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EURO 2012 "don't be a schmuck and read it before you rent" thread

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Edited by: Midas Jan 14, 12, 18:02 #1

Hello everyone.

As some of you might know I'm a UK based investor who is rather involved with the Polish real estate market ( too bad it is down the loo at the moment ), I spend a ton of time in Poland and I'd like to use my knowledge and experience to help anyone who is looking for short term accommodation in Poland during EURO2012.

There are 2 reasons why I started this thread:

a) Many non-Polish people have started threads on the forum about looking for accommodation during Euro2012,

b) Many Polish people have started threads on the forum in which they offer their apartments or houses to foreigners at exorbitant prices.

Before we go any further, since there are quite a few people who diss me for my Jewish heritage, I will point out that I'm absolutely in no way, shape or form promoting any of the properties I own or rent in Poland at the moment.

The goal of this thread is simple:

Don't be a schmuck and don't let them treat you like a cash cow

0) To exemplify some of the stuff I wrote about above:

- this is an offer that was published on Polishforums a while ago:

400m2 House for rent Euro 2012

4500 zloty a day for what is supposed to be a "luxury house" in Warsaw.

This is one of the offers you can find on a publicly accessible internet site in Poland:

http://dom.gratka.pl/tresc/406-6788113-mazowieckie-warszawa-ursynow-mo kotow-stary-sluzew-stegny.html#a80c178cd60d78e1,1

7000 zloty a month.

Another joker ( nickname "poznan2012" ) offered "2 small apartments in Poznan" on this forum and said he's expecting offers in the region of 200 euro a day:

Accomodation for Euros Wanted 9th - 19th June in Warsaw or Pozan

Here's a link to a binding offer for a studio flat smack dab in the center of Poznan from a publicly accessible internet site in Poland:

http://dom.gratka.pl/tresc/401-25326341-wielkopolskie-poznan-centrum-g olebia-stary-rynek.html#b7c9a33d7d15a159,1

1.999 zloty a month, negotiable ( 1 euro will get you more than 4 zloty these days, you do the math ).

We are really talking people offering at x or even xx times the going market rate here.

1) With the above in mind: Most people who are offering property for EURO2012 on www.polishforums.com aren't even registered users. So Polishforums is in no way responsible for them and for all we know they might be scammers looking for schmucks who'll overpay them for their "apartments".

Excercise caution when dealing with such people.

2) In Poland it is very possible to call up an agency or the owner offering long-term rental and ask if it is available short term and how much would he charge for short-term if it is.

If you do that instead of going with some of the "offers" I mentioned here you'll save tons of $.

3) The sites which I recommend for flat hunting are:

http://dom.gratka.pl/

http://www.oferty.net/

http://nieruchomosci.onet.pl/

4) A few useful bits of Polish for those who need it for some of the sites :

"mieszkanie" = flat

"dom" = house

"dzialka" or "grunt" = plot of land

"garaż" = garage.

"lokale użytkowe" = commercial

"pokoje" = rooms

"region" or "województwo" = a voivodeship or region

"najem" or "wynajem" = rent

"sprzedaż" = sale

"kupno" = I seek to purchase

"miejscowość" = town/city

"dzielnica" = neighbourhood

"cena" = price

"powierzchnia" = size ( Polish people use square meters )

"zamiana" = exchange

"poszukiwany wynajem" = I seek to rent

5) I fully understand that as the EURO draws nearer and nearer some people will have no other choice apart from going with a guy who'll charge an arm and a leg for a crappy apartment his grandma died in.

However as of now this still isn't the case. So if you're looking now do yourself a favour and cruise the sites I listed, maybe call up some respected agencies and try to do what I described in 2) above.

You might save yourself a lot of money.

Best of luck,

rickbelfastThreads: - Posts: 1 Joined: Jan 14, 12 ♂	Jan 14, 12, 22:21 #2
mate, those websites are all in polish, haven't got a clue what they're talking about, any english ones? thanks Rick

StuThreads: 27 Posts: 1,109 Joined: Mar 31, 10 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 11:56 #3
Because I like what I read, and I see other people starting again, I'd like to say I agree with Midas on this one. Not that I want to bump the thread or anything ... ;)

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Jan 15, 12, 12:24 #4

This should be made a "sticky". I'm surprised that the mods haven't done a thread already.

Let's face it, this forum is going to be full of these threads between now and June, and most of us have no interest in navigating past dozens of "Euro 2012 apartment" adverts when all we really want to read about is Polish women (joking) ;)

Perhaps a combined Euro 2012/Balkan forum is the solution? lol.

