Poland provoked Germany to start WW2 by mobilising first

Polonius3Threads: 1,005 Posts: 4,834 Joined: Apr 11, 08 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 13:24 #1
According to Erika Steinbach, Poland was the first to mobilise in 1939, thereby provoking Germany to start WW2. http://www.thenews.pl/international/?id=139358

southernThreads: 116 Posts: 10,955 Joined: May 17, 07 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 13:27 #2
Yes,some Poles started it by attacking the radio station in Gleiwitz.

wildroverThreads: 180 Posts: 8,188 Joined: Jun 7, 07 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 13:29 #3
Polonius3: According to Erika Steinbach She is just a silly nut....nobody in Germany pays her any attention...it seems she is only listened to by Poles that want a reason to dislike Germans...

polishmeknobThreads: 12 Posts: 162 Joined: Feb 9, 09 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 13:30 #4
Yeah, I don't think that Poland was the aggressor in this whole thing.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 14:14 #5
Poland was the first to mobilise in 1939 Actually, the wench is right, Poland did preliminary mobilization in March seeing the German threat looming, but the final phase of mobilizing scheduled for the end of August was delayed on advice of the Allies. Erica Steinbach has evolved into an embarassing creature for the Germans.

wildroverThreads: 180 Posts: 8,188 Joined: Jun 7, 07 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 14:19 #6
1jola: Poland did preliminary mobilization in March seeing the German threat looming, This is like saying that locking your house door when you see a known burgler approaching is provoking him into breaking into your house...

MareGaeaThreads: 45 Posts: 5,527 Joined: Feb 6, 08 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 14:23 #7
Steinbach is a nutter. Nobody takes her seriously anyway. Why are we even discussing this? >^..^< M-G (incidents vs greater picture)

polishmeknobThreads: 12 Posts: 162 Joined: Feb 9, 09 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 14:23 #8
Watch this. It's interesting. Richard Overy is a great writer (I Read The Dictators: Hitler's Germany, Stalin's Russia. Also: http://polishmeknob.blogspot.com/2009/09/wars.html

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 14:31 #9
wildrover: This is like saying that locking your house door when you see a known burgler approaching is provoking him into breaking into your house... The burglar has already decided what he wants to do. If you are armed, you can resist him. Not sure what your argument is, but I doubt you are a fan of Steinbach's ideas.

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Edited by: Crow Sep 10, 10, 15:42 #10

Poland provoked WW2 by mobilising first

old idiotic story about Serbs who started WWI and Poles who started WWII

and when i say here that Poland, Ukraine and Serbia have to form alliance some people here attacking me

Poles, listen. Polish-German alliance is abominable thing. Germans would eat you

MareGaea:

Steinbach is a nutter.

Bill Clinton and Tony Blair are also nutters but look, they reduced borders of Slavic world. For now, at least

Marek11111Threads: 49 Posts: 1,954 Joined: Aug 6, 09 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 16:25 #11
there you go that how it starts one idiot publishes some stupid ideas then other then some people start to fallow the idiot idea and with a weak economy high unemployment and blame game and we have another Hitler on our hands.

saschaThreads: 13 Posts: 3,855 Joined: Jun 10, 10 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 16:38 #12
southern: Yes,some Poles started it by attacking the radio station in Gleiwitz. German soldiers in polish uniforms...

CrowThreads: 367 Posts: 7,316 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Sep 10, 10, 16:52 #13
sascha: German soldiers in polish uniforms... we all know that but go, tell that to the Anglo-Germanic greed

saschaThreads: 13 Posts: 3,855 Joined: Jun 10, 10 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 16:59 #14
Crow: we all know that but go, tell that to the Anglo-Germanic greed 'cause I am Germanic, I'll just tell the Anglo fraction here ;-) O.K.?

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Sep 10, 10, 17:05 #15

Marek11111:

there you go that how it starts one idiot publishes some stupid ideas then other then some people start to fallow the idiot idea and with a weak economy high unemployment and blame game and we have another Hitler on our hands.

Why not just bring it out into the open and expose those people to ridicule? We have a tendency to portray anything WW2 related as evil magic revolution bullets.

Marek11111Threads: 49 Posts: 1,954 Joined: Aug 6, 09 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 17:49 #16
ww2 was evil as all war are

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Edited by: Moderator Sep 10, 10, 18:49 #17

wildrover:

nobody in Germany pays her any attention.

