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Child with Polish ex, is 275 Euros a normal amount for child maintenance?


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amoebaThreads: 3
Posts: 14
Joined: Jun 3, 09
Gender: Male 		Edited by: Moderator   Jun 3, 09, 13:57   #1
Hi all - not sure if I am in the right forum here -

A couple years back I met a Plish girl here in Ireland, we began a relationship and seemed to be getting on fine. She got preganant and dissapeared back to Poland - told me that she was staying there and not coming back. I naturally felt hurt and angry and ceased communication with her. As soon as the baby was born she began looking for money, i refused to pay anything as i felt that I had been used and deceived into something. She then began legal proceedings - the court awarded here €200 per month plus €75 per month to pay off the back dated monies... also they awarded her 3,600 PLN lump sum for when the child was born, Im just wondering does this seem a large amount of maintenance for me to be paying? I earn approx 2,200 € after tax per month. Im married and have a mortgage, as you probably know - Ireland is not cheap place to live, and I am under the impression that Poland is quite a cheap place to live.
So do you think im getting a raw deal or is that quite a normal price to pay?

Appreciate feedback

Aa
McCoyThreads: 52
Posts: 1844
Joined: Jul 3, 08
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:03   #2
amoeba:
do you think im getting a raw deal or is that quite a normal price to pay?

its your fcuking blood man, you should be thinking about taking part in raising the kid, not about money you have to spend on him or her.
amoebaThreads: 3
Posts: 14
Joined: Jun 3, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:04   #3
Sorry i forgot to mention that she wants me to have no input in the childs life -

to be honest I dont either - that might seem cold - but so be it
McCoyThreads: 52
Posts: 1844
Joined: Jul 3, 08
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:14   #4
amoeba:
Sorry i forgot to mention that she wants me to have no input in the childs life

to be honest I dont either - that might seem cold - but so be it

why do you want this little man to pay for your and her mistakes? dont you want to see the love in his/her eyes, dont you want to hold him/her in your arms and feel this little heart beating. i dont fcuking get it. being a parent is one of the greatest things. its your life and youll do whatever you decide but if i could give you an advice it would be dont be a cvnt and dont give up.
IronsideThreads: 15
Posts: 1542
Joined: Feb 26, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:18   #5
amoeba:
So do you think im getting a raw deal or is that quite a normal price to pay?

200€ per month is not huge sum in Poland and considering your earnings and all a think you got a fair deal!
Have you been married while indulging yourself into that relationship?
amoebaThreads: 3
Posts: 14
Joined: Jun 3, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:22   #6
Ironside:
Have you been married while indulging yourself into that relationship?

if you mean was i cheating on my wife? then no - the Polish girl I was with (i found out afterwards was many times)
fred_chopin    Jun 3, 09, 14:23   #7
amoeba:
(i found out afterwards was many times)

Are you sure the kid is yours then? If the kid is your's for sure, Man Up and Pay Up.
KapustaThreads: 6
Posts: 124
Joined: Apr 29, 09
Gender: Female GOLD MEMBER 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:25   #8
fred_chopin:
Are you sure the kid is yours then? If the kid is your's for sure, Man Up and Pay Up.

Just what I was about to write. :)

If you're the Dad then you got to pay, but you should find out for sure. You don't want to spend the next 18 years paying for a child that's not yours.

amoeba:
I am under the impression that Poland is quite a cheap place to live.

Depends where in Poland you live.
amoebaThreads: 3
Posts: 14
Joined: Jun 3, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:27   #9
McCoy:
why do you want this little man to pay for your and her mistakes?

To be honest im dont fancy taking the odd trip over to poland to see a child who cant understand a word i say - its like this girl used me as a donor, its been a long and hard legal battle to get to where I am today (she initially tried to take me for €600 per month.)

Plus I am not the paternal type
theblueenigmaThreads: 7
Posts: 222
Joined: Aug 20, 08
Gender: Male 		Edited by: theblueenigma   Jun 3, 09, 14:30   #10
amoeba:
Im married and have a mortgage, as you probably know - Ireland is not cheap place to live, and I am under the impression that Poland is quite a cheap place to live.

