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Communism fell 20 years ago, Poland led the fight since WW2

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ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 21:21 #91
Seanus: CK, how do you imagine life was for Poles under communism. I cannot tell you this. But for sure the best choise for poland will be a foreign dominance, german or russian. Only these states can save polands and poles from themselves.

♂

Jun 20, 09, 21:26 #92

You cannot tell me this? Then why are you even bothering to write on this thread? Tell me, how do you imagine the shops were stocked? Foreign dominance, how would this be for Russia? America has you by the nuts.

How do you think freedom was manifested under communism here? What was the role of the Secret Police? Why did it take so long to shrug off this scourge?

CK, what year of primary school are you in?

♂

Edited by: pawian Jun 20, 09, 21:26 #93

ConstantineK:

Those workers of Gdansk's shipyard who launched the contrrevolution in poland during mid 80-th, are now complaining. Your "domocratic" revolution failed, your heroes you adores are false.

In a way, you are right. Workers toppled communism and allowed Solidarity to take over, but when capitalism started to be built, their situation didn`t improve right away. Why? They thought they would work like in communism
(whether you stand or lie, you will get 2000 zlotys -
czy się stoi czy się leży, dwa tysiące się należy)
and earn like in capitalism.
They were wrong.
Those who stubbornly stuck to socialist ideas and didn`t allow their plants to be restructured according to free market economy rules, became drop-outs when their work places went bankrupt.
Communist corruptive ideas had pervaded people`s minds and hearts.
It took 20 years for most Poles to understand that they need to work hard for their own and country`s prosperity.
In comparison to the past, we can say that Poles lost a little to gain a lot. In 1989 an average Pole needed 10 salaries to buy a good quality TV. Today only two salaries. Including workers` wages too.

ConstantineK:

But for sure the best choise for poland will be a foreign dominance, german or russian. Only these states can save polands and poles from themselves.

Kostia, I would gladly fall under Russian domination on one condition: if Russians become like Germans - disciplined, organized, dutiful, etc etc etc, so that they could introduce new quality into Poland and develop these characteristics in Poles :):):):):):):):)

However, I am afraid it won`t happen during my lifetime. :):):):):):):):)

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 21:36 #94
Seanus: Come on, CK, how was communism good for the Poles? I am very anxious, why do you think that the regime which was in poland may be attributed as "communism"?

♂

Edited by: Seanus Jun 20, 09, 21:36 #95

Pawian, are you even aware what you have just said? I think you are a Ukrainian Jew and not Polish. Sorry, that's the way you seem.

The Poles will be as they will be. You can persuade people to change their ways and adopt certain traits but you can't make that a condition :) :) :) :) :)

There is relative freedom now. Never underestimate the value of that :)

CK, if you are anxious then you should take sedatives :) :) Do you even know what communism is, Mr Ruski? ;) ;)

PolskaManThreads: 3 Posts: 177 Joined: Jan 3, 09 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 21:49 #96
pawian: Some fought against communism when it was being introduced into the country. These partisans stayed in the forest and continued the fight, attacking communist prisons and freeing fellow underground soldiers, Polish patriots imprisoned by secret police. And one of these brave People included my Great-Uncle Władyslaw Kłos

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 21:53 #97
Seanus: Do you even know what communism is, Mr Ruski? ;) ;) If you are so currious, you can pay your attetion for reportages from NK. It seems to me that it is very difficult to find out sorrowful faces there, am I right?

♂

Jun 20, 09, 21:57 #98

Are you kidding? They have blind devotion to a regime that suppresses individual thought and streamlines how they will be. Are you really so subservient that you are prepared to have your life substantially determined by the vision of one man? Democracy encourages discussion and a wide range of opinions to be put forward.

CK, how do you imagine dissentients were treated in Poland under communism?

pawianThreads: 80 Posts: 4,542 Joined: May 30, 08 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:00 #99
Seanus: I think you are a Ukrainian Jew and not Polish. Sorry, that's the way you seem. I see my true identity has been discovered. What can I say now??? :):):):):):)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:01 #100
You can prove me wrong by telling dear old Kostik how things were under communism :)

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:06 #101
Seanus: CK, how do you imagine dissentients were treated in Poland under communism? Too mild... They had to be burnt on the stages, in this case all would be quite.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Edited by: Seanus Jun 20, 09, 22:17 #102
Why don't you come to Poland and openly air your views, CK? I'm sure Warsaw residents would be sure to respond :) Are you on the waiting list for toilet paper, Kostik? Does the Russian state prescribe haemmorhoids for you?

pawianThreads: 80 Posts: 4,542 Joined: May 30, 08 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:24 #103
Seanus: You can prove me wrong by telling dear old Kostik how things were under communism :) It was just great. I was 18, had sex for the first time and life looked wonderful. :):):):):)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:26 #104
Did you get the consent of the priest? LOL There's nothing like relying on other chumps to tell you how to live your own life, right? ;) ;)

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:28 #105
Seanus: Why don't you come to Poland and openly air your views, CK? I'm sure Warsaw residents would be sure to respond :) Even poles themselves are escaping this miserable country prefering constant redicule as refugies to life in poland. Then, why should I come in this gloom place.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:35 #106
They are going abroad for money, amongst other things, to put themselves in a position where they can set themselves up here. At least they can 'escape', unlike with the gulags.