I like her!
A tough lady...the CDU's loss :(

Without her Poland would still betotally in denial concerning the mass expellations...the centrum to commemorate the expulsions all over Europe after the war is HER baby, the Poles hate her for that and tried to pressure the german gov to stop it, but she prevailed....

MareGaea:

Steinbach is a nutter. Nobody takes her seriously anyway. Why are we even discussing this?

I take her seriously...
Nutters are others!

1jola:

Erica Steinbach has evolved into an embarassing creature for the Germans.

Oh no...

Like Sarrazin she is only an "embarrassment" for some in the gov, not for the people. Like with Sarrazin don't think for a moment she doesn't speak out what many think anyhow...

Like Sarrazin she is one brave and bold one for sticking the finger in an still open wound..not pretending there isn't any just because it's convenient for the "elites"!

;)

To all, all off topic posts can be found in the bin.

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Edited by: pawian Sep 10, 10, 19:56 #18

Yes, she is a typical representative of German revanchism whose ideas in essence are: Poland is responsible for being attacked by Germany and later resettlement of German population from German territories granted to Poland was unjustified.

Her latest remark caused an uproar in Germany, most German politicians and media critisize her and admit that Poland wasn`t responsible for the outbreak of WW2, only Germany was.

That is a very positive aspect of the whole story - it seems most Germans are reasonable and know the truth and are not afraid to say it in public..

Good work, Germans.

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Sep 10, 10, 20:00 #19

pawian:

it seems most Germans are reasonable and know the truth and are not afraid to say it in public..

Well, now it's the Poles time to do the same...
Maybe then we too can say one day: "Good work Poles"

PS: Just in case you did miss it but Steinbach didn't say anything...she did took a stand before Arnold Tölg und Hartmut Saenger who said that Poland mobilizated in August 1939 before the german attack. Something what no serious historian denies actually...

But then...who cares, right? Riiiiight!

pawianThreads: 90 Posts: 5,395 Joined: May 30, 08 ♂	Edited by: pawian Sep 10, 10, 20:49 #20
Bratwurst Boy: Well, now it's the Poles time to do the same... What is the truth about Polish German relations that Poles should admit exactly? As a Pole, I really don`t know. Can you remind me?

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Sep 10, 10, 20:51 #21

pawian:

As a Pole, I really don`t know. Can you remind me?

How surprising!

How about the ethnical cleansing of millions of people...killing about a million of mainly women, children and elderly civilians in the process.

An acknowledgement at least would be a first step...nothing to speak of an apology (maybe later).

I mean isn't this what it's all about? Poles not wanting to know any of it - Steinbach not wanting to let it pass into history without any acknowledgement???

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Sep 10, 10, 20:59 #22

southern:

Nazism remains always a possibility for Germany.Most Germans blame Hitler for losing the war not for limitations of personal freedoms.

It is a possibility in any country where people are sick and tired of brainless, purposeless talking non-stop politicians. Nazism in the 20-30s was fed by the state of economy and unfair international treaties which pushed the country to the extremes and let the nazis win the elections. Germany has no reason whatsoever to go there again - it's at the top already and not by guns and terror, but economy and science. Nazism is born where external forces try to suffocate exhausted people, demading at the same time to make them pay for the air that manages to get to the lungs.

Marek11111Threads: 49 Posts: 1,954 Joined: Aug 6, 09 ♂	Sep 10, 10, 21:00 #23
you are priceless BB you as German is talking about ethnic cleansing of millions of people during ww2 let me tell you you have no leg to stand on you Germans ethnic cleans Europe out of millions of Jews, Poles, Gypsies, Russians and Serbs. Germans are responsible for all Germans that died during and after ww2 it's about time you admit this.

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Sep 10, 10, 21:03 #24

Nathan:

Germany has no reason whatsoever to go there again - it's at the top already and not by guns and terror, but economy and science.

*nods*

Something like Nazism is soooo out of fashion!

Marek11111:

Germans are responsible for all Germans that died during and after ww2 it's about time you admit this.

Steinbach is soooo right!
You prove it over and over again...thank you!

I will agree to that nice and comfy theory of yours if you admit that the independence the Treaty of Versailles gave you led to your destruction during WWII, without Poland no WWII - so it's all the Poles fault. They should had stayed in Prussia inside the old borders and nobody would had been harmed! There would had been no reason to protest any treaty at all - ergo no Hitler - ergo no Nazis - ergo no war to redraw the borders again!

Easy there, isn't it! Time you admit this!

