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Polish was chosen the HARDEST LANGUAGE in the world to learn... :D


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FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,821
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 16, 10, 23:00    #811
hey Seanus,

5 hedgehogs!
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 16, 10, 23:17    #812
My money wouldn't be thrust forward with any conviction but I am guessing 'pięc jeży' without checking.
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 14:35    #813
..then just go ahead and join Mr. Mark Twain in the 'niemiecki kącik':

'I'd rather decline two drinks than one German adjective.'

LOL
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 17:39    #814
My euro's on 'pięć jeżów', but then, I'm only guessin' -:))))
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 17:55    #815
Let's ask the experts, shall we? Any Poles here care to enlighten us?
BorrkaThreads: 49
Posts: 769
Joined: Apr 25, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:04    #816
Piec jezy or pieciu Jerzych lol.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:09    #817
Thanks, Borrka. That clears it up.

Any more teasers, Borrka?
z_dariusThreads: 22
Posts: 5,091
Joined: Oct 18, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:11    #818
Seanus:
I am guessing 'pięc jeży' without checking.

bingo
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 18:12    #819
dzięki, uczycielowi!
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 18:16    #820
Uj, przepraszam! .....nauczycielOM, Darku, i Borrku:-))) lol
z_dariusThreads: 22
Posts: 5,091
Joined: Oct 18, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:17    #821
Lyzko:
uczycielowi!

that's either russified Polish or polonized Russian :)
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 18:21    #822
I deserved that one, mój drug.

Spasibuję he-he-he!!!!!
BorrkaThreads: 49
Posts: 769
Joined: Apr 25, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:38    #823
An annoying mistake but quite common by Polish politician and even TV moderators or weather girls:

"w cudzyslowiu" or "w cudzyslowie" ?
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 18:45    #824
Interesting. Good to know, I'm sure.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		Edited by: Seanus  Apr 17, 10, 18:49    #825
The first one, Borrka. I'm fairly sure it's correct from hearing it many times.

Oh, unless it's like poszłem and the correct poszedłem.
BorrkaThreads: 49
Posts: 769
Joined: Apr 25, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:56    #826
It's "w cudzyslowie" just because we use to say "w slowie" and not w "slowiu".
mafketisThreads: 15
Posts: 1,830
Joined: Mar 31, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 18:57    #827
'w cudzysłowie' is 'correct' in the prescriptive sense, though you can hear both in use.
pgtxThreads: 48
Posts: 6,269
Joined: Feb 14, 09 ♀ [Moderator] 		 Apr 17, 10, 19:01    #828
mafketis:
though you can hear both in use.

just like "sobie" and "se"...
;)
Lyzko  Apr 17, 10, 20:26    #829
'Got a weird sort of feeling that "vulgar" Polish must look/sound a lot like Russian. After all, higher-level Turkish, begins to resumble Arabic (minus the "turkified" vocabulary of Ataturk's language purge!) and I've read that ultra-honorific Japanese looks a great deal like Chinese vs. street-level Japanese without most of the kanji characters.

Merely a theory of mine, that's all.
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,821
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 21:35    #830
hey seanus,

5 games!
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 21:47    #831
5 games? :)
mafketisThreads: 15
Posts: 1,830
Joined: Mar 31, 08 ♂ 		Edited by: mafketis  Apr 17, 10, 23:10    #832
pieć gier???

pgtx:
just like "sobie" and "se"... ;)


Well on purely _linguistic_ grounds, there's nothing wrong with 'se' 'poszłem' 'jest do góry' etc etc etc

If a significant number of native speakers say something, then by definition it's correct grammatically. That's a fundamental tenent of linguistics, without which the science of language could not exist.

On the other hand, they might not be socially approved of anymore than spitting on the sidewalk or eating bigos with your fingers are, and that's fine, but at the same time that's a very different set of criteria.

By all means correct a teenager who says 'poszłem' if they want a good job, but don't use linguistics or grammar as your excuse (anymore than you would use physics to discourage people from scratching themselves in public).
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,821
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 17, 10, 23:36    #833
piec gier......that would be correct. nicely done.

i've always thought that "piec gier" was one of the ugliest ones.....
PepeczkiThreads: -
Posts: 40
Joined: Apr 17, 10 ♀ 		 Apr 17, 10, 23:46    #834
You have to be pretty stupid to believe in some half-assed survey. A language will be hard if you don´t invest time in learning it.
SzwedwPolsceThreads: 12
Posts: 1,915
Joined: Feb 21, 09 ♂ 		Edited by: SzwedwPolsce  Apr 18, 10, 12:58    #835
Pepeczki:
A language will be hard if you don´t invest time in learning it.

Very true. Many people say it's too hard to learn Polish. But they don't understand that all languages are difficult in the beginning, and that you must work very hard if you want to be able to speak a new language. It's all about motivation.
mafketisThreads: 15
Posts: 1,830
Joined: Mar 31, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 18, 10, 13:02    #836
FUZZYWICKETS:
i've always thought that "piec gier" was one of the ugliest ones.....


Yeah, i think gier is ugly, but it's completely regular

gra + genetive plural = subtract the -a

- this leaves you with the unpronounceable gr so you insert an -e- between them,

- the sequence ge- istn't allowed in Polish roots (only in some borrowings) so it becomes -ie-

which leaves gier, completely regular
Lyzko  Apr 18, 10, 23:20    #837
Many say also that English is 'too hard', yet hundreds of millions of us speak it (sometimes, as a first and primary language), but are we all geniuses, resp/ genii?:-)
crusaderThreads: 4
Posts: 79
Joined: Jan 25, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 21, 10, 22:49    #838
Until recently I would have said that Polish was difficult to learn, but then I started learning Arabic- now THAT'S difficult!
Lyzko  Apr 23, 10, 14:13    #839
Difficulties in language, ranked accordingly:

ENGLISH - chaotic spelling, totally irregular pronunciation, phrasal verbs right and left,
slang usage where most languages prefer standard.

POLISH - myriad inflections based either on gender (three genera!), number, case or
ALL of the former:-), unpredictable endings plus a most intricate counting
system. Fairly regular pronunciation though, if a trifle consonant heavy for
most Westerners' tastes:-)

GERMAN - Eight (yes, 8!!!) separate plural forms for nouns, not to mention many with
ZERO plural markers, making them by themselves indistinguishable from the
singular form, three genders (just like Polish) but with individual articles for
each 'der', 'die', 'das' (masc., fem., neuter), a contortedly dizzying sentence
construction, separable and inseparable verb prefixes and four maddeningly
precise series of case endings (three less than Polish, however LOL).

CHINESE - Seemingly hundreds of thousands of ideographs!!!

ARABIC - A mostly foreign-looking word stock, a language written right to left, therefore
the polar opposite from most other languages and composed in a non-Roman
script and a tricky pronunciation with glottal stops etc.. not found in most
European languages.
ZiemowitThreads: 10
Posts: 1,056
Joined: May 8, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 23, 10, 17:39    #840
A nice description of the difficulties in some of the languages in current use on the planet, Lyzko. I agree with you on German; inflections of 'der', 'die', 'das' in three genders of singular or plural depending on whether the noun is accompanied or not by an adjective may seem nearly as catastrophic for a Polish learner of German as the world of the declinations of nouns for th German learner of Polish.

Nobody here has been talking of the difficulties in using Polish collective numerals for quite a long time now! I have been tracking the spontaneous use of them by native Polish speakers in the streets or elsewhere since the latest discussions on this issue in this thread. I might write down some of my observations here when I have more time and if anyone is still interested in the subject!

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