January Uprisings of 1863

Completely different and incomparable set of circumstances.

You are right that I have no True Evidence. From what I have read, many seemingly politically motivated murders in Russia will go unsolved.

I merely formulated my opinion that Russia will not apologize to the Polish People for something that happened so many years ago based on the current Russian climate of fear in regards to "freedom of speach" in the media. As a westerner, it appears to me that in some aspects, not much has changed since the communist times in Russia.

It has been insinuated in the western media that the hands of the Russian Government and it's agencies are not clean in the murders people who held views contrary to that of the government.

These opinions have been based on articles like the following:

"Politkovskaya was not, it is true, the first Russian journalist to be murdered in murky circumstances since 2000, when President Vladimir Putin came to power. Among the worst crimes -- all, of course, unsolved -- were the murders of two provincial journalists from the city of Togliatti, probably for investigating local mafia; of Paul Klebnikov , the American editor of Forbes magazine's Russian edition, probably for knowing too much about Russia's oligarchs; and of a Murmansk television reporter who was critical of local politicians."

"Nevertheless, Politkovskaya's murder marks a distinct turning point. There was no attempt to disguise the murder as a theft or an accident: Her assassin not only shot her in broad daylight, but he left her body in the elevator of her apartment building alongside the gun he used to kill her -- standard practice for Moscow's arrogant hit men. Nor can her murder be easily attributed to distant provincial authorities or the criminal mafia: Local businessmen had no motivation to kill her -- but officials of the army, the police and even the Kremlin did. Whereas local thieves might have tried to cover their tracks, Politkovskaya's assassin, like so many Russian assassins, did not seem to fear the law."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/08/AR2006 100800919.html



Perhaps I could learn something through discussion and participation.

First of all, pardon me please for my some sort of verbal aggression.

So my ansestors fighted in 1863 near Suwalki. I know the story that after misfortune of up rise, Russians have taken all young man form family (6) to syberia, they decided to try to back to home and only one was succesfull and was back home. Rest of them died.



As to my family I m mix of Polish - Lithuenaian nobels and I m a litle bit (little little ;) ) duke, because I have blood of Radziwil family.

Was that man your ancestor? Was yur family Suwalki resident? Do your ancestors precede from Suwalki powiat from dark centuries?
Where did they live in powiat and what do you know about their way of life?

Very interesting thing. Did you manage to find socuments on nobility confirmations in 1815-1830 and 1835-1855? Many details can be learned from these papers

Do you mean some of your ancestors were from Crown and some from Lithuania?

Are 1863 among your famoliars mentioned in lists of arested people?

Do you know what is Radziwł family ?

I know that my father is a litle bit radzwil, and my grandfather was always arguing with his cusine (he had surname Radziwil) what was better for Radziwł to do.(aguing about the past). But Radziwil isnt my main origin.

It is my coat of arms coming stright from my name and main tradition.

No persons who didn't hear about that family.

That is something new to such ignorant person as I. I thought Radziwil surname disappeared in 19 century because last men of this family didn't have sons.

To defend Lithuanian Independence!

What is the name of this Coat of arms?

http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radziwiłłowie

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubicz_(herb_szlachecki)

Oh!!! I'm so ignorant!!!
Maybe it was told that duke dissapeared, not their relatives

Well I remember now. My grandgrandmother was of Lubicz as everybody of Onichimowski surname from Wolkowysk powiat.
But I don't pay attention to Coat of arms because their reception is so dark in Lithuania.

glorious for me as a Pole

For small Lithuanian szlachta it may be in many cases doubtful.

as I know my fathers familly came there (north east Poland) form Crakow region. but it was long long time ago ...

They don't seem to be a small szlachta as my mother's ancestors.
I wrote only that I can hardly imagine Clan admission of smal families of some 1-2 wolokas

Wasn't that Great Duchy of Lithuania before 17 century? I write about Suwalki

I mentioned Suwalki because it was the nearest town on map, but my ansestors fortune was definately in Great Duchy of Lithuania

Shall you mention exact names of gmins? That is very interesting. I payed much attention to Suwalki powiat and neighbouring lands. My grandgrandmother was born in Grodno

To be honest I cant tell much more than you can find yourself, I know stories about wars, and things like that but I cant descirbe you current situation there or situation in the past.

You may look for ancestors documents in Sain Petersbourg as I did

any details? why in Russia ?

There was a body called Senate of Russian Empire. Within it there was a Department of Geroldia ( Департамент Герольдии). Poles and Lithuanians adressed copies of burth rates and documents on property in past to confirm nobility. You may learn mani details from that documents.

First consult Seweryn Uruski if your surnames are before letter R

thank you for information, now I m rather concentrated on researches about my famili fight in years 1945-52 ... there is new book about one of memberes of my family, but maybe in future I will do new researches, about more ancient history ;)

http://podziemiezbrojne.blox.pl/html/1310721,262146,21.html?330888