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Sep 10, 10, 21:27 #25

Bratwurst Boy:

An acknowledgement at least would be a first step...nothing to speak of an apology (maybe later).

I was just reading the same article, out of curiosity what Wiki says.

In the first years after the war, the bishop of Katowice Stanisław Adamski criticized the expulsion of Germans as inhumane. In 1965, a group of Polish bishops made a particularly important overture by sending a letter to their German counterparts in which they asked forgiveness for the wrongs perpetrated during the expulsion and at the same time offered forgiveness for German war crimes. (...)

The Polish role in the expulsions could not be contemplated in Poland until the end of the Cold War. (...)

In 1995, Polish foreign minister Władysław Bartoszewski expressed regret about the suffering of innocent Germans during the expulsions in a speech held before German parliament and federative council. (...)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_and_expulsion_of_Germans_from_Pola nd_during_and_after_World_War_II

Well...

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Edited by: Bratwurst Boy Sep 10, 10, 21:37 #26

As early as in 1941, Władysław Sikorski of the Polish government in exile insisted on driving "the German horde (...) back far [westward]"[26], while in 1942 memoranda he expressed concern about Poland acquiring Lower Silesia, populated with "fanatically anti-Polish Germans".[27][28]

Yet as the war went on, Lower Silesia also became a Polish war aim, as well as occupation of the Baltic coast west of Szczecin as far as Rostock and occupation of the Kiel Canal.[28]

Expulsions of Germans from East Prussia and pre-war Poland had become a war aim as early as in February 1940, expressed by Polish Foreign Minister August Zaleski[28].

I found that bit especially interesting since so many Poles comforted themself for decades with the obligatory: "The Russians did it" which now substituted the "The Germans did it".

A Greater Poland till Rostock and Kiel without Germans innit already up in 1941...

How about
"Generalski Planski West"??? ;)

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Edited by: Qrot Sep 11, 10, 07:31 #27

Poland mobilized when it was obvious that Germany would invade us.

Nonetheless, we stopped mobilisation a couple of weeks before the invasion, on a special
request of France and Great Britain to give them time for more negotiations (that's one of
the reasons why we weren't properly prepared for the war).

In 1939, the war against Germany was the last thing Poland wanted. Accusing us of provoking
it is plain stupidity.

As for expellations of Germans - it was decided by Soviet Union, USA and Britain.
They decided the after-war borders of Poland we had nothing to say. We couldn't
say that we don't want Szczecin and Wrocław and would rather keep Kresy Wschodnie.
Nobody asked us.

Besides - let's keep a right perspective here. Germans slaughtered Polish civilians, murdered
women and children, planned first slavery and then a total extincion of our entire nation,
gassed us in concentration camps and made soap out of dead bodies of our friends and family
members. After the war, we made them leave the lands granted to us and go to what was
left of Germany. Yeah - those blood-thirsty Poles - what a terrible revenge we took!

*rolls eyes*

I don't appreciate comparisons being made between this hardcore nazi b**ch, Steinbach,
and Theo Sarrazin - a patriot and very sensible man. With Sarazzin we can find common
tongue and co-operate in a friendly manner, Steinbach has to go to the trash bin of history
once and for all.

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Edited by: Moderator Sep 11, 10, 12:13 #28

Qrot:

I don't appreciate comparisons being made between this hardcore nazi b**ch, Steinbach,
and Theo Sarrazin - a patriot and very sensible man.

It's Thilo...not Theo....and he get's the same treatment from the self declared elite as does Steinbach for showing that the Kaiser is naked instead keeping up the lie that he has clothes on.
Alot of people give both grief for that.

They have alot in common actually...

But then...Sarrazins book is already a bestseller. They can't keep up with the demands.
And Steinbach got her baby, the dokumentation center...where everybody can see for himself what really happened. Inclusive photos, footage, dates and stats....
So...who cares if we butt heads on some internet forum or if some of you still deny it till thursday... :)

To all, u will find posts containing personal insults in the bin. thank you.

IronsideThreads: 59 Posts: 6,786 Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂	Sep 11, 10, 15:34 #29
What?The plan of the invasion was ready!Poland provoked Germany to attack Poland first instead of France as Hitler was originally planing to do!

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Sep 11, 10, 15:44 #30
Bratwurst Boy: Steinbach got her baby, the dokumentation center...where everybody can see for himself what really happened. Inclusive photos, footage, dates and stats.... Yes, and that is why she's so hated by Poles: it's now much much harder for them to maintain their lies.

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