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Controlling the internet ACTA in Poland (Like SOPA)

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Edited by: Administrator  Jan 24, 2012, 05:50pm  #

I'd like to get your views on ACTA or SOPA and PIPA if you're in the United States.

Here is an artical, in English, about ACTA in Poland:

Polish Internet went supernova when three days ago it was announced that our government was going to sign ACTA. It came out of nowhere, and most Polish users didn't follow the SOPA/PIPA legislation battle of the US – it seemed much more distant than it is now. First came the official statement from our President's bureau, in which Poland was supposedly achieving great international success by catching up with the world standards of copyright protection. We were to sign ACTA on January 26.

This was registered by a few niche websites, and went for the most part unnoticed by the mass media. Bloggers and youtubers started to dig into the subject, research the legislation itself and post comments so that more people would get interested. We were caught totally off-guard, but luckily, the Internet stood up to the challenge: in the next 24 hours, literally hundreds of thousands of people started to speak out, write letters to our government, organize protests, record videos and hype the thing up.


(don't know how many words it is mods). too many.


SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Edited by: Moderator  Jan 24, 2012, 05:55pm  #

Here's one about SOPA:



Gregrog Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 24, 2012, 08:45pm  #

Now we can see how different are PolishForums and Poland. In Poland there is now flame war about ACTA while here it is just a few comments:D

Admin Threads: 60
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  ♂ Administrator   Jan 24, 2012, 11:50pm  #

Gregrog:
Now we can see how different are PolishForums and Poland. In Poland there is now flame war about ACTA while here it is just a few comments:D

That's because Poles in Poland experience the censorship of the mainstream media, whereas here they still have freedom of speech :).

Marek11111 Threads: 20
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 12:03am  #

Admin:
That's because Poles in Poland experience the censorship of the mainstream media, whereas here they still have freedom of speech :).

Where is here? You not talking about media in United States are you?

Admin Threads: 60
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  ♂ Administrator   Jan 25, 2012, 12:06am  #

Marek11111:
You not talking about media in United States are you?

All mainstream media around the world. Polish mainstream media usually translate/reprint the world news from the US or British media anyway.

chichimera Threads: 1
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  ♀   Jan 25, 2012, 12:14am  #

Admin:
Polish mainstream media usually translate/reprint the world news from the US or British media anyway.

Good to know that I'm not the only one who's noticed that

Marek11111 Threads: 20
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 12:25am  #

Admin:
Polish mainstream media usually translate/reprint the world news from the US or British media anyway.

In United States they report garbage the corporation and government is censoring news and they go along with a lie, but some time reporters say the truth and they get fire so Poland does not need to pass anything it already has it.

hythorn Threads: 4
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 11:55am  #



just to put things into context, I saw the following quote posted under this Monty Python video posted on YouTube

''Sopa will ban this video and the owner will be in jail for probably 5-10 years or a 500 000$ fine. Please protest''

Gregrog Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 01:13pm  #

Admin:
That's because Poles in Poland experience the censorship of the mainstream media, whereas here they still have freedom of speech :).

You have noticed that ACTA refers to all EU countries? Also SOPA/PIPA to US, Canada, Japan, Australia and Morocco? If yes, please tell me why do you refer to censorship exclusively in Poland?

JonnyM Threads: 15
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  ♂   Edited by: JonnyM  Jan 25, 2012, 01:21pm  #

Gregrog:
please tell me why do you refer to censorship exclusively in Poland?

Have a look at the top of this page. Particularly the name of this forum.

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 02:04pm  #

I always thought that the censorship of the internet would come under the guise of anti-terrorism, seems to be the phrase that pays these days.

How could "occupy wallstreet" or such information be spread so quickly without the internet? I don't think it could be.

I can see how the internet has made the powers that be, who are very happy with the statuesque, would want to limit our information.

I dislike making comparisons to the Soviet Union but here we are.

What do youz think about the Anonymous group?
I don't know the full ins and outs of them but someone has to make a stand.

Anonymous

Gregrog Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 02:06pm  #

And yet no big discussion about ACTA here:) Even and especially it is about Poland.

As Marek said, where is "here"?

hythorn Threads: 4
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 02:46pm  #

Gregrog:
And yet no big discussion about ACTA here:) Even and especially it is about Poland.


I was speaking to some IT dweebs and the law kicks in tomorrow apparently

it will be interesting to see if the torrent sites will still be up and running and accessible from Poland

however it could be an end to downloading films and music

how in practice, the authorities are going to enforce all this downloading is anyone's guess
however blocking access to the torrent source sites would be a good place to start

FUZZYWICKETS Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 03:26pm  #

Marek11111:
In United States they report garbage the corporation and government is censoring news and they go along with a lie



Interesting how you bring up the USA specifically while overlooking other countries like.....ooohh I don't know....China?

