Poland is great Mother of all Slavs from Baltic to Balkan

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Edited by: Crow Mar 5, 10, 18:24 #1

i would just underline one fact that becoming obvious when Slavs from Czecka, Slovakia, Serbia, Slovenia,... talk among themselves

That fact is one great truth.... we all see Poland as point of sublimation for all our hopes in life in freedom, independence. We all see Poland as last resort, as center, as our great Slavic Mother.

what i want to tell you, i don`t believe in Brussel. I see only Warsaw

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 18:25 #2
So when's Tusk's assassination for being only a Kashub, Crow? ;) ;) ;) ;)

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 18:26 #3
Seanus: So when's Tusk's assassination for being only a Kashub, Crow? ;) ;) ;) ;) Kashubs are ok. Tusk is mistake of nature

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 18:29 #4
Yeah, he is a big fan of the Polish football team but doesn't seem to have studied international relations.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 18:32 #5
Seanus: Yeah, he is a big fan of the Polish football team but doesn't seem to have studied international relations. Yeah...that's the reason for selling Poland down the river all the time now...sighs

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 18:32 #6
Seanus: Yeah, he is a big fan of the Polish football team but doesn't seem to have studied international relations. let`s not about creature Tusk. This is noble thread dedicated to Poland as great Slavic Mother

terzievThreads: - Posts: 55 Joined: Nov 17, 09 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 21:21 #7
hahha, good one. ok, i know its polishforums, but i should definitely point out the fact that 'mother of all slavs' role is more suitable for russia. plus, as a representative from the balkans i would like to say - I PREFER BEING ORPHAN!

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Torq Mar 5, 10, 21:25 #8
We notice what you say, Terziev. That is your opinion and you are entitled to it, however, as an opinion of a Turk it has a limited value. We are not commenting on your Turanic civilization so you could refrain from commenting on Slavija. terziev: I PREFER BEING ORPHAN! You are not an orphan - your mother Turkey is there, alive and kicking.

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 21:42 #9
Crow: we all see Poland as point of sublimation for all our hopes in life in freedom, independence. We all see Poland as last resort, as center, as our great Slavic Mother. Even tho' it is part of the Church of Rome, not the Slavic Orthodoxy?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 21:44 #10
Poland is much more the cradle of pan-Slavism than Russia. Russians are hybrid with much Mongol blood mixed in there. They are not as pure as Poles.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 21:54 #11
Seanus: They are not as pure as Poles. Pure Poles??? After millennia mixing with the Germans??? And vice versa??? Doubtfull... The IQ of the Germans and the Poles is identical (as with the other germanic people, the Dutch), compare that to Russians or Serbs...tells everything about relationships there is, really! :):):)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 21:59 #12
There really wasn't that much mixing overall, BB. There was mingling but little interbreeding, relatively speaking. There was in Silesia but that's only 2 of 16 voivodships.

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 22:01 #13

Seanus:

There really wasn't that much mixing overall, BB. There was mingling but little interbreeding, relatively speaking. There was in Silesia but that's only 2 of 16 voivodships.

What makes you the expert Seanie? ;)

When you compare the genetic findings between Poles and...say...Serbians...there couldn' be more differences!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_peoples#Genetics

Two genetically distant groups of Slavic populations were revealed:
One encompassing all Western-Slavic, Eastern-Slavic, and two Southern-Slavic populations (north-western Croats, Slovenes),

and one encompassing all remaining Southern Slavs

!

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:04 #14
Bratwurst Boy: When you compare the genetic findings between Poles and...say...Serbians...there couldn' be more differences! I hear what you're saying, BB. You mean there's just as much German genetics in both countries?

terzievThreads: - Posts: 55 Joined: Nov 17, 09 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:04 #15
this thread is going to be funny as hell. 'slavic mother' written is LATIN SCRIPT, not in SLAVIC ALPHABET?????? just ridiculous. even more than just ridiculous, but my english is not good enough to find better word.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 22:06 #16
Trevek: I hear what you're saying, BB. You mean there's just as much German genetics in both countries? In central Europe we are a mixed bunch :) Poles and Germans are closer than Poles and Serbs, everything else is artificially created theoretically (on both sides).

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Mar 5, 10, 22:10 #17

Who said anything about being an expert, BB? Unlike some, I don't take what I say as factual and it is just the conclusion from listening to several accounts here in Silesia. I've lived here for over half a decade now.

It's not as German as you'd like to believe. Gwara, where German is spoken, is not as widespread as your relatives may be telling you.

The Poles are purer than you could ever imagine.

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 22:12 #18

PS: Seanie, please read up again about Poland after the mongol invasions in the 12th century and the depopulation of whole territores!
Lots of german settlers were invited to rebuild and to repopulate (Krakau for example)...they became all Poles later...but where do you think their genes went? ;)

Seanus:

The Poles are purer than you could ever imagine.

ROFL, on an island maybe.
But not in central Europe where everything was in motion all the time!

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Edited by: Seanus Mar 5, 10, 22:15 #19
Mongol invasions? Forgive me but I'm not familiar with that. Only Tatars. The gene pool gets filtered and diluted through time. Please don't enter the Africa debate ;) ;) On an island? Put them on GB and they'd still be pure Poles ;) ;) ;)

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Torq Mar 5, 10, 22:23 #20

Seanus:

The Poles are purer than you could ever imagine.

