Is there anything Poland won't do for money? “Wolf’s Lair”

♂

Jan 19, 12, 10:12 #1

I had to laugh at this articles I seen on a news website.
Apparently,
"POLAND HAS PUT an infamous Nazi war base – Adolf Hitler’s so-called “Wolf’s Lair” - up for rent"

http://www.thejournal.ie/poland-puts-hitlers-bunker-up-for-rent-331479 -Jan2012/

Yea, soon you'll be able to rent out Hitler's old war base........
WTF is wrong with some people?

While we should always remember those who were sacrificed and those who sacrificed themselves for our freedom in the 2nd World War, I really don't see the point of turning this place into a tourist "attraction". You didn't see the German's turning Hitler's bunker into an attraction so why does Poland want to restore his old War Lair? I really cannot understand it, unless you want a f€ckin Mecca for all the shinheads.

GregrogThreads: 3 Posts: 114 Joined: Feb 2, 09 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 10:33 #2
In England in Wereham is Tank Museum which has a lot of German tanks from WWII. Should they be scrapped in your opinion as "objects of potential worship"?

♂

Jan 19, 12, 10:40 #3

smurf:

"POLAND HAS PUT an infamous Nazi war base – Adolf Hitler’s so-called “Wolf’s Lair” - up for rent"

In fact what they want to do is to lease it to a suitable organisation who will preserve the site and develop it as a museum, which the local forest authority in Ketrzyn doesn't have the money to do. It isn't as if they're renting it out as a wedding venue, or to nationalistic groups.

OlafThreads: 8 Posts: 1,369 Joined: Oct 29, 09 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 10:58 #4
JonnyM: In fact what they want to do is to lease it to a suitable organisation who will preserve the site and develop it as a museum, which the local forest authority in Ketrzyn doesn't have the money to do It seems like Smurf read only the headline or misunderstood the facts.

MEMBER ♀

Jan 19, 12, 13:53 #5

JonnyM:

In fact what they want to do is to lease it to a suitable organisation who will preserve the site and develop it as a museum, which the local forest authority in Ketrzyn doesn't have the money to do. It isn't as if they're renting it out as a wedding venue, or to nationalistic groups.

if what you are saying is right,i would be 100% in favour of this. at least the place will never be forgotten, and that is the most important issue.

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 19, 12, 14:00 #6

smurf:

Yea, soon you'll be able to rent out Hitler's old war base........

You already can. There have been a few events up there (film launches, etc).

smurf:

I really don't see the point of turning this place into a tourist "attraction".

It already is. It gets about 175,000 to 200,000 visitors per year (although David Irving reckons it gets far more).

smurf:

why does Poland want to restore his old War Lair?

They don't. And even if they wanted to, they couldn't, as anybody who been there (or even seen a video of the place) knows.

Anyway, as far as I know the forestry lot only own a 50% share in the site: the rest is owned by an Austrian company.

GabiDaHunThreads: 1 Posts: 66 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 20:57 #7
smurf: You didn't see the German's turning Hitler's bunker into an attraction Have you ever been to the Eagle's nest?

FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12 Posts: 1,999 Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 20:59 #8
Is this any different than profiting from Auschwitz visitors every year?

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 21:07 #9
I'm sure it's less about profit and more about preservation. Historical sites all over the world, from prisons and former plantations to mansions, are "rented" by governments to various non-profits, under the condition that they take good care of the places, even if they charge admission. I don't see any problem with it. At least there is someone accountable for it.

Grzegorz_Threads: 81 Posts: 6,213 Joined: Nov 16, 06 ♂	Edited by: Grzegorz_ Jan 19, 12, 21:18 #10
smurf: WTF is wrong with some people? Either you misunderstood the whole thing or there is something wrong with you. FUZZYWICKETS: Is this any different than profiting from Auschwitz visitors every year? So the museum over there should be shut down in your opinion ?

♂

Jan 19, 12, 21:58 #11

FUZZYWICKETS:

profiting from Auschwitz visitors every year

there's no entry fee so don't see how they profit from that.

Grzegorz_:

there is something wrong with yo

Grzegorz, your posts are always so warm and friendly. You're a credit to your nation.