Over to you, mods ;)

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Jan 15, 12, 13:20 #5

mate, those websites are all in polish, haven't got a clue what they're talking about, any english ones?

Rick, that's the very reason I included a short glossary of terms, which really allows even a person that doesn't speak a word of Polish to navigate listed sites.

But of course if you can't be bothered to use it there are all these "nice" people wanting to hook you up with their 9 times overpriced homes and flats, just get in touch with them.

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Jan 15, 12, 13:23 #6

Midas:

Midas, " I spend a ton of time in Poland and I'd like to use my knowledge and experience to help anyone who is looking for short term accommodation in Poland during EURO2012"

This above is the point of fail, you may spend a ton of time in Warsaw,Gdansk, Poznan, Wroclaw or krakow and know the cities well the football fans turning up don't. For the fans browsing this thread,they are NOT going to able to contact owners of apartments or house's directly and negotiate a cheap deal, because no self respecting property owner knows if his property will be available in June/July 2012, he may get a tenant tomorrow for a 12 month contract, the rental market in Warsaw is now fast moving. For those that know anything about tourism, they must understand the closer we getting to Euro 2012 the less availability there will be, most hotel rooms were sold two years ago to agencies.

There are companies that offer short term lets, here is a couple in Warsaw:

http://www.apartmentsapart.com/warsaw_hotels/index.htm

http://www.warsawapartments.org/

http://oldcityapartments.eu/warszawa/en/

I know Poland very well having lived here for many years, for those booking over the internet, your main concern should be the authenticity of the offer, the standard of the accommodation and most importantly location ' Cheap is always cheap for a reason ' there are a lot of 1960's ghetto's ( concrete jungles) you should avoid, as they could be dangerous, so make sure you get a second opinion on the location. Here is my list of areas to consider in Warsaw:

1. Stare/Nowe Miasto
2. Centrum
3.Muranow
4.Zoliborz
5.Powisle
6.Mokotow
7.Saska Kempa
8. Ochota (closer to centrum)
9. For those on a budget Praga, close to the zoo.

Maybe some other people from Wroclaw,Poznan,Gdansk and Krakow could also suggest the best areas in their cities.

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Wroclaw Boy Jan 15, 12, 14:22 #7

Midas:

We are really talking people offering at x or even xx times the going market rate here.

But the standard market rate doesnt include a time when a major football tournament is happening.

So basically your thread is a load of worn out underpants.

Midas:

since there are quite a few people who diss me for my Jewish heritage, I will point out that I'm absolutely in no way, shape or form promoting any of the properties I own or rent in Poland at the moment.

The reality is that im furios all my properties are either tied up under contract or in the wrong locations.

The Euro 2012 property adverts on this forum are perfectly acceptable and if the owners can get 1000 Euros a day or what ever then fair friggen play to them.

Midas bugger off with your do goody crap intentions.

PolishDomainsThreads: - Posts: 4 Joined: Dec 19, 11 ♀	Jan 15, 12, 14:23 #8
Short-term leases for a specific period, especially a period when hordes of tourists will be coming to town HAVE TO BE MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE than usual arrangements. That's real estate 101.

♂

Edited by: Midas Jan 15, 12, 14:47 #9

Edit: Mods, thank you for making this a sticky.

Midas bugger off with your do goody crap intentions.

Or what? You'll call mommy dear?

So basically your thread is a load of worn out underpants.

In case you haven't noticed, I'm just making it possible for a person who doesn't speak Polish to try to go out and get a better deal by using local resources.

You might think that a "major football tournament" is grounds enough to treat people from other countries like schmucks, I think they should have a way to shop around for deals better than 200 euro/day for a bedsit.

Don't like it?

Your problem not mine.

Short-term leases for a specific period, especially a period when hordes of tourists will be coming to town HAVE TO BE MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE than usual arrangements. That's real estate 101.

How much money have you got in real estate at the moment?

Because I seriously doubt you're in a position to write "real estate 101" to me :-).

I already wrote how the short-term lease issue can be approached in Poland ( I've rented holiday apartments in Cracow quite a few times like that ), cry me a bloody river if you don't like what I wrote.

because no self respecting property owner knows if his property will be available in June/July 2012,

I've rented apartments short-term on Florianska, Karmelicka and Sw. Tomasza ( or Sw. Jana, I don't recall exactly ) in Cracow, Poland with the method I described in my first post.

That's Old Town and all of them were worth in excess of 1 million zloty.

But yes, I'm sure their owners just lacked self-respect and they just fell prey to my chutzpah.

