce ę which has a different pronunciation to e.

Chcę, you say it wihout ja and people will understand that it is you who wants something.

If a you are saying that he or she wants something you put on or ona or ono before chce and then everyone knows that he or she or it wants something. You use ono for neutral nouns like dziecko etc.

By the way, why is your name Zoe? In English that is a girls name as far as I know.
ZazulkaThreads: 4
Posts: 111
Joined: Aug 13, 11 ♀ 		 Sep 17, 11, 16:56    #4
In theory both are not pronounced the same but in practice they are.


I never do.
Ę pronounced as E comes from the Wielkopolski dialekt. So in the western part of Poland ę and e sound the same very often.
a.k.  Sep 17, 11, 17:21    #5
I never do.
Ę pronounced as E comes from the Wielkopolski dialekt. So in the western part of Poland ę and e sound the same very often.


Most Poland do, and it's even not correct to pronounce ę in every word at the end. Please say: RobiĘ to co chcĘ and tell me if it sounded natural and not like French...
ZazulkaThreads: 4
Posts: 111
Joined: Aug 13, 11 ♀ 		 Sep 17, 11, 17:34    #6
Sometimes chcę is pronounced as chcem. I believe this pronunciation is common in the areas where immigrants from Vilno settled after the war.
Lech Wałęsa is famous for pronouncing chcę as chcem. He famous for saying: Nie chcem, ale muszem.
Zman  Sep 17, 11, 17:35    #7
Ę is pronounced here and there. But substituting e for ę is common indeed.
a.k.  Sep 17, 11, 17:53    #8
Ę is pronounced here and there. But substituting e for ę is common indeed.


When I was saying a poem in school years ago, every kid tried to pronounce ę in every word because we though that's how it should be... teacher told us that's incorrect. I also know that language speacialist says that's not vert correct.
ZazulkaThreads: 4
Posts: 111
Joined: Aug 13, 11 ♀ 		 Sep 17, 11, 17:58    #9
RobiĘ to co chcĘ


Fur sure it shouldn't be pronounced like Robie to co chce.

Yes, ę has lost half of its nosowość but not all. Lubaś W., Urbańczyk S., Podręczny słownik poprawnej wymowy polskiej, Warszawa 1990
Some nosowość should still be heard in RobiĘ to co chcĘ and you are right, not like it sounds in French. Loosing nosowość completely is simply a sloppy speech.
pawianThreads: 90
Posts: 5,395
Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Sep 17, 11, 22:18    #10
=Zazulka]Fur sure it shouldn't be pronounced like Robie to co chce.

Maybe it shouldn`t but it is. And in result it becomes normal.
peter_olsztynThreads: 8
Posts: 760
Joined: Apr 18, 07  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 Sep 17, 11, 22:24    #11
How can we distinguish?

from context ;)
Chcę bardzo ale czy dam radę? (I want)
Chce bardzo ale czy da radę? (he/she/it)
ShAlEyNsTfOhThreads: 8
Posts: 232
Joined: Feb 5, 11  Pictures: 4 ♂ [Suspended] 		Edited by: ShAlEyNsTfOh  Sep 18, 11, 00:49    #12
why do many Poles often neglect the final 'ę' in words??

my mother taught me to ALWAYS pronounce it clearly... like in the phrase 'Lubię Cię'.

Of course, since polish is generally spoken really quickly, that sound obviously would be omitted for the most part.

But still, just like when she pronounces the word 'język'... she doesn't say 'JEN-zyk', like soo many videos on youtube teach, for example... she says 'ję' nasalized! ~ THE PROPER WAY!.. like in french

I don't think it's even possible to spell it phonetically, when properly spoken, with a nasal.
pawianThreads: 90
Posts: 5,395
Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  Sep 18, 11, 00:56    #13
=ShAlEyNsTfOh]why do many Poles often neglect the final 'ę' in words??

For the same reason that so many Brits and Ams eat parts of words while they speak English.
ZoeThreads: 1
Posts: 1
Joined: Jul 21, 11 ♂ 		 Sep 18, 11, 20:27    #14
I know how to pronounce ę but I noticed in a song, the singer pronounces chcę as if it is chce. I thought you can ommit on, ona and ono from the sentence. By the way I dont know about the english name zoe is a key word, z, o and e stands for something.
mafketisThreads: 17
Posts: 1,880
Joined: Mar 31, 08 ♂ 		 Sep 18, 11, 20:52    #15
First there are four pronunciations of word final -ę

-ę (full pronunciation with a final u sound) required on one word, się, when it's stressed, also occaionally but overuse will make you sound like a tool

-ę (some nasalization but no u sound, pretty common)

-e (most common pronunciation)

-em (stigmatized unless used for comic effect)

Again, despite what some people think, most Polish speakers most of the time pronounce word final -ę as -e.

That said, always pronouncing -ę as -e would sound kind of sloppy just as pronouncing the full version as -ę (with the u sound at the end) would sound bizarre.

Some years ago I read a paper by a very eminent Polonist (and phonetician) who said (paraphrasing): the best option is to pronounce some instances of -ę as written and other as -e. The implication was that it was up to the speaker to decide which to use when but that the speaker should strive for a mix of -e and -ę.
Guest  Sep 18, 11, 22:53    #16
Zoe, there's a rule that in song ę should be pronounced as e. God knows what it is for.
bigsquiddd  Feb 11, 12, 22:30    #17
Merged: Chcę + genitive

Hi guys,

Why does "Checieć" take genitive in the sentences "Chcę słodkiego naleśnika", "Chcę zimnego drinka" but accusative in most others "Chcę czerwony samochod" or "Chcę nowy komputer" na przykład?

Same verb taking different cases?

Dzięki.
AlligatorThreads: -
Posts: 350
Joined: Dec 15, 10 ♂ 		 Feb 12, 12, 00:07    #18
In polish language there is something like partial genitive (dopełniacz cząstkowy). You use it, when you talk about indefinite part of a whole.
You use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you want to say about indefinite quantity of something.
So when you say "chcę zimnego drinka" you mean by that you want some/ much/ glass...
You also use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you talk about something abstract, e.g. chcę wolności.
You use "chcieć" with accusative, when you talk about something definite and considered as a whole "Chcę czerwony samochód".

That doesn't mean, that partial genitive is only applied to uncountable nouns. It is true in most cases, but not all.
For example "naleśniki" may be considered as countable and uncountable.
In your example "Chcę słodkiego naleśnika" - although you used singular noun, if you apply partial genitive, it will mean that you want some naleśniki (indefinite amount). Naleśniki may be considered here as a dish and you want part of it.
If you would say "chcę slodki naleśnik", it will mean that you want 1 sweet pancake.
Also, if you say "chcę wody", it will mean you want some indefinite amount of water. But, for example you are in shop and you ask for a botlle of water, you may say "chcę wodę".
See, not complicated at all ;)
Hope that will help:)
bigsquiddd  Feb 12, 12, 16:27    #19
Thanks for the excellent explanation. I knew it'd be so simple;)
BuffaloMThreads: -
Posts: 1
Joined: May 16, 12 ♂ 		 May 16, 12, 02:34    #20
mafketis:
-em (stigmatized unless used for comic effect)


Can anyone give more detail on this? Thanks.
carnationThreads: -
Posts: 1
Joined: May 16, 12 ♀ 		 May 16, 12, 22:50    #21
Usually we use "chcem" to make fun of people who do not know ortography or pretend to be "stupid" or for parodies... :)


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