I don't get it, I really don't. But you all have some interesting theories (except old Greggy) and each to their own. The only reason I could see for anyone to go there would be to dose the place in petrol and burn motherf€cker burn, I don't see how turning it into a museum will benefit anyone, unlike Oswiecim, or other camps, which were restored to pay tribute to those that suffered. I see no historical value in preserving a place where the scum of the earth ran their war campaign.

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 22:07 #12
i went to see it in 6th or 7th grade, and I thought it was an interesting place to see. there was a group from Israel there, too, I remember. just like i saw a bunch of black people visiting the sugar plantations around New Orleans last year - they didn't seem to want to set the places on fire, either.

AlligatorThreads: - Posts: 350 Joined: Dec 15, 10 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 22:14 #13
I don't see how turning it into a museum will benefit anyone, unlike Oswiecim, or other camps, which were restored to pay tribute to those that suffered. I see no historical value in preserving a place where the scum of the earth ran their war campaign.[quote][/quote] Well, I do see a reason to preserve a place where Claus von Stauffenberg tried to assassinate Hitler.

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 22:25 #14
i'd rather it was preserved as a reminder of where totalitarianism leads to

♂

Jan 19, 12, 23:01 #15

Alligator:

Claus von Stauffenberg tried to assassinate Hitler

somebody's been watchin Tom Cruise's movie lol.
dude there were 17 assassination attempts on Hitler between 39-45, http://members.iinet.net.au/~gduncan/assassination_attempts.html

& you do know that von Stauffenberg only wanted to kill Hitler so that they could surrender to the Allies before the Ruskies kicked Nazi ass? von Stauffenberg was a Nazi, he was no hero no matter what the king of Scientology would have you believe :P

FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12 Posts: 1,999 Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 23:21 #16
Grzegorz_: So the museum over there should be shut down in your opinion ? no. why are you asking me that. smurf: there's no entry fee so don't see how they profit from that. 1,300,000 visitors a year and you don't see how Poland and its citizens profit from Auschwitz? i don't know what to say.

AlligatorThreads: - Posts: 350 Joined: Dec 15, 10 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 23:25 #17
Smurf, you might not believe that, but Hollywood is not a source of historical information for everybody. Stauffenberg being a Nazi doesn't change a fact that Wilczy Szaniec is important historical site, that should be preserved.

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 19, 12, 23:27 #18
smurf: The only reason I could see for anyone to go there would be to dose the place in petrol and burn motherf€cker burn, Such a pity that you clearly do not even have any idea what Wolf's Lair is made of. Could you be any more ignorant?

♂

Jan 19, 12, 23:31 #19

FUZZYWICKETS:

1,300,000 visitors a year and you don't see how Poland and its citizens profit from Auschwitz? i don't know what to say.

yea, but in fairness not that many tourists who come here actually bother going there.
Latest estimates show that Poland had 13.1 million tourists last year, so (according to your figure) only 10% went to Oswiecim. Doesn't seem like Poland is dependant on it to make a few bob.
http://www.intur.com.pl/itenglish/statistics.htm

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Edited by: RoughFlavors Jan 19, 12, 23:36 #20
smurf: only 10% ?? of all the places they could see in Poland, 121 something thousand square miles, one in every ten goes to see the same tiny place? that's a pretty big chunk by any standard

♀ [Suspended]

Edited by: Bzibzioh Jan 19, 12, 23:39 #21

FUZZYWICKETS:

1,300,000 visitors a year and you don't see how Poland and its citizens profit from Auschwitz?

It's quite the opposite. Museum at Auschwitz is financed by the Polish state. And costs a lot to keep it open, so it's additionally sponsored by international foundations (from Germany and Israel mostly).

FUZZYWICKETS:

i don't know what to say.

Knowing what you are talking about would help. Try it sometimes.

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 23:44 #22
Bzibzioh: Museum at Auschwitz is financed by the Polish state. don't you think it would cost less if the government got out of the museum business?