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Jan 15, 12, 16:22 #10

Midas:

ut yes, I'm sure their owners just lacked self-respect and they just fell prey to my chutzpah.

You can rent an apartment today, just off the square in Krakow for 150PLN per night, come June 2012 you won't get a bed for under 300PLN per night. Midas no one is falling prey to your chutzpah apart from you shmoozing the odd Schmendrick or shiker at best, your just another Shnorrer. Cheap is not cheap, Midas.

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Jan 15, 12, 16:26 #11

I already mentioned I don't want this thread going down personal avenue or antisemite alley.

Anything personal you got to say - feel free to use the private message fuction.

The toolbox is there for anyone who wants to use it, results are obviously not guaranteed and for some odd reason some of you act as if I stole your lunchmoney.

hythornThreads: 6 Posts: 843 Joined: Feb 21, 08 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 16:30 #12
Wedle: shmoozing the odd Schmendrick or shiker at best, your just another Shnorrer look who got a Yiddish dictionary for Christmas

WedleThreads: 24 Posts: 786 Joined: Sep 27, 11 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 16:35 #13
hythorn: look who got a Yiddish dictionary for Christmas Nah mate, look who spent over 10 years working alongside New York and North London Jews.

MidasThreads: 2 Posts: 788 Joined: Jul 19, 10 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 16:39 #14
who spent over 10 years working alongside New York and North London Jews Where you obviously went around calling every person of Jewish descent a "Shnorrer" and all was fine and dandy, no lawsuits or anything... <sarcasm>. Again, let's keep the personal stuff out of this one, this topic is about helping people not to get shafted and not about Jews or anyone else.

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Jan 15, 12, 17:02 #15

Midas:

Where you obviously went around calling every person of Jewish descent a "Shnorrer" and all was fine and dandy, no lawsuits or anything... <sarcasm>

"Shnorrer" was a standard jew on jew disposable comment.

Midas:

Again, let's keep the personal stuff out of this one, this topic is about helping people not to get shafted and not about Jews or anyone else

I am happy to go with the above, lets keep the guilt lines off the thread, especially the classic conversation stopper "antisemite"

Getting back on thread, people are going to charge what they believe they can get or what their neighbors have already got, if football fans want to do it on the cheap, I believe the best deals will be in towns 30-50 KLM away from the main cities.

Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57 Posts: 5,478 Joined: Jul 3, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Wroclaw Boy Jan 15, 12, 17:39 #16
if you actually really want to help -access the better deals for Euro 2012 and publish here, coming up with standard rental rates as a comparison is just rediculous. chalk and cheeze. Midas: Mods, thank you for making this a sticky. What, who did that? Why is this thread a sticky? If you want to make a euro 2012 rental thread sticky choose one without a title like this.

♂

Edited by: Midas Jan 15, 12, 17:50 #17

if you actually really want to help -access the better deals for Euro 2012 and publish here, coming up with standard rental rates as a comparison is just rediculous. chalk and cheeze.

I'm sorry, I have a very bad allergic reaction that kicks in every time someone asks me to work for free... Always had it. So I won't be doing that anytime soon.

I provided the tools, what people make of them is up to them.

coming up with standard rental rates

This thread wouldn't have been started, but I came across the joker who wrote he expects 200 euro/day for his small apartments in Poznań.

I'm just allowing the short-term lease crowd a bit more space to manouver, what's the problem with that?

Why is this thread a sticky? If you want to make a euro 2012 rental thread sticky choose one without a title like this.

Sure, let's bury this topic as deep as we can, I mean it is an outrage to actually help people get a shot at a better deal <sarcasm>

Again, many thanks to whomever decided to sticky the thread.

irishguy11Threads: 14 Posts: 173 Joined: Sep 3, 11 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 17:57 #18
It seems to be quiet simple. The people that are too lazy/dumb to find a good deal will pay over the odds. All of these people that are advertising a flat for 2000 to 4000 zl per day will simply have a empty flat for the summer time. People themselves will know how much they want to pay. It is a market price after all, and markets can crash.

MEMBER ♂

Jan 15, 12, 18:53 #19

Midas:

I came across the joker who wrote he expects 200 euro/day for his small apartments in Poznań.

He'll get it too. Do you know anything about supply and demand?

Midas:

I'm sorry, I have a very bad allergic reaction that kicks in every time someone asks me to work for free

Its not work, merely an extension to this thread which you so gracefully decided to publish for free, if youre going to try and help people atleast do a proper job.

irishguy11:

It is a market price after all, and markets can crash.

crash, as in the football matches will just not take place?

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Jan 15, 12, 18:58 #20

Wroclaw Boy:

crash, as in the football matches will just not take place?

