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Commie? turned big moneyman, turned… moral crusader. Changing faces of William Browder.


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AdamKadmonThreads: 38
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Edited by: Moderator  Mar 26, 11, 18:47    #1
I would like to ask a favour: please do not shift the post to 'Off-Topic Lounge' and attach it to 'Random Chat Thread (deleted periodically)'. Thank you moderator.

COMMIE:

William Browder’s grandfather, Earl, was the head of the Communist Party USA from 1929 to 1945 and the Communist Party candidate for president in 1936 and in 1940. Earl Browder led the party through its many flipflops in the '30s as it went from ardently anti-Fascist to pacifist. As the leader of the American Communist Party he remained loyal to the foreign policy of the Soviet Union, as he argued that this was the best way to defeat fascism. However, this view took a terrible blow when in 1939, Joseph Stalin signed a military alliance with Adolf Hitler. Browder and other leaders of the party decided to support the Nazi-Soviet Pact.

b] [The Radical – an article in Forbes.com]

BIG MONEY MAN:

Browder started his investing during a business assignment in Poland, where state-owned factories and businesses could be had for a pittance. He exchanged $4,000 in traveler's checks for 38 million Polish zlotys and bought in. Within a year the $4,000 stake had turned into $40,000. “There’s a certain chemical that gets released in your stomach when you make ten times your money. And it’s addictive.” He was talking about how much fun it was to be in Poland during the so-called “shock therapy” period.
From Russia Expert, a Gloomy Outlook] [BBC News: Russia 'is now a criminal state', says Bill Browder]

[b]MORAL CRUSADER
:

Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty: How would you describe the list of 60 officials? Are they characteristic of the Russian authorities in general or a rogue gang?

Browder: The list was constructed because Russia has a crazy bureaucratic process in which everyone who does terrible things writes it down on a piece of paper. As a result of true torture done to Sergei, it was all documented so we were able to get the name of the judge who rejected Sergei's request for medical attention, the names of the investigators who put forward false evidence to get him incarcerated and the name of the prison doctor who denied him medical attention. We were able to put this whole list together based on the bureaucracy's own documentation.
.
[Interview: Browder Sees 'Tipping Point' In Western Attitudes To Russia].

As you can see, great men are of a changing nature, like the moon; just take the above example: commie turned to liberal free marketer, turned to Putin supporter, turned to Putin basher. How to keep up with such speed of change? What do you think... little men?

AdamKadmonThreads: 38
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Edited by: Moderator  Mar 26, 11, 20:20    #2
Without the fragments which have been cut out from my previoius post, the above text lacks cohesion.

Then it is up to you to quote more relevant parts of the text. Or allow members of the forum to use the link and then they can read the whole piece.

You seem to be testing the moderators. Please don't. Thank you.

SeanBMThreads: 41
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Edited by: SeanBM  Mar 26, 11, 20:26    #3
AdamKadmon:
As you can see, great men are of a changing nature, like the moon; just take the above example: commie

I don't see the commie part?
His grandfather was the commie.

Arnold Schwarzenegger's father was a member of the Nazi Party that doesn't make him a Nazi and here you are saying that a guy is a commie (even though he explicitly says he is NOT, in the quote you posted).

AdamKadmon:
BIG MONEY MAN:

He is a business man, so what?


AdamKadmon:
MORAL CRUSADER:

Doesn't sound like a ''moral crusader'' if you look at what he went through:
Although Browder was a supporter of Russian president Vladimir Putin, in 2006, after ten years doing business in the country, he was blacklisted by the Russian government as a "threat to national security" and denied entry to the country. The Economist has accused the Russian government of blacklisting Browder because he interfered with the flow of money to "corrupt bureaucrats and their businessmen accomplices".[3]

As reported by the New York Times in 2008,[2] over the next two years several of his associates and lawyers, as well as their relatives, became victims of crimes, including severe beatings and robberies during which documents were stolen. In June 2007 dozens of police officers raided the Moscow offices of Hermitage and its law firm, confiscating documents and computers. When a member of the firm protested that the search was illegal, he was beaten by officers and hospitalized for two weeks. Hermitage became victim of what is known in Russia as "corporate raiding": seizing companies and other assets with the aid of corrupt law enforcement officials and judges. Three Hermitage holdings companies were seized on what the company's lawyers insist are bogus charges.

Persecution by the Russian legal system (Wiki)
AdamKadmonThreads: 38
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Joined: Apr 23, 10
Edited by: AdamKadmon  Mar 26, 11, 20:37    #4
SeanBM:
I don't see the commie part? His grandfather was the commie.


What about the portrait of Lenin?

William Browder, being a great moneyman, did not give up entirely his family likings to communism. In his office in Moscow he used to have a large painting of Lenin above his desk; however later, it was taken down and stashed in a corner

Family likings for communism die hard, or was it just opportunism to have the painting? But basically, you are right, only in Poland you are commie if your great-great-great... grand father was commie, you can trace this genealogy to times even before Marx himself.

I like your argumentation, it stands somehow in opposition to what is the moral standard in today's Poland. Nevertheless, the man seems to be very opportunistic. Don't you think?
SeanBMThreads: 41
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Edited by: SeanBM  Mar 26, 11, 20:52    #5
AdamKadmon:
What about the portrait of Lenin?

What about it? When working in Russia as a capitalist.
For me actions speak more than a painting that he had while working in Russia.
I have a painting of Jesus on the wall, doesn't mean I am religious.

AdamKadmon:
was it just opportunism to have the painting?

Of course it was, what kind of commie bank rolls THAT money? :)

AdamKadmon:
it stands somehow in opposition to what is the moral standard in today's Poland.

I live in today's Poland.

I think journalists try to find an angle on who they are writing about, the journalist could have easily made Browder look like he brought down the reminisce of the Soviet Union with his capitalist success but he didn't.

AdamKadmon:
Nevertheless, the man seems to be very opportunistic. Don't you think?

Yes, opportunities are to be availed of and he has done well, he went on a limb sometimes and it paid off, fair play.
It is, in my opinion, the opposite of communist mentality.
AdamKadmonThreads: 38
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 Mar 26, 11, 21:16    #6
SeanBM:
Yes, opportunities are to be availed of and he has done well, he went on a limb sometimes and it paid off, fair play. It is, in my opinion, the opposite of communist mentality.


Now he is saying that money does not matter to him any more, he is craving for justice... not social justice yet, but soon maybe he will evolve. Don't you think that this may lead to socialism or even communism in his case? It would be a disaster :)
SeanBMThreads: 41
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Edited by: SeanBM  Mar 26, 11, 21:18    #7
AdamKadmon:
Now he is saying that money does not matter to him any more, ...Don't you think that this may lead to socialism or even communism in his case?


There is a very simple test, ask him to give all of his money to the government :)

Money only matters when you don't have it.

I think he is understandably angry at his treatment by the Russians.
AdamKadmonThreads: 38
Posts: 1,120
Joined: Apr 23, 10
Edited by: AdamKadmon  Mar 26, 11, 21:54    #8
SeanBM:
I think he is understandably angry at his treatment by the Russians.


He was mixed up in a conspiracy with Putin and his camarilla, not with other Russians. When in Rome, do as the Romans do, he should have known whom he was dealing with and be angry at Putin before he went to Russia. How he will find justice now?



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