Grumpy diplomacy hurts Poland

Ok if that's true we can call it quits. Stop complaining.


attitudes after the fall of the iron curtain have changed. The smell of opportunity
is in the air for some





Poland is helping Ukraine into the EU. They pass on good deeds. They help the dissadvantaged because it is the right thing to do - just like Germany helped Poland.
Or did Germany have something else in mind?

I think we are on two different frequencies here Ogorek!

You find it democratic when one little newcomer holds up a summit of 26 members who just wanted to subscribe to something which was agreed on earlier...throwing tantrums as they don't get their wishes. THAT IS DEMOCRACY FOR YOU!

You find it "bossing around" if the bigger countries who support you with so much money every year want to have a say too.

People like you love it to p*ss at the EU too...remember the buying of the american F-16 instead of the european fighters? Are you for the US-missile base too? Even knowing that most other EU-members are against it??? Not to mention the Iraq-affair...

You sh*t on the EU and what it stands for....your only in for the money and have no shame to play the role of the trojan horse, the pawn for the US against the EU.
Your government has no problems to insult their neighbours and you wonder why other Europeans won't take you seriously???

The mood is against another East-enlargement...you spoilt it I think...

Do me a favour and watch this film. You may learn something.

"12 Angry men"

A 12-man jury is sent to begin deliberations in the first-degree murder trial of an 18-year-old Latino accused in the stabbing death of his father, where a guilty verdict means an automatic death sentence. The case appears to be open-and-shut: The defendant has a weak alibi; a knife he claimed to have lost is found at the murder scene; and several witnesses either heard screaming, saw the killing or the boy fleeing the scene. Eleven of the jurors immediately vote guilty; only Juror No. 8 (Mr. Davis, played by Henry Fonda) casts a not guilty vote. At first Mr. Davis' bases his vote moreso for the sake of discussion after all, the jurors must believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant is guilty. As the deliberations unfold, the story quickly becomes a study of the jurors' complex personalities (which range from wise, bright and empathetic to arrogant, prejudiced and merciless)

Don't give me that crap Ogorek!

Poland isn't the lonely upstanding righteous against a mean conspiracy!
(...maybe in your imagination...)

I know Poles like to see themselves that way but that doesn't make it true...

Why don't you react to MY points instead of bringing a movie to this discussion?

The film is not about a mean conspiracy - just about people
who think they are right - but have not taken ALL views before
making a decision. The lonely upstanding man saves the boys life.

Do you really think the EU as the ones out to get the boy's life???
Do you really think Poland as "upstanding" (for someone else not for themselves!)
Who is the "boy" here???

If that's your view on the EU you should better leave....

That's why UK doesn't want in...

Ok - more positive example

" Flight of the Phoenix " please tell me you seen this.

Team work. German plane maker (Hardy Krüger) has idea to build plane
the brit (Richard Attenborough) keeps the moral, the scott distiles the water, etc etc they all build together and the US (James Stewart) fly the plane to safety.
Working together in harmony:)

Why do you avoid MY points Ogorek?
Too close to home?

PS: Last time I looked the UK is "IN"....
(making the masses of Poles emigrating possible in the first place)

I don't know why - not qualified to comment. Are you?
- maybe they got discount? The US Boeing jet is outselling the Euroliner



If it's what they say it's for - to protect us (EU) from terrorist missiles/threats then
can't be a bad thing can it? (flight of Phoenix e.g.)


you are more crazy then me if you beleive that :)



that what EU is about - freedom of movement. You lucky , you have it good in Germany so you don't need to move around

Bratwurst Boy - sorry have to go to work. some answered but I don't really know to tell you the truth - I'm just a plod here in UK working for a living.

Which truth???

Maybe you should open a thread about movies instead...you seem to know about these at least!

Ogorek, it sounds like you are referring to "groupthink". I have mentioned this before somewhere.....

"Groupthink is a type of thought exhibited by group members who try to minimize conflict and reach consensus without critically testing, analyzing, and evaluating ideas. During Groupthink,members of the group avoid promoting viewpoints outside the comfort zone of consensus thinking."

wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink

This is also what contributed to the NASA space shuttle failure involving the faulty O-Rings. Everybody on the team knew there was trouble with the O-rings. But the higher officials were under a lot of pressure to move the project forward, and costs mounted daily. One guy spoke up and suggested the launch be scrapped. There was a lot of tension and pressure, so the team member defaulted to the pressure, and went ahead with the project....hoipng everything would turn out ok. :(

My point is that the "lone voice" in the group can be the critical factor in avoiding mayhem later on. I don't know if that is the role that Poland was playing with the vote system, cause I don't understand it completely. My point is, that I see what Ogorek is talking about.....this is a real phenomenon......and I have seen it personally at work in a team (in my case I was the "lone voice" and nearly got the sh!t kicked out of me for disagreeing with everyone else (they called a vote on whether to cast me out of the group-we ended up calling in an arbitrator), and later when it was revealed that I was right and they were wrong, they were amazingly silent....and I was livid!). If you ever have the opp to experience this dynamic for yourself....you will not soon forget it. :)

Wrong comparison here!

This treaty was discussed between the member states for years. At last a compromise was found. A compromise the then current polish government agreed to....then came the ducks!

Well.....don't be too surprised if other "newbies" come in and try to challenge the status quo.
:) *hugs Bratski*

Yeah well...than they shouldn't be surprised when the "Oldies" slap their wrists...

*hugs Shopski back*

And that, dear Bratski is how stuff gets worked out....whether it's in the EU....Congress.....Parliment......the Sejm.....or relationships :)

*more hugs* :)

Respect to the oldies for sorting it out, but please give some of the younger blood a chance :)

but in all seriousness all countries have their problems with the EU