Sorry, Seanus, it doesn't happen very often, but this time you are completely wrong.

There is no such thing as 'pure Pole'.

We are a mix of several Slavic tribes with a big influence of Germanic, Scottish (yes -
Scottish :)), Baltic, Hungarian, Tatar, Jewish, Swedish and many other genes, coming
either from settlers or from invading armies throughout centuries.

Being Polish is about culture (history, language, customs and traditions) and not about
genes. I always give the example of two of my friends for the uni - one of them was
a tall, blue-eyed blonde and the other looked kinda like Ghenghis-Khan, but they were
both 100% Polish :)

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Mar 5, 10, 22:25 #21

BB has a point, Seanus, if you consider around 30,000 Scottish families in Poland/Prussia in 17th century, Armenians, Dutch, Jewish (assimilated or not), German, Lithuanian, Old Prussian, Russian, Ruthenian, Swedish and whatever else floated into the gene pool, it's rather hard to use the term 'pure'.

Aftyer WW2 Poland was considered the most mono-ethnic country in Europe, but it was a bit of paper shuffling. Minorities like Lemko, Hutsul etc were (on paper) largely assimilated, whilst German minorities were often polonized.

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Mar 5, 10, 22:29 #22

Scheisse, I forgot my wink marks ;) ;) I was winding up BB. The only really pure people were and, perhaps are, Indians. Jedno plemię :) Trust me, I'm not that naive. Scots have been interbreeding with Poles since at least the 16th century.

What I will say is that, in modern Europe, it's far from visible. You see gypsies but they invited themselves for the most part. Poles are pretty darned white!

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:31 #23
Seanus: Scheisse, I forgot my wink marks ;) ;) I was winding up BB. Just wait till I get my helmet back!!! glares at sheep

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Edited by: Trevek Mar 5, 10, 22:32 #24
Seanus: Mongol invasions? Forgive me but I'm not familiar with that. Only Tatars. Here's some info. Mind you, it seems the Poles and Lithuanians kicked Mongol ass, whereas the Serbian king rolled over for them... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_invasion_of_Europe Oh, did you know that Scottish knights were guests of the Teutonic Order during the Northern Crusades into Prussia and Lithuania?

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Mar 5, 10, 22:41 #25

Well, looking at it in proportional terms, ducking the deflection tactics of BB ;) ;), Poland is still at the helm of Slavism. For a guy that acknowledges the German gene presence in Poles, he sure as hell has more than his fair share of digs at Poles ;0 ;) But I like the guy and bow to his superior historical knowledge. My history pales away in comparison when cast alongside his (smacks BB on the head as a cheap shot before getting his helmet back).

I look forward to meeting Crow and will see if the man resembles his rhetoric.

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:44 #26
Seanus: (smacks BB on the head as a cheap shot before getting his helmet back). Careful about grabbing a guy's helmet... especially if there's a spike on top of it.

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Mar 5, 10, 22:50 #27

Who said anything about grabbing? His head is bare and I twatted it :)

I wonder how Slavic Crow thinks the Baltic countries are. Many see me as linguistically capable, knowing 4 languages plus dialects but those languages foxed me. I was talking to an American buddy of mine just last week. He was saying that he could understand the Czech guy but his Polish GF couldn't. I understand parts of Russian through Polish and also some Czech. However, those 3 languages really stumped me (Estonian, Latvian and Lithuanian).

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Mar 5, 10, 22:51 #28

BB if we are talking about genetic;

The modern Slavic peoples come from a wide variety of genetic backgrounds. The frequency of Haplogroup R1a [19] ranges from 63.39% by the Sorbs, 56.4% in Poland and 54% in Ukraine, to 15.2% in Republic of Macedonia, 14.7% in Bulgaria and 12.1% in Herzegovina.[20] Haplogroup R1a may be connected to the spread of Proto-Indo-Europeans (see Kurgan hypothesis for more information).

So I think ( scientists also) than we have more common with Serbs than with Germans.

Poles were mixing with germans only in cities and it was not so popular. Do you remember
Władysław Łokietek i " Koło miele młyn" ??

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Edited by: marqoz Mar 5, 10, 22:52 #29

Thank you, Crow. There was some period when it was true, indeed, in XVI-XVII century.

However I'm sorry to say that there are more Croats (38 men) than Serbs (1) in Poland now. I hope it's not anybody's fault.

However you can call Poland as a cradle of Slavs, because we have also:
164 Slovakians,
14465 Czechs
37 Bosnians,
8467 Ruthenians and 4 Ukrainians,
15 Belorussians,
6210 Russians,
4 Lusitanians (Sorabians),
But of course they all are outperformed by:
21534 Poles,
8407 Kashubians,
1796 Silesians,
25 Greater-Poles,

But Masovians rule with 66866 competitors.

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Torq Mar 5, 10, 22:52 #30
jeden: " Koło miele młyn" ? Wasn't it "Soczewica, koło miele młyn"? marqoz: But Masovians rule with 66866 competitors. Actually that link points to 'Mazur' which is Masurian not Masovian.

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