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 06:20pm  #

FUZZYWICKETS:
Interesting how you bring up the USA specifically while overlooking other countries

The agreement has so far been signed by the United States, Australia, Canada, Japan, Morocco, New Zealand, Singapore and South Korea.

bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16686265

Gregrog Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 06:31pm  #

hythorn:
how in practice, the authorities are going to enforce all this downloading is anyone's guess
however blocking access to the torrent source sites would be a good place to start


ACTA force ISP to share information about user activity in internet with for example RIAA without court decision. Isn't it enough?

Of course it won't be like that tomorrow will it happen - it will take time.

FUZZYWICKETS:
Interesting how you bring up the USA specifically while overlooking other countries like.....ooohh I don't know....China?

Maybe because China do not pretend to be land of freedom?

delphiandomine Threads: 54
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  ♂  :-( Jan 25, 2012, 06:44pm  #

hythorn:
I was speaking to some IT dweebs and the law kicks in tomorrow apparently


It's not quite so simple - after signing, it must be ratified by Poland. It's quite possible that it will stay in legal limbo for years - quite a few international treaties remain unsigned for decades, like the Vienna Convention on Road Traffic with some countries. I'm predicting that the Government won't dare to attempt to ratify it - especially because there's already a broad consensus against signing it.

Even if it does get passed by the Sejm/Senat - Komorowski has shown that he's willing to veto things when there exists clear public opposition to something.

GabiDaHun Threads: 2
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  ♀   Jan 25, 2012, 07:04pm  #

delphiandomine:
It's not quite so simple - after signing, it must be ratified by Poland. It's quite possible that it will stay in legal limbo for years - quite a few international treaties remain unsigned for decades, like the Vienna Convention on Road Traffic with some countries. I'm predicting that the Government won't dare to attempt to ratify it - especially because there's already a broad consensus against signing it.

Even if it does get passed by the Sejm/Senat - Komorowski has shown that he's willing to veto things when there exists clear public opposition to something.



You have no idea how pleased I am to hear this. I was talking to my (only) student today. He (and his students) are under the impression that there will be no more downloading after today, and that YouTube will cease to exist. I'd heard about this ratification procedure - and he wasn't sure what it was.

Seems like everyone is in the dark over this.

There's a protest in the Stare Miasto in Krakow today. I'm sure they are taking place all over Poland.

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 07:19pm  #

GabiDaHun:
There's a protest in the Stare Miasto in Krakow today. I'm sure they are taking place all over Poland.

They are.

GabiDaHun:
Seems like everyone is in the dark over this.

That seems to be a major part of the problem.

Secrecy of negotiations (Wiki)

"Government Should Lift Veil on ACTA Secrecy", noting that before documents leaked on the Internet, ACTA was shrouded in secrecy. Coverage of the documents by the Toronto Star "sparked widespread opposition as Canadians worry about the prospect of a trade deal that could lead to invasive searches of personal computers and increased surveillance of online activities." Geist argued that public disclosure of the draft ACTA treaty "might put an end to fears about iPod searching border guards" and that it "could focus attention on other key concerns including greater Internet service provider filtering of content, heightened liability for websites that link to allegedly infringing content, and diminished privacy for Internet users." Geist also argued that greater transparency would lead to a more inclusive process, highlighting that the ACTA negotiations have excluded both civil society groups as well as developing countries. Geist reported that "reports suggest that trade negotiators have been required to sign non-disclosure agreements for fear of word of the treaty's provisions leaking to the public." He argued that there is a need for "cooperation from all stakeholders to battle counterfeiting concerns" and that "an effective strategy requires broader participation and regular mechanisms for feedback".[

Will we be telling our children about when the internet had free information?

Admin Threads: 60
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  ♂ Administrator   Edited by: Admin  Jan 25, 2012, 07:54pm  #

JonnyM:
Have a look at the top of this page. Particularly the name of this forum.

Ditto :
Gregrog:
And yet no big discussion about ACTA here:) Even and especially it is about Poland.

If you check some archive posts, my position about it has been clear from day one (ie. PF = freedom of speech). Some people argued how inappropriate it may be, but if nothing is done soon they will be the ones to cry to go back to the free Internet. Hopefully it won't be too late.
hythorn:
however it could be an end to downloading films and music

I wouldn't worry about films and music AT ALL (even though this actually helps some people to wake up because when they see a blank screen they start to think what's going on ;). You should worry about self-censorship (ie. you will not post truly what you think because you'd be afraid of being detained).

Wroclaw Boy Threads: 69
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 08:11pm  #

Censoring of the internet is a foregone conclusion if you ask me, its just a matter of time before they (the governments of the world) get their way. They simply cant risk the truth being published throughout the world at lightning speed, its a far to dangerous situation for them. Sure when it happens there will be a few riots and some protests etc but that will all blow over, they are more then prepared to take months of riots if need be than suffer the alternative.

