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Question about podoba sie

ranrod Threads: 7
Posts: 36
Joined: Aug 28, 2010
  ♂   Aug 28, 2010, 02:34am  #

I thought I was doing great in my learning of the Polish language until I saw this expression. It makes no sense to me, can anyone help me understand the logic behind it?

"Podobasz sie mu" -> He likes you (as in, he thinks you're cute ...sidenote: using "Lubic" would imply he likes you as a friend)
"You yourself like, him"??? <- is the way I read it

It seems to violate the 2nd person rule. In this Podobasz, the ending sz doesn't seem to correlate to an action by the subject (2nd person rule). "Ty Podobasz" -> "YOU like". The reflexive "sie" doesn't seem do much to change the meaning of it.

If it's supposed to be, "you are liked...", that would be "Jestes lubiany...", which makes sense.
I could write: "Jemu sie ty podoba" (He likes you) I'm probably inserting 'ty' incorrectly here, but the sentence structure writing it like this makes sense to me.

If it's an expression (figure of speech), those often don't make sense (as in, "sup foo" in English). Is "Podobasz sie mu" like that?

gram     Aug 28, 2010, 02:54am  #

"Jemu sie ty podoba" (He likes you)

The correct way is: "Podobasz mu się" (he likes you)

If you use 'podobasz' then there's no need to insert 'Ty' before 'podobasz.'

ranrod Threads: 7
Posts: 36
Joined: Aug 28, 2010
  ♂   Edited by: ranrod  Aug 28, 2010, 03:07am  #

Thanks for the response. The "Podobasz" part is the part confusing me. Since it's in 2nd person, it says the action is being taken by the second person, in this case "liking", yet the sentence, "Podobasz mu sie" still claims that the action is being taken by the object instead (He/Him), which makes no grammatical sense to me. Any further explanation would be greatly appreciated.

mafketis Threads: 16
Posts: 1,881
Joined: Mar 31, 2008
  ♂   Edited by: mafketis  Aug 28, 2010, 09:36am  #

Basically in Polish, liking is often expresed in the opposite way from English.

The person/thing that is liked is the subject.

The person that likes is in the dative case. The dative is often used for experiences a person has no conscious control over.


Another of thinking of it is to rephrase podobać się as 'to be pleasing to someone'

podobasz mu się
you-are-pleasing to-him (się not relevant here)

podobasz mu się (you are pleasing to him)

podoba mi się (it is pleasing to me)

czy podobam wam się (am I pleasing to you(pl)?)

Also, note that traditionally podobać się is more superficial and not necessarily emotional. Lubić also means like but works like English and it expresses a stronger emotional attachment.

podobać się = esthetically pleasing

lubić = emotional

noreenb Threads: 7
Posts: 777
Joined: Apr 22, 2009
  ♀   Aug 28, 2010, 10:58am  #

I had a problem when I heard from my friend "I like you very much."
Did it mean:
1). He was a "victim" of a love from "first sight".
2). He liked me.
3). He found me attractive.
4). Other options ......
Till today I don't have a clue what did it mean.
:)

peter_olsztyn Threads: 7
Posts: 1,017
Joined: Apr 18, 2007
  ♂   Aug 28, 2010, 08:05pm  #

noreenb:
He was a "victim" of a love from "first sight"


Has he got sparks in his eyes and sweat on his palms? ;)

cinek Threads: 2
Posts: 378
Joined: Nov 16, 2007
  ♂   Edited by: cinek  Aug 31, 2010, 10:17am  #

noreenb:
I had a problem when I heard from my friend "I like you very much."

2). He liked me.


However the 'very much' may suggest something more.

To make things as easy as possible:

1. Lubić = to like

Ja lubię ciebie (usually just 'lubię cię') = I like you (you as a person, no matter what you look like)

This one works the same direction as in English:
I = Subject, you = object
Ja = Subject , ty (ciebie) = object


2. Podobać się = to look attractive or nicely to someone

Ty mi się podobasz (usually 'podobasz mi się') = I like how you look (no matter if you are a nice person or whether I hate you or love you)

This one works the 'opposite way':
in English: I = subject, you = object
in Polish: Ty = subject, ja (mi) = object.

The 'się' here is just a part of the verb and it means nothing. You just have to memorize that it must be there.

I hope it helps you a little.

Cinek

noreenb Threads: 7
Posts: 777
Joined: Apr 22, 2009
  ♀   Aug 31, 2010, 11:27am  #

Thank you very much!!!
You are very nice.
:)

Lyzko     Sep 9, 2010, 06:20pm  #

'podobać się komu' functions almost exactly as 'jemandem gefallen' in German. It's the same reflexive idea of 'someone/-thing' is pleasing TO... and also takes the Dative case. Many verbs in Polish are similar to German. As far as '(s)podobać się':

Podobasz mi się = Du gefaellst mir = I like you (lit. "You are pleasing to me.")
Podobam Ci się = Ich gefalle dir = You like me (lit. "I am pleasing to you.")

etc..

zetigrek     Sep 9, 2010, 07:12pm  #

cinek:
The 'się' here is just a part of the verb and it means nothing. You just have to memorize that it must be there.


it means somrthing like "self". Such verbs are called czasowniki zwrotne (lit. translation: turning verbs?). And the idea of it can be easly explained in other example:

(Ja) myję się (I wash myself)

try to compere it with:

(Ty) podobasz się - we can't translate it literally into english (but not literally it means you atracts others, you are liked).