From my understanding, In Ireland if you werent working you would have to give the child E200 a month or roughly 1/4 of your social welfare benefit. You earn over E2000 a month so a miserable E200 out of your salary (1/10th) to take care of a child you decided to bring into the world isnt a whole lot of money now is it. E200 a month wouldnt even pay the rent for a one bedroom appartment in Poland, and it is well below the minimum wage
here. Poland isnt as cheap as you may imagine.

If you are so concerned about money, perhaps you should consider staying away from the pub a couple of nights a month, that should recoup the E200 you are paying to support a life you decided to bring into the world.

Next time wear a condom

amoeba:
To be honest im dont fancy taking the odd trip over to poland to see a child who cant understand a word i say

Im guessing people on this forum are going to treat you in a very derogatory manner
amoebaThreads: 3
Posts: 14
Joined: Jun 3, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:50   #11
Well i dont drink - you sound the sterotypical bitter and twisted single mother type? Are you?

I came on here for some feedback - not moral tutoring
moonlightThreads: 7
Posts: 124
Joined: Nov 10, 08
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 14:54   #12
If the child was living with you, you would be paying A LOT more than a miserable €275.
aphrodisiacThreads: 5
Posts: 1158
Joined: Apr 15, 09
Gender: Male 		Edited by: aphrodisiac   Jun 3, 09, 14:56   #13
find out if you a the father and pay up.

If she thinks you are then you need to do it. If not, then you are off the hook.

I am not going to comment on the moral of that story though:)
ShelleySThreads: 20
Posts: 3742
Joined: Jun 26, 07
Gender: Female 		Edited by: ShelleyS   Jun 3, 09, 15:00   #14
Get a paternity test done, if she refuses then refuse to pay on those grounds.

Tests

Ive actually said before that if a woman gets pregnant in deceitful way then I dont feel a man should be held responsible for paying for the rest of his life. She left Ireland and didnt want anything to do with him, now she wants money but is still not offering him any contact with the child (good job he doesnt want it really)...Not only sperm donner but cash machine too...

moonlight:
If the child was living with you, you would be paying A LOT more than a miserable €275.

Thats nearly £300 quid at todays rate, my mate doesnt get that off her ex husband a month no where near!
SeanusThreads: 17
Posts: 17818
Joined: Dec 25, 07
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 15:00   #15
Over 1000PLN for child maintenance is a heck of a lot to be paying.
theblueenigmaThreads: 7
Posts: 222
Joined: Aug 20, 08
Gender: Male 		Edited by: theblueenigma   Jun 3, 09, 15:51   #16
amoeba:
if you mean was i cheating on my wife? then no - the Polish girl I was with (i found out afterwards was many times)

Well thats a different story. Then a paternity test is in order, I certainly wouldnt pay for a child that wasnt mine.

amoeba:
I came on here for some feedback - not moral tutoring

You have got feedback, I suspect anything moral would be lost on you.

amoeba:
Well i dont drink - you sound the sterotypical bitter and twisted single mother type? Are you?

Not at all, Im Irish and a male without children actually. Im just of the oppinion that if you make something its your responsibility. You were with her, you decided not to wear a condom . .perhaps you should have forseen the possibility of child maintenance then, rather than being a father

Considering you earn over 2000 a month, E200 for your child (wanted or not) seems reasonable, that is indeed if it is your kid

Seanus:
Over 1000PLN for child maintenance is a heck of a lot to be paying.

Not if he is earning over E2200 a month, its a fraction of his earnings. I assume the court of law took into consideration how much he earned before awarding maintenance. Im not a mother, but I suspect it is very difficult to survive on 899 PLN a month, which is what he is actually paying, the extra E75 being back dated and will cease once he has paid what he owed previously. Im pretty sure if the child was in Ireland and wanted to live with him he would end up paying a hell of a lot more.

amoeba:
Well i dont drink

Perhaps you should start
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		Edited by: PlasticPole   Jun 3, 09, 15:56   #17
amoeba:
Sorry i forgot to mention that she wants me to have no input in the childs life -

to be honest I dont either - that might seem cold - but so be it

Oh well. You made the baby you got to pay your part to take care of him or her. You can't expect to not pay child support. Just because your relationship soured doesn't mean the courts allow you to pretend like the entire relationship never happened.

