Pan vs. pan

♂

Edited by: Leopejo Mar 4, 11, 16:11 #1

What is the extent of a capitalized Pan, Pani, Panowie, Panie, Państwo?

I know you should use capitalized 'P' when politely addressing someone in a letter, but what about (written accounts of) dialogues, or in novels? I'm asking because all my Polish textbooks use small 'p': Jak się pan ma?

As a comparison, in Italian you do always capitalize 'Lei' when meaning 'you' (Pan, Pani), as 'lei' only means 'she'.

P.S. I'm only asking of Pan meaning polite 'you', not 'mister, man, lady, girl, facet'.

k ...	Mar 4, 11, 16:15 #2
when we write letter we use Pan/Pani. When we speak about another person or in books we use small pan/pani

Lyzko	Mar 4, 11, 20:14 #3
When addressing another person, i.e. transcribing a conversation in a language book, one writes "Pan(i)___!" capitalized instead say, "Dzień dobry, pan(i) Kowalska!", lower case.

♂

Mar 5, 11, 01:52 #4

well I think k... had it about right - you only use capitalized Pan/Pani (meaning 'you') to show respect and it is basically restricted to correspondence - other persons mentioned in the same letter (not being the addressee) should not get their pan/i title capitalized. The same goes for the Państwo title.

as the persons titled pan/pani in literary works are not the addressees of the work they go without the capital letter

I hope my explanaition is intelligible

LeopejoThreads: 6 Posts: 154 Joined: Sep 16, 09 ♂	Mar 5, 11, 09:51 #5
Thanks k..., Lyzko and gumishu. So I take it than in a novel you'd have a dialog: - Dzień dobry, pani Kowalska! - Dzień dobry, panie profesorze.

Lyzko	Mar 5, 11, 14:02 #6
Well, both would still be capitalized in direct address. Indirect mention would then of course be lower case. Compare: "Dzień dobry, Pani Kowalska!" cf. "Już pozdrawiłem pani Kowalskę."

♀

Edited by: strzyga Mar 5, 11, 14:29 #7

Leopejo:

- Dzień dobry, pani Kowalska!- Dzień dobry, panie profesorze.

that's right :)

Lyzko:

Well, both would still be capitalized in direct address. Indirect mention would then of course be lower case. Compare: "Dzień dobry, Pani Kowalska!"

not unless it's the heading of a letter, just as it has been said above. Direct or indirect, you don't capitalize pan/i in dialogues, books, when relating conversations, etc.

Lyzko:

"Już pozdrawiłem pani Kowalskę."

pozdrowiłem panią Kowalską

Lyzko	Mar 5, 11, 15:03 #8
Dzięki znów, Stzrygu-:))

ZiemowitThreads: 10 Posts: 1,063 Joined: May 8, 09 ♂	Mar 15, 11, 11:36 #9
It should be: 'Dzięki, Sztrzygo!' or 'Dzięki, Strzyguniu!'. It seems [will anyone check it somewhere?] that singular nouns which end in a soft consonant will take the -u ending in the vocative case irrespectively of their gender. I remember John Paul II telling the pilgrims in Licheń who were greeting him with "Witaj w Licheniu!": - I just thought you were shouting at me: "Witaj, ty leniu!"

LeopejoThreads: 6 Posts: 154 Joined: Sep 16, 09 ♂	Mar 15, 11, 12:48 #10
Ziemowit: It seems [will anyone check it somewhere?] that singular nouns which end in a soft consonant will take the -u ending in the vocative case irrespectively of their gender. Miłości i wolności, potrzebuję was.

Lyzko	Mar 16, 11, 12:58 #11
Dziękuję znów, Ziemowicie-:)

POLAND . The Unofficial Guide	Unanswered \| Archives
POLAND . The Unofficial Guide	Poland and Polish Community	Witamy, Guest \| PF Members \| Gold Members

Home \| Unanswered \| Archives \| Random \| Statistics	Time in Poland: 16:43 / May 26
About Us \| Contact Us \| Rules, Privacy \| Poland Advertising	© 2005-12 PolishForums.com