No, not the matches will not take place. What I mean is that people will avoid the high prices and then the apartment owners will be forced to adjust their price. It's a question of who will break first, the fan who needs a bed or the apartment owner who may know that their price is too high.

If there is a oversupply of apartments, then they can be played against each other closer to the date.

♂ [Moderator]

Jan 15, 12, 19:16 #21

Midas:

EURO 2012 "don't be a schmuck and read it before you rent"

lots of property and prices to argue over.

i've just checked some hotels for the period of euro 2012. there are still rooms available here in wroclaw. the prices are a bit extreme for my taste, but they are worth checking against the prices offered by forum posters.

i wonder if some folk just assume that hotels are fully booked. it must be worth an hour of ones time to check.

Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57 Posts: 5,478 Joined: Jul 3, 09 MEMBER ♂	Jan 15, 12, 19:19 #22
irishguy11: people will avoid the high prices humans dont behave in that way, they want everything arranged and in order long before their departure.

irishguy11Threads: 14 Posts: 173 Joined: Sep 3, 11 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 19:22 #23
Human's also don't want to be ripped off.

WedleThreads: 24 Posts: 786 Joined: Sep 27, 11 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 19:36 #24
irishguy11: Human's also don't want to be ripped off. So then they can go with the ' Tent city option' http://www.tentresorts.com/tent-resorts

WedleThreads: 24 Posts: 786 Joined: Sep 27, 11 ♂	Edited by: Wedle Jan 15, 12, 19:52 #25
Midas: This thread wouldn't have been started, but I came across the joker who wrote he expects 200 euro/day for his small apartments in Poznań. Well try this for a joke ' Tent city' 12m2 swiss cottage tent with bunk beds for 6 and a 5m2 terrace. 6 persons - 7 nights 6,500 Euro. Nice price if you can get it eh http://www.tentresorts.com/warsaw-football-fans-camp. try and book yourself one.

♂

Edited by: Midas Jan 15, 12, 19:53 #26

1. Seriously, insults, stupid supply/demand questions --> use the private message function.

2. Some of you people act as if you have a dog in the fight. If I stole your lunchmoney or ruined your plans of renting grandmas crumbling pad to foreigners for crazy prices then I'm very sorry :-)

No, I'm not, just kidding.

3.

' Tent city option'

Because obviously the only choice that foreigners coming to Poland for the EURO should have is either pay some joker 200 euro/day ( "and don't forget the D-E-P-O-S-I-T, how fast can you wire it to me? gimme,gimme,gimme monies" ) or sleep in tents...

4. Bottom line seems to be, the thread is here, doesn't look like it is getting deleted because the mods probably think foreigners coming for the EURO deserve a better shot at more affordable prices without having to sleep in tents.

Deal with it without any more insults :-)

5.

Well try this for a joke ' Tent city' 12m2 swiss cottage tent with bunk beds for 6 and a 5m2 terrace. 6 persons - 7 nights 6,500 Euro. Nice price if you can get it eh

http://www.tentresorts.com/warsaw-football-fans-camp. try and book yourself one.

Someone fell on his head. Hard.

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Jan 15, 12, 19:59 #27

I have one question for you. Why did you mention that you are jewish? It does not make a difference what religion you are, as long as the deal is good. I think you set your self up here, as you did not provide any info on alternative prices for Euro 2012. You say you should not work for zero, why did you start this thread. Also all Polish websites can be translated in to English using google chrome.

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Jan 15, 12, 20:03 #28

I have one question for you. Why did you mention that you are jewish? It does not make a difference what religion you are, as long as the deal is good.

I fully agree, however please be so kind and look up the "deleted" bin for anti-semite content that was removed from this thread ( "antheads" guy ).

why did you start this thread.

Already explained.

Also all Polish websites can be translated in to English using google chrome.

Didn't know that, good advice for the guy from Belfast up there.

irishguy11Threads: 14 Posts: 173 Joined: Sep 3, 11 ♂	Jan 15, 12, 20:06 #29
Common mistake, I thought he would have google chrome. It is very handy.

MEMBER ♂

Jan 15, 12, 20:27 #30

Midas:

No, I'm not, just kidding.

Boom there it is right there.

Midas:

( "and don't forget the D-E-P-O-S-I-T, how fast can you wire it to me? gimme,gimme,gimme monies" ) or sleep in tents...

Keep talking buddy your true colours are showing more and more with every word.

Its not often that i would take pleasure from somebody elses miss fortune however, in your case im glad you lost fortunes on Polish property investment, oooh thats gotta hurt......

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