Think of it this way and someone already mentioned it. If she and the baby were with you it would cost you A LOT more inconvenience in time and money. You would be doing much more and it would be much harder. You would be paying utilities, housing, food, clothing, everything! You would have to spend time away from your favorite passtimes to actually raise your kid.

You are getting off cheap.
ShelleySThreads: 20
Posts: 3742
Joined: Jun 26, 07
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:01   #18
theblueenigma:
Im pretty sure if the child was in Ireland and wanted to live with him he would end up paying a hell of a lot more.

Dont bet on it!

Again Igy this bloke didnt want a kid by the sound of it and she didnt want to be with him, let Poland take care of her, she's their problem! Surely she can claim some benefits or even go wild and get a job to support her and her child!

Had it been a long serious relationship that broke down I would view it differently, seems like it was a bit of fun and she left when it stopped being fun, but left with a bit of extra baggage!
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:04   #19
ShelleyS:
she's their problem!

No, the child is his and her responsibility and he has to pay child support like it or not. He is getting off cheap but he cannot get off scot free!
You can't just create the baby and say "it's not my problem".
SzwedwPolsceThreads: 7
Posts: 1396
Joined: Feb 21, 09
Gender: Male 		Edited by: SzwedwPolsce   Jun 3, 09, 16:23   #20
First make sure it's your child (DNA-testing). It would be stupid to pay 200 € x 12 months x 18 years = 43 000 € for a child that is not yours.


amoeba:
she wants me to have no input in the childs life

Seems like a heartless b*tch.
mvefa    Jun 3, 09, 16:23   #21
Well dude, you gotta step up, you decided not to use a condom, its not like she forced you or something. Morality aside, well i can say that you are getting off cheap. 275 its really nothing compared to what i have seen here in western Europe.

You had a child, you dont want him/her, but you still have a legal responsability over him/her, just deal with it. BUT just in case, ask for a paternity test, just in case.

Good luck
niejestemcapitaThreads: 3
Posts: 702
Joined: Jan 3, 09
Gender: Female 		Edited by: niejestemcapita   Jun 3, 09, 16:28   #22
mvefa:
You had a child,

yeh but did he? I really think he should make sure it's his first. Then pay the minimum if it's his. I bet she has one of those t shirts saying GOLDDIGGA, and a fake tan. Oh ok u agree, cool...:)
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:31   #23
SzwedwPolsce:
First make sure it's your child (DNA-testing). It would be stupid to pay 200 € x 12 months x 18 years = 43 000 € for a child that is not yours.

Well, yes, all this is assuming the child is really his. You establish paternity, then the courts make you pay your part. If she wasn't seeing anyone else at the time and you pretty much knew where she was all the time, most likely the baby belongs to you.
SzwedwPolsceThreads: 7
Posts: 1396
Joined: Feb 21, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:32   #24
PlasticPole:
If she wasn't seeing anyone else at the time and you pretty much knew where she was all the time, most likely the baby belongs to you.

How difficult is it to lie about that in court? I didn't see anyone else... bla bla.
theblueenigmaThreads: 7
Posts: 222
Joined: Aug 20, 08
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:34   #25
ShelleyS:
Again Igy this bloke didnt want a kid by the sound of it and she didnt want to be with him, let Poland take care of her, she's their problem! Surely she can claim some benefits or even go wild and get a job to support her and her child!

I can see understand your perspective Shelly, but he still made the decision not to throw a condom on himself and at some point thought 'F**k it, ill take a chance' He did point out he doesn’t drink alcohol so he made a conscious sober decision to be either lucky or dumb, now he is paying for it. People reading this thread are only going by what the OP is writing, and as we know there are two sides to every story ;) While I have no doubt she is claiming other benefits in Poland (not worth mentioning they are so small) it’s his problem, he made the baby, his choice, his responsibility. As a man he obviously isn’t responsible so the court steps in then to ensure someone takes responsibility. That said if the guy doesn’t want a child grand, but that extra baggage is still physically and legally half his. He pays a miserable E200 from E2, 200 a month; she has the real responsibility and carries that 'baggage' for the rest of her life. Just to point out its guys like this that are crippling welfare systems all over the world, and its us the tax payers that end up paying for his one night of pleasure in the end. His kid, he pays. . and if it was my sister he knocked up Id be making sure she was getting a lot more than a crappy E200 a month off him
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:36   #26
SzwedwPolsce:
How difficult is it to lie about that in court? I didn't see anyone else... bla bla.

