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Poland is great Mother of all Slavs from Baltic to Balkan

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Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 22:56 #31
jeden: So I think ( scientists also) than we have more common with Serbs than with Germans. Really! ;) Sorry, but you asked for it! ;) Holland is left of Germany, Poland is right of Germany, Sweden is north of us...so... I just love this killer argument.... :)

jedenThreads: - Posts: 297 Joined: Nov 30, 09 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:58 #32
Yeahh, people from Spain and Czech are the same iq. And? It doesn`t prove anything BB.

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 22:59 #33
Torq: Actually that link points to 'Mazur' which is Masurian not Masovian. Aren't they called masurians because they originally came from the Masovian region?

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Mar 5, 10, 23:01 #34
jeden: It doesn`t prove anything BB. Sure it does, you are smarties like the Germans, not dumbies like the Southerners! ;)

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Torq Mar 5, 10, 23:02 #35
Trevek: Aren't they called masurians because they originally came from the Masovian region? I'm not sure about the etymology of the word but we have Masurian - Mazur, and Masovian - Mazowszanin; two separate terms, which are not interchangeable.

jedenThreads: - Posts: 297 Joined: Nov 30, 09 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 23:03 #36
I don`t like iq tests. In one I had 130 and in secend 96... It`s a ****!

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 23:05 #37
Well, then what about that? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Serbs#Genetics The ethnic group closest to the Serbs genetically is the Macedonian Slavs[8]. http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2005/09/haplogroup-frequency-correlations -in.html

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Torq Mar 5, 10, 23:06 #38
jeden: I don`t like iq tests. In one I had 130 and in secend 96... You should take a proper test then - supervised by a qualified psychologist. You would get quite an accurate result then - I took such tests twice (once before the uni and second time recently for a scientific research project) and got very similar results.

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Mar 5, 10, 23:09 #39

Torq:

I'm not sure about the etymology of the word but we have Masurian - Mazur, and
Masovian - Mazowszanin; two separate terms, which are not interchangeable.

According to wiki (so it must be true):

The Masurians or Mazurs or Masurs (Polish: Mazurzy, German: Masuren) are a Lechitic sub-ethnic group in the Masovian and Warmian-Masurian Voivodeships in Poland. They are descended from Masovians (Polish: Mazowszanie; German: Masowier), Polish settlers from Masovia who moved to Prussia especially during and after the Protestant Reformation and were primarily Protestant. In the 1800s the Masuria region of East Prussia was named after the Masurians.

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Mar 5, 10, 23:11 #40
So Masurians are descended from Masovians - interesting! You learn something new everyday :)

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 5, 10, 23:27 #41
Torq: You learn something new everyday :) indeed. ;-)

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Edited by: Crow Mar 6, 10, 00:04 #42

Trevek:

Even tho' it is part of the Church of Rome, not the Slavic Orthodoxy?

Catholicism is Catholicism, Orthodoxy is Orthodoxy. Orthodoxy isn`t more Slavic then Catholicism and the opposite

after all, i see Poland as Slavic Poland. Other are technical details

But, let me underline that today, in Christianity, we- Slavs have far less religious differences then in ancient time when practically every house/family/clan had its own spirits, every sub-region had its own local Gods, etc, etc. So, i don`t have problems with technical details. Those details were not important to Racowie (Serbians) in the middle age and aren`t important to the modern day Serbs.

Poles are good Slavs and that`s enough to me. This way or another, Poland is hope

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 00:15 #43
Religion is not such a divisive factor in this specific case! Serbs need to come up and mingle more, though. If they are indeed brothers then they need to present themselves as brotherly as actions speak louder than words. Crow, when are you heading to Poland?

thebear45Threads: 2 Posts: 95 Joined: Apr 22, 09 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 00:35 #44
Bratwurst Boy: Bratwurst BoyThreads: 4 Posts: 7823 Joined: Apr 2, 07 Gender: Male u forgot albania in ur list. it should be tops, with germans.

