Anger at yet another Polish tragedy

MarcinDThreads: 5 Posts: 96 Joined: Jun 10, 08 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 04:00 #1
Why does this continue to happen to our great nation? We already have arguably the most un-appreciated history and this crap keeps happening? POLISH YOUTH - we need to step up and bring this nation to the greatness it once had and deserves! Whose with me? ! ?

Mr GrunwaldThreads: 34 Posts: 2,358 Joined: Dec 16, 08 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 04:19 #2
I hope you won't try to start any type of Uprising... I am not pissed. I am sad... just sad

richasisThreads: 5 Posts: 833 Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 07:36 #3
MarcinD: POLISH YOUTH - we need to step up and bring this nation to the greatness it once had and deserves! Forget about it... you're Americanized - Westernized - now...

♂

Apr 11, 10, 07:49 #4

Sadly, it is only tragedies that seem to bring Poles close in solidarity. Otherwise, we are a bickering nation always fighting each other. We need to learn to strive for the same goals.. A STRONG, UNITED AND FREE Poland...

We'd be fooling ourselves if we thought we were any of these things... Certainly not strong enough in the political landscape. Certainly not united, and certainly not free of dirty EU, NATO, US hands meddling in our affairs...

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 15:53 #5
MarcinD: Whose with me? ! ? Might want to move to Poland first, then throw in a bit of water, sugar, some drozdze, let that rise for a while then back for 45 minutes. What exactly are you proposing?

Mr GrunwaldThreads: 34 Posts: 2,358 Joined: Dec 16, 08 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 15:56 #6
convex: Might want to move to Poland first, Ive started to plan that yesterday allready 1. Get a job 2. Get enough money 3. Get enough contacts or good recomendation 4. Buy a ticket

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Apr 11, 10, 17:17 #7

MarcinD:

Why does this continue to happen to our great nation? We already have arguably the most un-appreciated history and this crap keeps happening?

For many years now, I've expressed the opinion that the one thing Poles are terrible at is Promotional Relations (PR). Other groups have PR'd themselves into the best possible spot light but that aspect of self promotion seems to be almost non existent in Poland and Polonia.

There is much rich history, many battles, many heroes and lots of innovation that is unappreciated by the west. I've often heard other Poles state, "we know the truth" but does that matter if others don't know it? It may or may not but it's still important.

This recent tragedy is still not adequately spotlighted in the west. Todays Chicago Tribune
has it as story number three on page one. (The SunTimes has it as a cover story) and this is in Chicago(land) where the metropolitan area has about one million Poles out of nine million residents.

Unfortunately, the truth is not known but what is perceived as truth is so that's where PR is important. Work on it Poles!

richasisThreads: 5 Posts: 833 Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 18:26 #8
Filios1: certainly not free of dirty EU, NATO, US hands meddling in our affairs... Agreed. convex: Might want to move to Poland first Exactly.

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Apr 11, 10, 21:41 #9

MarcinD:

We already have arguably the most un-appreciated history

Isn't that what the Poles like to tell themselves, so they can indulge in feeling sorry for themselves?

I for one know for sure that the Polish history is greatly respected and appreciated in the Netherlands - they helped to liberate my country and many Dutch were/are still grateful for that.

MarcinD:

POLISH YOUTH - we need to step up and bring this nation to the greatness it once had and deserves!

This sounds actually pretty scary, if you don't mind my saying so.

Filios1:

dirty EU

I thought you were a Greek? If so, the EU has saved Greece once again - so far for dirty EU.

ZIMMY:

This recent tragedy is still not adequately spotlighted in the west. Todays Chicago Tribune

I noticed that English languaged countries tend to undervalue any news from non-English countries anyway. It is frontpage news in the Dutch newspapers for two days now. Might be the difference between continental (Western-) Europe and the Anglo-Irish-American world.

>^..^<

M-G (tiens)

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Apr 11, 10, 21:54 #10

We have to really feel for those sensitive and caring Poles at this time!! Solidarity came through and won over the people once before and can do so again. I second what Filios said above, bickering needs to stop!

Being self piteous is not what is needed here. On the face of it, it appears to have been a mistake and they happen. The black box is being thoroughly investigated. Let's not be defensive here! There was a bad judgement made and we all rue that.