That's why, in the states, it's standard to establish paternity before the courts decide anything. I would advise this dude to establish paternity and go from there. If it's established thru DNA testing it's his child, he has to pay child support. He can complain about it all he wants but he should have worn protection or something until he was for sure it was going to work out with this woman. It's too bad she went back to Poland and jilted him. If you don't want to be stuck in this situation do not have babies until you are sure about the relationship.

He can always try to visit the child in Poland if he wants to spend time with him or her. I am sure the courts would encourage contact with the biological father.
aphrodisiacThreads: 5
Posts: 1158
Joined: Apr 15, 09
Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:39   #27
theblueenigma:
I can see understand your perspective Shelly, but he still made the decision not to throw a condom on himself and at some point thought 'F**k it, ill take a chance' He did point out he doesn’t drink alcohol so he made a conscious sober decision to be either lucky or dumb, now he is paying for it. People reading this thread are only going by what the OP is writing, and as we know there are two sides to every story ;) While I have no doubt she is claiming other benefits in Poland (not worth mentioning they are so small) it’s his problem, he made the baby, his choice, his responsibility. As a man he obviously isn’t responsible so the court steps in then to ensure someone takes responsibility. That said if the guy doesn’t want a child grand, but that extra baggage is still physically and legally half his. He pays a miserable E200 from E2, 200 a month; she has the real responsibility and carries that 'baggage' for the rest of her life. Just to point out its guys like this that are crippling welfare systems all over the world, and its us the tax payers that end up paying for his one night of pleasure in the end. His kid, he pays. . and if it was my sister he knocked up Id be making sure she was getting a lot more than a crappy E200 a month off him

excellent point !!!!!!!! He sounds like a cheap bastard to me anyways. LOL
theblueenigmaThreads: 7
Posts: 222
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Gender: Male 		Edited by: theblueenigma   Jun 3, 09, 16:40   #28
PlasticPole:
He can always try to visit the child in Poland if he wants to spend time with him or her

He doesnt, he has already pointed out that the flight between Ireland and Poland is too far for him to travel to see a child who doesnt even understand him

aphrodisiac:
excellent point !!!!!!!! He sounds like a cheap bastard to me anyways. LOL


He does, and to be honest and without being 'moral' I reckon the child is far better off without someone like him as a father figure anyways
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
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Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 16:42   #29
theblueenigma:
He doesnt, he has already pointed out that the flight between Ireland and Poland is too far for him to travel to see a child who doesnt even understand him

The distance is an issue. They don't consider these things before the baby is concieved. These are the kinds of things everyone should think about before they decide to have children. However, just because she went back to Poland, for whatever reason, and we do not know what that reason is because she is not here to tell her side, is not an excuse for him not to pay child support.
sapphireThreads: 28
Posts: 1455
Joined: Dec 7, 06
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:26   #30
It might not be a popular opinion with others, but I disagree with her getting any money at all from you. I suppose if the courts are making you pay then there must be tests done to prove your paternity, if not then I wouldnt pay a thing. Since she doesnt want you to be a part of the baby's life then she shouldnt be asking you for money either.. she will most likely move on with a new husband or partner, so why shouldnt he pay? If you are forced to pay out because of the court order and cannot contest it, then at least think about your other rights too and try to maintain some contact with the child. You dont say how long the arrangement will be in place for, but I guess it would be reviewed periodically so you would have some right to challenge. I know that these laws are there to protect children and the women who raise them, but some people blatantly abuse them and in this case I am on the side of the guy.. and Im a woman!
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
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Gender: Female 		Edited by: PlasticPole   Jun 3, 09, 18:31   #31
sapphire:
so why shouldnt he pay?

Because it's not his kid. This guy should pay child support after a DNA test establishes paternity. In the US many share your attitude, Sapphire, which is why the welfare state exists.