The free internet is our saviour, we MUST protect it.

JonnyM Threads: 15
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 08:20pm  #

Admin:
If you check some archive posts, my position about it has been clear from day one (ie. PF = freedom of speech). Some people argued how inappropriate it may be, but if nothing is done soon they will be the ones to cry to go back to the free Internet. Hopefully it won't be too late.

Very true. Sometimes it's frustrating, but it's better than the alternative.

Free speech is something people fought for - the internet as a whole was a great step in that direction - but is it only temporary?

Admin Threads: 60
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  ♂ Administrator   Edited by: Admin  Jan 25, 2012, 08:31pm  #

Some people say that Boycott - not wars or violent demonstrations - will be the key to successfully fight for your rights in the future. If people are united, there's nothing that can defeat it. It is reported to work well both online and offline ;).

gwiazdeczka Threads: -
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  ♀   Jan 25, 2012, 08:45pm  #

ACTA concerns me also because it's going to restrict access to medicine. I am so glad it's finally coming under scrutiny from the public.

Barney Threads: 18
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  ♂   Edited by: Barney  Jan 25, 2012, 08:54pm  #

Admin:
Some people say that Boycott - not wars or violent demonstrations - will be the key to successfully fight for your rights in the future. If people are united, there's nothing that can defeat it. It is reported to work well both online and offline ;).

Unfortunately in the land of free speech we have this Antiboycott Compliance.

gwiazdeczka:
ACTA concerns me also because it's going to restrict access to medicine. I am so glad it's finally coming under scrutiny from the public.

Thats an important point generic medcines will be hit hard.

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Edited by: SeanBM  Jan 25, 2012, 09:33pm  #

Admin:
Boycott - not wars or violent demonstrations - will be the key to successfully fight for your rights in the future.

And that's what happened, fair play to them:
Wikipedia community announced its decision to black out the English-language Wikipedia for 24 hours, worldwide, beginning at 05:00 UTC on Wednesday, January 18 (you can read the statement from the Wikimedia Foundation here). The blackout is a protest against proposed legislation in the United States – the Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) in the U.S. House of Representatives, and the PROTECT IP Act (PIPA) in the U.S. Senate – that, if passed, would seriously damage the free and open Internet, including Wikipedia.


English Wikipedia anti-SOPA blackout

more than 7 million other Americans – who stood up for the Web


Google too

And:

  • Wired.com, where the homepage is redacted, at least until you mouse over the content;
  • Greenpeace.org, where the Internet has gone dark and your mouse acts as a spotlight;
  • Mashable.com, where the front page looks almost normal, but the content is all about SOPA, including 'This is the Internet After SOPA [PICS]";
  • Google.com, where they've blacked-out the Google logo in a way that sustains the site's basic functionality—so they're not misusing their power too much— but makes their point very, very clear.

Washington Post

Reddit and the blog Boing Boing are also took part in the "blackout". BBC

The internet is the only free voice, much of the information we share could not be accessed any other way.

Wroclaw Boy Threads: 69
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 09:34pm  #

Admin:
Some people say that Boycott - not wars or violent demonstrations - will be the key to successfully fight for your rights in the future.

True but its going to be difficult spreading the word with a censored internet.

Gregrog Threads: 8
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  ♂   Jan 25, 2012, 09:41pm  #

Admin:
If you check some archive posts, my position about it has been clear from day one (ie. PF = freedom of speech). Some people argued how inappropriate it may be, but if nothing is done soon they will be the ones to cry to go back to the free Internet. Hopefully it won't be too late.

It does not matter what your rules here are, because they will and are defined by agreements like ACTA and you can do nothing about it. They just say you are breaking the law and you will be prosecuted.

But it was not my intention to discuss freedom of speech here but I just put observation that the thing which are concerning Poland now, have small coverage here, on PF. It simply shows gap between PL and PF :)

Today there was demonstration in Krakow of about 10 000 people against ACTA. Also in many other cities there were demonstrations.

SeanBM Threads: 42
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  ♂   Edited by: SeanBM  Jan 25, 2012, 09:42pm  #

I think what will happen is this, they will start in with this anti-copy right censorship, then hackers will attack governments (as they have been doing).
Governents will see this as an act of "terrorism" and highten the "security" of the internet to catch these people.

After the hacking protest which closed down Prime Minister Tusk's web site over the weekend, the Polish government has said that it will enter into a "period of consultation" before deciding whether to ratify the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement.


thenews.pl

It'll all be done in the name of "security".

Which begs the question, whose security?

Trickle down

Barney:
Unfortunately in the land of free speech we have this Antiboycott Compliance.

And what's a fecking "Moslem"? If they are going to ban freedom of speech, least they can do is get their spelling right.




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Controlling the internet ACTA in Poland (Like SOPA)

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