SokratesThreads: 19 Posts: 4,464 Joined: Jan 19, 09 ♂ [Suspended]	Jun 20, 09, 22:40 #107
ConstantineK: If you are so currious, you can pay your attetion for reportages from NK. It seems to me that it is very difficult to find out sorrowful faces there, am I right? Yes they're cheerfully starving in several provinces.

IronsideThreads: 56 Posts: 6,196 Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:40 #108
ConstantineK: Too mild... They had to be burnt on the stages, in this case all would be quite. Wrong!Sonny!

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:50 #109
Seanus: Seanus pawian: It was just great. I was 18, had sex for the first time and life looked wonderful. :):):):):) You see it Seanus? Actually life was rather free that even ukrainian jews had a rights for sex.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:51 #110
But what do you care for rights, CK? ;) ;)

♂

Edited by: mets2redsox0 Jun 20, 09, 22:51 #111

I think, this is a Wonderful Thread, and Pawian did a great Job!, well done!, very well done!, Now, I am old enough to remember, Pope Paul the 6th and John Paul the 1st, and I have to say, the one person who has not come up so-far is Ronald Wilson Reagan.

without John Paul II, the Solidarity Movement is Crushed sooner or later, and without Reagan, the KGB kill John Paul II in time, without the Friendship between Reagan and the Pope along with their mutually bond of hating the Communist!, how the world would have been a very different place, if on November the 4th, 1980 "Jimmy Carter" (aka President Peanut) beats Reagan.

on November the 4th, 1980;

The Russians are in Afghanistan.

The KGB is planing on killing the Pope (the first attempts was on May 13th, 1981).

52 Americans were held hostage in Iran (from November 4, 1979) for One Full Year!.

Time Magazine Cover Ronald Reagan & Pope John Paul II February the 24th, 1992 Issue Cover:

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 22:55 #112
Hats off to the Ukrainian Jew :) The boy done good :)

♂

Edited by: pawian Jun 20, 09, 22:59 #113

mets2redsox0:

Now, I am old enough to remember, Pope Paul the 6th and John Paul the 1st, and I have to say, the one person who has not come up so-far is Ronald Wilson Reagan.

Yes, Reagan was a good president for those times. He was tough on communists and that`s what I appreciated, though he declared economic sanctions against Poland after the junta cracked down on Solidarity in 1981.
And his joke about a nuclear attack on the Soviet Union starting in 5 minutes was superb. :):):):):)

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 23:10 #114
pawian: And his joke about a nuclear attack on the Soviet Union starting in 5 minutes was superb. do you think that foolishness was a good joke? Quite opposite, I think that that mistakes uncover whole bottomless of american stupidity.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 23:12 #115
Not at all. CK, have you any awareness of international politics at all? Reagan had a good understanding with Gorbachev. It was all a quip! Foolishness would've been taking The Cold War too seriously.

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 23:24 #116
Seanus: Foolishness would've been taking The Cold War too seriously. Come on boy, we all know that he was old marasmatic

mets2redsox0Threads: 1 Posts: 51 Joined: Mar 24, 07 ♂	Edited by: mets2redsox0 Jun 20, 09, 23:30 #117
ConstantineK do you think that foolishness was a good joke? Quite opposite, [I think that that mistakes uncover whole bottomless of american stupidity] well, well, we all can see, where you are from!, how's the Weather in Moscow tonight Comrad?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 23:30 #118
CK, The Cold War lasted longer than communism in Poland itself. Wow, there was espionage and some trickery but nothing on the scale of daily hell and early-morning queuing. There was direct intervention in daily lives, forcibly so. Look at photos of Gorbachev and Reagan around 1985 and tell me that that was a 'war'.

♂

Edited by: pawian Jun 20, 09, 23:36 #119

ConstantineK:

do you think that foolishness was a good joke?

I consider the joke immensely funny. :):):):):):):):) Listen to relive this great moment again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kifJ_mQdpZA&feature=related

Listen to his jokes about Soviet Union. Among others, a Soviet family has to wait 10 years for the delivery of a car - order today, come back in 10 years. :):):):)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN3z3eSVG7A

Quite opposite, I think that that mistakes uncover whole bottomless of american stupidity.

If Americans were stupid, they wouldn`t have won the Cold War with the Soviets. :):):):) See above - 10 years` waiting time for the delivery of a car.:):):):):):)

ConstantineKThreads: 35 Posts: 1,949 Joined: May 10, 07 ♂	Jun 20, 09, 23:39 #120
mets2redsox0: well, well, we all can see, where you are from!, how's the Weather in Moscow tonight Comrad? well, well, well, we have another Holmes among us... try to look into my profile first. I have never tried to hide my origin, mister Sock.

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