Don't feel angry, try and move on without this constant locking of horns. It can be done!

MareGaeaThreads: 45 Posts: 5,527 Joined: Feb 6, 08 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 23:23 #11
Of course we have to, Seanus, and I do feel sorry for their terrible loss. I went to a Polish church here in Dublin to light up a candle and I have expressed my sympathy to my Polish friends over here. I appreciate the fact that it must be extremely tough on them and I do feel for them. >^..^< M-G (again: Requiescat In Pace for the poor victims of this horrible accident)

Filios1Threads: 15 Posts: 1,953 Joined: Nov 13, 07 ♂	Edited by: Filios1 Apr 11, 10, 23:26 #12
MareGaea: so, the EU has saved Greece once again Do you realize that it was the EU who put Greece in the position in the first place? It is the agenda of the EU to level each European nation, and to control them financially. They have succeeded in Greece, thats for sure. They have made them dependent like a heroine addict. MareGaea: I thought you were a Greek? I'm a half-breed.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 23:28 #13
Anger is only inverted depression after all so we can understand. I'm glad that a week of mourning has been called. Businesses should be closed so people can capture the spirit of it.

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Apr 11, 10, 23:31 #14

Filios1:

Do you realize that it was the EU who put Greece in the position in the first place?

Oh pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase!

Greece faked the books to gain entry at any cost. Greece got for decades money from the EU structural support funds and what not. Half of Greece works for a totally bloated government where they retire with high pensions years before than in other countries, the other half is more used to bribery than paying taxes.

Of course it's now easy to blame others for your own faults but the only thing what will keep you afloat is again the EU! So keep it real, would you!

Alot of EUians would be glad if they wouldn't had to pay for you, why don't you just leave...

♂

Edited by: MareGaea Apr 11, 10, 23:37 #15

Filios1:

Do you realize that it was the EU who put Greece in the position in the first place?

Not sure about that. The Greek government was all too eager to join the Euro zone and they did revamp the financial figures as they knew that they would be excluded from it if the deficit would be higher than the 3 per cent allowed.

Greece has always been one of the poorest countries in the EU, imo they have greatly benefited from their membership and in fact I think they should really be glad that the others are willing to help them out (all the other member states are chipping in - each one pays what it can afford as I understand it) as they hardly can get credit anywhere else in the world. But since a bancrupt Greece would seriously compromise the EU and endanger the Euro, there was nothing else to do for the remaining member states than to help them out. And, as I read it, it's a loan not subsidy, they have to pay 5 per cent interest.

Seanus:

Businesses should be closed

Now, THAT would definitively cause the Polish economy to feel the effects of this tragedy. So I don't think that would be a good idea.

>^..^<

M-G (under Lisbon, countries are free to leave the EU, btw)

EurolaThreads: 6 Posts: 2,647 Joined: Dec 2, 06 ♀	Apr 11, 10, 23:41 #16
Seanus: Businesses should be closed so people can capture the spirit of it. yeah...sure...close the businesses and schools for a week and keep the church open... The only day they should close is the day of funeral. Otherwise, there is plenty of time to express your sorrow and attend church services after work or school.

MareGaeaThreads: 45 Posts: 5,527 Joined: Feb 6, 08 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 23:49 #17
Eurola: The only day they should close is the day of funeral My words :) >^..^< M-G (tiens)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 23:52 #18
It's hardly mourning when people are focussed on their jobs and school. Why put a 1 week time on it then? Why not just let some people mourn eternally as some people never get over deaths?

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Apr 11, 10, 23:55 #19

Seanus:

It's hardly mourning when people are focussed on their jobs and school. Why put a 1 week time on it then? Why not just let some people mourn eternally as some people never get over deaths?

But Seanus, you are an advocate of ppl not sticking in the past. While I do appreciate that a week of mourning is needed for PL, there comes a time that life has to take its regular course again. And even though it is terrible what happened, Kaczynski was a president and there will be more presidents. Should ppl always compare future presidents with Kaczynski for "what Lech would've done"? Don't think that's a good idea. A week should be ok, and probably the hurt will last a little longer, but at one point life goes on, how hard and impssbl it may seem. And it should be like that.