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Mar 6, 10, 01:16 #45

Well, sweeping Mod, please suggest a continuation to the thread and I'll roll with it. Otherwise, please leave my comments alone and get off the power trip.

Poland is a great mother of Slavs in one sense but isn't that interested in pan-Slavism. The Serbs were berated in the Polish press and I'm glad that the tour guide helped to set the record straight by outlining a few home truths. It awakened some Poles as to their heritage and they should remember that many Balkan Slavs just emigrated south many years ago. There are some commonalities and Crow can tease them out.

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Mar 6, 10, 01:21 #46

you have to understand what panslavism means and who was proposing this idea in past time
pan slavism sounds like pan germanism but they are not the same

from wiki the view of panslavism from the Polish perspective

Although early Pan-Slavism had found interest among some Poles, it soon lost its appeal as the movement became dominated by Russia, and while Russian Pan-Slavists spoke of liberation of other Slavs through Russian actions, parts of Poland had been under oppressive rule by the Russian Empire since the Partitions of Poland. Historically, Poland often saw itself in partnership with non-Slavic nations most of the time, such as Hungary, or Lithuania under the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth from 1569 to 1795. The influence of 19th century Pan-Slavism had little impact in Poland except for creating sympathy towards the other oppressed Slavic nations to regaining independence. At the same time while Pan-Slavism worked against Austro-Hungary with South Slavs, Poles enjoyed a wide autonomy within the state and assumed a loyalist position as they were able to develop their national culture and preserve Polish language, something under threat in both German and Russian Empires. A Pan-Slavic federation was proposed, but on the condition that the Russian Empire would be excluded from such an entity. After Poland regained its independence (from Germany, Austria and Russia) in 1918 no major or minor force considered Pan-Slavism as a serious alternative, viewing Pan-Slavism as little more than a code word for Russification. During Poland's communist era the USSR used Pan-Slavism as propaganda tool to justify its control over the country. The issue of the Pan-Slavism was not part of the mainstream political agenda, and is widely seen as an ideology of Russian imperialism.

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Mar 6, 10, 01:25 #47

Exactly, TIT, that's spot on. 1918 was a landmark date here and Poland really resisted Germanic influences in 1921 when the League of Nations settled the dispute over Silesian territory. Poland showed themselves to be able to compromise by agreeing to let Germany up to 25% of coal from that region. There was certainly a Polishness there but pan-Slavism is best framed in terms of Russia and we all know the history which undermines Slavic brotherhood.

ExiledThreads: 5 Posts: 729 Joined: Jan 17, 10 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 01:27 #48
From my experience Slavs have a lot in common and Germanics have also a lot of common.Most important Slavs have the same Weltanschauung and you can learn a lot about one Slavic nation by knowing another.

TITThreads: 9 Posts: 353 Joined: Jan 7, 10 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 01:30 #49
we all want to crush these mongols and they know it

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Mar 6, 10, 01:30 #50

However, excessive competition undermines the process. Also, I discussed an issue with my friend's Polish GF and she agreed with me that some Poles have a block when it comes to Czechs, their Slavic neighbours. Poles really don't understand them but history makes them less willing. If you let sleeping dogs lie and bury hatchets then a closer Slavic unity can come about. There is much in common, a love of drinking being one of the main ones. A large part of the problem is shaking off distrust.

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 01:40 #51
this is how it is... Serbians desperately need Polish help. On the other side, without Serbs, Poland would for sure died in silence

TITThreads: 9 Posts: 353 Joined: Jan 7, 10 ♂	Edited by: TIT Mar 6, 10, 01:41 #52
we had a problem with Zaolzie during Hitler era Marshall Rydz-Smigly annexed that part and fcuked up relations with President of Czechoslovakia Benes but what you expect from the guy who is a military man and painter? ( Rzydz-Smigly ) two souls, one pragmatic other one artistic - toxic mix

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Mar 6, 10, 01:51 #53

TIT:

during Hitler era Marshall Rydz-Smigly annexed that part and fcuked up relations with President of Czechoslovakia Benes

just rely on Serbs in Polish-Czech misunderstandings and you shall see how new Poland arising. Serbs would explain to Czechs. Only Serbs makes the difference.