NorthMancPolak Threads: 5
Posts: 867
Joined: Jun 13, 2010
  ♂   Sep 9, 2010, 07:35pm  #

cinek:
The 'się' here is just a part of the verb and it means nothing.


Actually, it means quite a lot, as pointed out in post #10., but you can't translate it's usage directly into English; you couldn't say "I'm attracting myself to someone", you would say "I'm attractive to someone", etc.

cinek:
However the 'very much' may suggest something more.

To make things as easy as possible:


Or, more informally "myśli, że jesteś bardzo fajną laseczką" :D

mafketis Threads: 16
Posts: 1,881
Joined: Mar 31, 2008
  ♂   Sep 9, 2010, 08:10pm  #

zetigrek:
it means somrthing like "self". Such verbs are called czasowniki zwrotne (lit. translation: turning verbs?). And the idea of it can be easly explained in other example:

(Ja) myję się (I wash myself)

try to compere it with:

(Ty) podobasz się - we can't translate it literally into english (but not literally it means you atracts others, you are liked).


The term you want is 'reflexive' and sometimes się is used reflexively as in your first example.

At other times it just makes a transitive verb (one with an object) intransitive (one without an object). At even other times it has no clear surface meaning.

podobać się seems to be in this last group as it neither indicates a direct object nor is their a transitive verb (that I know of) podobać

SzwedwPolsce Threads: 13
Posts: 1,881
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
  ♂   Edited by: SzwedwPolsce  Sep 9, 2010, 08:44pm  #

It's not so difficult.

Podoba mi się twoje buty. = Lit. Your shoes are attracting me. (Your shoes are attractive to me).

The person who likes is the object (dative) and the thing that is liked is the subject (nominative).

Lyzko     Sep 9, 2010, 10:25pm  #

A thousand pardons, but shouldn't the phrase here read "PodobaJĄ mi się twoje buty." owing to the subject-verb agreement in the plural, or is 'buty' a singular collective, much as 'pair of shoes' in English? Cf. American English: "I just saw my pair of brown shoes, but now it's (but also "they're") gone!"

Only a query, not a comment or a correction-:)

pgtx Threads: 50
Posts: 4,723
Joined: Feb 14, 2009
  ♀   Sep 9, 2010, 10:26pm  #

Lyzko:
"I just saw my pair of brown shoes, but now it's (but also "they're") gone!"

oh my gosh... what are you going to do now...?
;)

Lyzko:
houldn't the phrase here read "PodobaJĄ mi się twoje buty."

yes... good eye...

Lyzko     Sep 10, 2010, 07:01pm  #

Thanks for that, pgtx! My eye often catches the errors of others faster than my own. Często szybciej względem błedy innych ludzi od moich błędów.

Zed Threads: -
Posts: 272
Joined: May 25, 2010
  ♂   Sep 10, 2010, 07:29pm  #

Lyzko:

Często szybciej zauważam błędy innych od moich własnych (błędów).

It sounds better that way.....

SzwedwPolsce Threads: 13
Posts: 1,881
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
  ♂   Edited by: SzwedwPolsce  Sep 10, 2010, 07:30pm  #

I have a pretty good explaination of this kind of constructions, that I can scan and send if anyone wants it.

Lyzko:
but shouldn't the phrase here read "PodobaJĄ mi się twoje buty."

Yes, it's true, buty is a plural word. My mistake.

polishmeknob Threads: 10
Posts: 164
Joined: Feb 9, 2009
  ♂   Sep 10, 2010, 08:07pm  #

Think of it as "You are pleasing to him."

Lyzko     Sep 11, 2010, 09:29pm  #

Dziękuję, zetku-:)))

@Szwedwpolsce, it was my pleasure.

ColdSteel Threads: -
Posts: 23
Joined: Dec 17, 2011
  ♀   Jan 13, 2012, 01:14am  #

It's like 'me gusta' in Spanish ;)

Seriously - I don't think there is much sense in overanalysing it for the start. Try to find any way to memorise it, with time you'll get used to this construction and it will look more natural. Various languages have various constructions, often a lot of similarities can be found, but those differences can be real fun.


My comment: "podobać się" is not necessarily about physical attraction, it can be also used to show appreciation. You can say "Podoba mi się, jak to załatwiłeś" (I like the way you dealt with it.) or "Podobał ci się ten film?" (Did you like that film?). It's just "lubić" is usually more emotional when talking about people, but when you talk about things, it's considered neutral like 'Lubię pływać, lubię jabłka, lubię swoją pracę" (I like to swim, I like apples, I like my job". "Podobać się" is also more about appreciation. It's just talking about people when they get tricky. Just remember 'lubić' somebody in Polish means friendly feelings and "podobać się" about a person means finding somebody alluring.

Lyzko     Jan 13, 2012, 02:25pm  #

...or "jemandem etwas gefallen" in German.

ColdSteel Threads: -
Posts: 23
Joined: Dec 17, 2011
  ♀   Jan 14, 2012, 02:00am  #

Exactly. It's not such a strange construction when one compares it to other European languages. :)


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