If you think it's bad this guy should pay without establishing paternity first, why do you suggest someone else who isn't the bio dad pay too? Sounds a bit hypocritical.
sapphireThreads: 28
Posts: 1455
Joined: Dec 7, 06
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:38   #32
Thanks, I do understand the law, I just dont agree with it. Of course there are genuine cases and each should be assessed on its merits, but in my opinion someone who raises a child is more of a father than one who just provided the sperm and has never seen it (whether by choice or not). They werent married, it seems she was cheating on him and ditched him when she got pregnant.. therefore in my opinion he shouldnt be forced to pay! Do you think people dont live on welfare and claim child support at the same time? Wake up, some people take the **** and live a better life on benefits (including child support), they get housing etc.. and dont have to do a days work. I heard two schoolgirls on the bus the other day saying how they wanted to get pregnant as soon as possible so they could get a council house and benefits.. nothing about wanting to get married or raise a family. Scumbags.
Grzegorz_Threads: 65
Posts: 5540
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Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:40   #33
amoeba:
amoeba

You sound like a twat or even a pederast... You should pay at least twice as much as that pathetic €200 a month.
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:42   #34
Sapphire, why would you disagree with a law that requires the biological father to pay for his child. Would you rather your government pay because he doesn't want to, or someone else do what he's supposed to be doing? Why shouldn't he be expected to be the one doing the paying since he supplied the sperm?
sapphireThreads: 28
Posts: 1455
Joined: Dec 7, 06
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:44   #35
I dont disagree with the law per se, only in cases where the woman disowns the man and doesnt want him to see the child.. why should she then expect money from him.. and if she gets married or lives with someone else, why should they not pay for their child together as a family.. to me this seems more normal.
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:49   #36
But their relationship has nothing to do with it. It becomes what is right for the child. The child could spend time with both parents,they could share joint custody and no one would owe any support. It would be hard to do something like that because of distance. Somehow the guy has to be made to do something. It isn't about his relationship to the mother it's about the child's right to support and that's how the law views it.
Grzegorz_Threads: 65
Posts: 5540
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Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:53   #37
sapphire:
only in cases where the woman disowns the man and doesnt want him to see the child

If he wanted to see the child, every court would force her to let him do that but can you imagine that gay flying to Poland If he doesn't want to pay 200 EUR a month.
sadieannThreads: 4
Posts: 432
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Gender: Female 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:54   #38
Wow, I'm shocked that the comments are so biased towards this "Amoeba," (insightful name). Granted you didn't ask for moral advice only money? I think this determines the type of supposed man you are. There are two sides to every relationship. Obviously, it's apparent why she left. I think this is a moral issue within you. One needs to face the reality of their actions and turn it into a positive situation. An innocent child will live with the consequences of your heartless behavior. An intentional denial and lack of responsibility shows your true character. "The child won't even understand you?" It will be a natural bond. It's your blood. The child will feel the connection. Perhaps, re-evaluate your inner self. I have never heard a man so stone cold. Why your current wife isn't seeing who you truly are is a mystery. Oh, and most people on PF probably wish you wouldn't visit again. What a depressing situation. LOSER!
IronsideThreads: 15
Posts: 1542
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Gender: Male 		   Jun 3, 09, 18:59   #39
sapphire:
I dont disagree with the law per se, only in cases where the woman disowns the man and doesnt want him to see the child.. why should she then expect money from him.. and if she gets married or lives with someone else, why should they not pay for their child together as a family.. to me this seems more normal.

To get away from welfare state it would be wise to got back to normal and not pay for a child born out of wedlock at all!
PlasticPoleThreads: 2
Posts: 1816
Joined: May 28, 09
Gender: Female 		Edited by: Moderator   Jun 3, 09, 19:05   #40
Ironside:
not pay for a child born out of wedlock at all!

It doesn't matter if they are married or not. Once a child is born it exists and it is owed support from some source. Ideally it's the parents unless society lets them get away without paying.

Another option is giving the child up for adoption but it sounds like, in this case, the mother wants to keep him or her so it isn't practical.

For all:
The OP asked about the amount of money requested for child maintenance and nothing else.
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