>^..^<

M-G (tiens)

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Apr 11, 10, 23:57 #20

Just so everyone knows, Canada and it's broadcasting stations are doing an excellent job at covering this tragedy and shedding some much needed "spotlight" on the history of Katyń. It's very nice to see, I have to admit. Toronto and the province of Ontario have a large Polish community and the national broadcasters like CBC and CTV are giving a lot of air time to this disaster. They even showed footage of Prime Minister Stephen Harper visiting the Polish consulate in Ottawa. So the western Anglo nations do care.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Apr 11, 10, 23:57 #21
Where do people get their bread and stuff with everything closed for so long?

EvalinaThreads: 1 Posts: 9 Joined: Apr 11, 10 ♀	Apr 11, 10, 23:58 #22
MarcinD: POLISH YOUTH - we need to step up and bring this nation to the greatness it once had and deserves! I'm not youth anymore (well, I am in my heart) but I'm Polish and I'm with you!

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Apr 12, 10, 00:27 #23
It's not sticking in the past, it's sticking in the present, M-G. If you are going to officially proclaim a week of mourning, honour it. I just hope that Kaczyński didn't force the pilot to go against orders and his better judgement.

ZIMMYThreads: 10 Posts: 2,353 Joined: Feb 21, 09 ♂	Apr 12, 10, 01:14 #24
Bratwurst Boy: Where do people get their bread and stuff with everything closed for so long? Can't reveal the answer as it falls under the 'Ancient Polish Secrets Act" (APSC). It's a system developed by Sarmatian farmers which innoculates Poles against hunger. During one period of time, I didn't eat for 3 weeks and gained 5 pounds.

wildroverThreads: 180 Posts: 8,188 Joined: Jun 7, 07 ♂	Apr 12, 10, 01:15 #25
Bratwurst Boy: Where do people get their bread and stuff with everything closed for so long? There are little local shops open in the villages...there is always somewhere you can get some food....don,t worry my friend..we will not go hungry...

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Edited by: convex Apr 12, 10, 01:21 #26
Bratwurst Boy: Where do people get their bread and stuff with everything closed for so long? 24 hours? Gas stations and some restaurants were open today :)

♂

Apr 12, 10, 01:23 #27

Bratwurst Boy:

Oh pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase!

Greece faked the books to gain entry at any cost. Greece got for decades money from the EU structural support funds and what not. Half of Greece works for a totally bloated government where they retire with high pensions years before than in other countries, the other half is more used to bribery than paying taxes.

Of course it's now easy to blame others for your own faults but the only thing what will keep you afloat is again the EU! So keep it real, would you!

Alot of EUians would be glad if they wouldn't had to pay for you, why don't you just leave...

Greeks just don't fit in EU with their corruption on every level of society and tradition of tax evading.They are Balkan ppl just like Bulgarians and should be greatfull for admiting them to EU.

ZIMMYThreads: 10 Posts: 2,353 Joined: Feb 21, 09 ♂	Apr 12, 10, 01:32 #28
Here's a nice article praising Poland. http://townhall.com/columnists/WThomasSmithJr/2010/04/10/poland_will_s urvive_this_day

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Apr 12, 10, 02:48 #29
wildrover: There are little local shops open in the villages...there is always somewhere you can get some food....don,t worry my friend..we will not go hungry... Phew wipes fear sweat from forehead ;) eats prepared CARE package for supper

♀

Apr 17, 10, 11:23 #30

I am both extremely pissed and heartbroken at the loss of the people who made Poland what it is today. Truly the 20th century architects of this country. But I strongly believe the Polish government should be pressed more by the people to demand more from this investigation, and not behave like such a Russian lap-dog. The only uprising I believe in here, is getting EU accident investigators in ASAP. Having had a week already with the data recorders, crash site, and the wreck to their disposal the Russians have had ample opportunity to tamper with evidence. And that video of the wreck in the forest utterly chills me. I can't get it out of my mind, it's just too eerie. Now imagine if we hadn't had the fortune of that Russian having the wherewithal to grab his camera and set out on foot. Where the hell would we be? A picture speaks a thousand words, and it's never been truer...

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