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 19, 12, 23:44 #23
RoughFlavors: one in every ten goes to see the same tiny place? To be frank Auschwitz has become more like Disneyworld than a memorial. Just look at those watchtowers. But there are still camps where almost all of the original wire fences are intact....

♂

Jan 19, 12, 23:49 #24

RoughFlavors:

one in every ten goes to see the same tiny place

*facepalm

dude, there's no way that 1 out of every 10 tourists goes there.
How many of the 1.3m visitors that Fuzzy wrote about aren't tourists? Think of all the Polish school kids that go there every year as part of school trips, that'd take up quite a large portion of the number.
& have you even been there? It's not like there's a giftshop to buy tshirts ^_^
I remember one crappy restaurant that was more like a bar mleczny beside it. I remember going there coz I needed some stiff drinks after being in the place. Shock me up something bad so it did. Don't think I'll ever forget the place.

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 19, 12, 23:53 #25
smurf: I remember going there coz I needed some stiff drinks after being in the place. Shock me up something bad so it did. Don't think I'll ever forget the place. Would be a really really good idea if you stayed away from Belzec then. And Treblinka for that matter. And if you do ever go to Sobibor, don't wonder why the grass is so green in some places.

RoughFlavorsThreads: 1 Posts: 106 Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀	Jan 19, 12, 23:55 #26
i've only been there once, some 25 years ago. on a school trip. once is enough for me, though. what's the difference? a visitor is a visitor, whether it's Moshe from Haifa or Jasiu from SP#4 in Krapkowice. it's still one of the most popular sites.

smurfThreads: 46 Posts: 660 Joined: Sep 8, 09 ♂	Jan 19, 12, 23:59 #27
RoughFlavors: Krapkowice hahaha one of the funniest named places I've seen, I had to look that place up I thought you were taking the p#ss, seen a place in Bieszczady called Wankowa that really cracked me up too :)

BBmanThreads: - Posts: 459 Joined: Jan 4, 11 ♂	Jan 20, 12, 00:29 #28
smurf: You didn't see the German's turning Hitler's bunker into an attraction Actually the germans have turned hitler's former bunker (well, the site) into a tourist attraction as well as the former headquarters of many nazi institutions as every tourist company in berlin takes tourists to these areas! The Poles are simply getting in on this cash grab.

♀ [Suspended]

Jan 20, 12, 00:46 #29

RoughFlavors:

don't you think it would cost less if the government got out of the museum business?

It's a national museum. I don't think it would be a good idea to privatize this place as a money saving measures. It would be tragic.

Harry:

To be frank Auschwitz has become more like Disneyworld than a memorial.

The Auschwitz Museum is under international (read Jewish) supervision and it's simply impossible they would allow to turn it into Disney-anything any time soon. Again; it's actually very difficult to live in Oświęcim (town neighboring Auschwitz) today. Anything they want to build or open there (supermarket, restaurant, daycare) is under such a scrutiny that practically nothing is done. Simply because many proposed places were a sub-camp or graveyard, so it's no-go most of the times.

And stop with the frankness, Harry. It looks fake on you.

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 20, 12, 00:53 #30

Bzibzioh:

The Auschwitz Museum is under international (read Jewish) supervision

I've never seen any of the people from there that I have worked with at any of the Jewish events I've been to.

Bzibzioh:

Simply because many proposed places were a sub-camp or graveyard, so it's no-go most of the times.

How would Poles react to a supermarket being built at the site of Katyn?

Although I must doubt the accuracy of your statement: a couple of years ago a shopping mall was built on the site of the main sub-camp of Majdanek (by an Israeli company, tastefully enough).

Bzibzioh:

And stop with the frankness, Harry. It looks fake on you.

Personal comments are rarely helpful.

POLAND . The Unofficial Guide	Unanswered \| Archives
POLAND . The Unofficial Guide	Travel to Poland	Witamy, Guest \| PF Members \| Gold Members

Home \| Unanswered \| Archives \| Random \| Statistics	Time in Poland: 20:48 / May 26
About Us \| Contact Us \| Rules, Privacy \| Poland Advertising	© 2005-12 PolishForums.com

Is there anything Poland won't do for money? “Wolf’s Lair” - up for rent"