Vast resources of Slavija should be under Slavic control.

Now, Warsaw... what shall be!? Death in silence or attempt for eternal glory?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 01:53 #54
A mother must be loving and Poland's history sometimes shows otherwise. RS was a bit of a livewire and he would have benefitted from more guidance from Piłsudski, a man Hitler admired. Poland didn't modernise under him and he wasn't into cordial relations.

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Mar 6, 10, 03:50 #55

Polish as pan-slavists? Poland mother of Slavs. wtf?

Firstly, Polish people hate everyone, west , east, south norht. And they hate themselves too. hope they interbreed with 3rd world immigrants and a new Imperial Russia crushes this 'nation' once and for all.

as for balts, Estonians are not balts and are real proud of that. they are the same as Finns and more related to Hungarians.

Crow: you are some kind of freak amongst your nation, because all others are looking to RUSSIA. I would be more proud to be born Serb than Polish!!!!

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Mar 6, 10, 05:34 #56

Torq:

the etymology of the word but we have Masurian - Mazur, and
Masovian - Mazowszanin; two separate terms, which are not interchangeable.

Sorry, you're wrong this time. Here you have:
Bezpośrednie pochodzenie nazwy należy wiązać z Mazowszem, jako, że w dawnej polszczyźnie Mazur to mieszkaniec Mazowsza, czyli dzisiaj powiedzielibyśmy – Mazowszanin (nazewnictwo to było jeszcze w końcu XIXw., czego liczne ślady znajdujemy w powieści Chłopi Reymonta).
Mazurs of course gave former Prussia the name of Mazury due to massive colonization waves from XIV, XV and XVII centuries.
Mazurówka was (and in some places still unchanged) one of the most popular placename in Ukraine. First massive colonization in XVI-XVII centuries were made by peasants. poor noblemen and forest workers from Masovia.

mephiasThreads: 15 Posts: 811 Joined: Nov 14, 08 MEMBER ♂	Mar 6, 10, 05:58 #57
Crow: Serbians desperately need Polish help Not really but Polish help would be helpfull. Current Serb government doing well you are finally in the mainstream you should be happy. Crow: without Serbs, Poland would for sure died in silence This is not correct, Poland don't need anything from Serbs. (Even if there is a historical brotherhood Serbia can only be a extra burden for Poland).

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Mar 6, 10, 11:59 #58

PLAT:

Crow: you are some kind of freak amongst your nation, because all others are looking to RUSSIA. I would be more proud to be born Serb than Polish!!!!

Serbs are old core. i am proud to it. All Slavs are aware of it. But, in this very moment Poland should be leading force and Serbs should help to Poland.

Russia can only profit from strengthening of Poland and increased Polish role in Slavic world. i sense that. Russia itself should be redirected to look to Poland and shouldn`t be selfish here.

mephias:

This is not correct, Poland don't need anything from Serbs.

in global game, Slavic Poland can`t survive without Serbs

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 12:18 #59
Redirected to look at Poland? There is ongoing cooperation, Crow. It's just hard to strike bargains with megalomaniacs with shady pasts. Have you ever seen any Polish PM serving in the counterpart of the KGB? Poland has issues with Lithuania, for example. It's very clear when you listen to some Poles speak that they have imperialistic streaks. I don't think this golden unity is there.

TrevekThreads: 30 Posts: 2,088 Joined: May 21, 08 ♂	Mar 6, 10, 14:02 #60
Crow: Catholicism is Catholicism, Orthodoxy is Orthodoxy. Orthodoxy isn`t more Slavic then Catholicism and the opposite and your Croatian brothers?

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