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Failures of Tusk`s government


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pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  May 18, 11, 23:50    #1
Achievements of the Tusk's government.

The above link, started by a veteran poster, Grzegorz, allows you to get to know the achievements of Tusk`s government.

However, it is not all roses here in Poland. The living standards are much below the Western European level. It is true that many people benefited from the system change. Yet, still even more Poles remain completely lost and have not found out yet how to make ends meet.

How did Tusk and his team fail to fulfill hopes and expectations of people who voted them 4 years ago? Was it possible to do more during the global crisis?

The first thing that comes to my mind is health care. It seems really inefficient. An example which probably illustrates the situation the best is queues to specialists. People with emergency ailments have to wait 2- 3 months for a consultation. Patients diagnosed with potential cancer also wait.

d


We want to have our kids examined for shortsightedness, a visit to an opthalmologist is in June though was booked in March. It is no emergency so we can wait. If it was a serious case, I would have to go to private clinics.

A cartoon commentary by renowned Andrzej Mleczko.

Hallo? Guiness Record Book? I would like to report a record in health care category.
f


Health care in Poland is free if you work and are insured. It costs us about 9 % of our salaries.
GrzegorzK  May 18, 11, 23:58    #2
Polls are showing Tusk, the PO, and Komorowski popularity is dropping, and PiS and Jaroslaw Kaczynski favorability is rising. Also trust in government and politicans in dropping. Dissapproval ratings of Sejm and Senate for very high 70% for Sejm and over 50% for Senate
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 00:05    #3
GrzegorzK:
Polls are showing Tusk, the PO, and Komorowski popularity is dropping, and PiS and Jaroslaw Kaczynski favorability is rising.


The same phenomenon took place in the past, that is why no Polish government have remained in power longer than one term so far. Each elections created a new government.

GrzegorzK:
Also trust in government and politicans in dropping. Dissapproval ratings of Sejm and Senate for very high 70% for Sejm and over 50% for Senate


That is also nothing new. I remember such poll results in 1990s.
gumishuThreads: 17
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Joined: Apr 6, 09  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		Edited by: gumishu  May 19, 11, 09:01    #4
letting the ship-building industry down the drain in 2008

(Polish government was very much in a position to defend the shipbuilding industry it just did not intend to - as shown by the example of Mr Misiak then a PO senator who even went as far as to create a bill that favoured his own workforce agency - other examples are not widely known or spoken about but if you search you will find - but I don't believe you will pawian cause you prefer to live in a wonderland)
HarryThreads: 62
Posts: 8,508
Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended] 		 May 19, 11, 09:27    #5
GrzegorzK:
Polls

Could you perhaps link to these supposed polls? Or are they the kind which you make up on the spur of the moment?

gumishu:
letting the ship-building industry down the drain in 2008

If an industry can not stay afloat by itself, society has no obligation to pay for it.
gumishuThreads: 17
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Joined: Apr 6, 09  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		Edited by: gumishu  May 19, 11, 09:36    #6
Harry:
gumishu:
letting the ship-building industry down the drain in 2008

If an industry can not stay afloat by itself, society has no obligation to pay for it.


there was no need (and even no chance) to pay anything to the industry to keep it afloat in 2008 - only do defend it from the European Comission
HarryThreads: 62
Posts: 8,508
Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended] 		 May 19, 11, 09:43    #7
gumishu:
there was no need (and even no chance) to pay anything to the industry to keep it afloat in 2008 - only do defend it from the European Comission

You mean, not get our billions of Euros back.
gumishuThreads: 17
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Joined: Apr 6, 09  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 09:48    #8
at the very same time German and French admistration were pumping billions of euro into their shipbuilding industries - the European Commission didn't mind that - makes you wonder, nah?
HarryThreads: 62
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Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended] 		 May 19, 11, 10:02    #9
gumishu:
at the very same time German and French admistration were pumping billions of euro into their shipbuilding industries - the European Commission didn't mind that - makes you wonder, nah?

Not really, no: every nation cheats at the European game (except Britain but that's because the British don't understand how the game is played). What I object to is tens of billions of the taxpayers' zloty being spent on keeping a few thousand people employed in an inefficient industry.
delphiandomineThreads: 42
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Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended] 		 May 19, 11, 11:36    #10
pawian:
The first thing that comes to my mind is health care. It seems really inefficient.


It can be hit or miss really - I went last night to the all night doctor, no queue, and the doctor spoke English. So - from that side of things - no complaints here.

GrzegorzK:
Polls are showing Tusk, the PO, and Komorowski popularity is dropping, and PiS and Jaroslaw Kaczynski favorability is rising.


Polls are actually showing the opposite - PO are maintaining their low 40% ratings - which they've had for years now. In fact, it seems that the only thing affecting PO is the SLD - even when the polls have showed PO only getting high 30's - those votes have been transferred to the SLD, not PO - and are probably the result of young people. The same young people will more than likely vote PO simply to keep PiS out.

gumishu:
letting the ship-building industry down the drain in 2008


To be honest, after the years of dodgy subsidies to shipyards, it was about time that the plug was pulled anyway. Even before the European Commission got involved, they were only surviving because the Government let them. It's exactly the same situation with Ciegelski in Poznan - it should be allowed to die, but it won't die because of sentimental reasons rather than pragmatic reasons.

Anyway, as this thread is about failures - the big one is education. PO have spectacularly failed to reform the education sector properly - and the situation in 2011 is exactly the same as in 2007 - the sector is riddled with nepotism and dinosaurs who are more interested in their own pockets than anything else. The situation where directors/deans are elected, rather than being professionals trained for the job is one great example.
rozumiemnicThreads: 4
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Joined: Nov 16, 09 ♀ 		Edited by: rozumiemnic  May 19, 11, 11:52    #11
delphiandomine:
t can be hit or miss really - I went last night to the all night doctor, no queue, and the doctor spoke English

goodness, I would have thought that with your extensive knowledge of things, superior intellect, and seemingly very long time in Poland, you would have bothered to learn the language by now. *raises eyebrows*
delphiandomineThreads: 42
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Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended] 		 May 19, 11, 11:55    #12
rozumiemnic:
goodness, I would have thought that with your extensive knowledge of things, superior intellect, and seemingly very long time in Poland, you would have bothered to learn the language by now. *raises eyebrows*


Medical Polish? no way :o

I could probably get there, but with a fever and a sore throat, I didn't want to even speak English, let alone Polish!
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  May 19, 11, 13:21    #13
delphiandomine:
pawian: The first thing that comes to my mind is health care. It seems really inefficient.

It can be hit or miss really - I went last night to the all night doctor, no queue, and the doctor spoke English. So - from that side of things - no complaints here.



I didn`t mean the medical care at the basic level, like having a sore throat and temperature treated. Come on, delph, we are no Africa where a doctor is a rarity. After all, we are situated in Europe.

We also don`t have problems getting our kids to the family pediatrician or 24 hours doctor.

I talked about specialised care.
IronsideThreads: 59
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Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 14:12    #14
Its very existence is a failure for Poland. Sad, that such creatures are being supported by fools, bought in by propaganda.
PRL-bis is blossoming !
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  May 19, 11, 19:14    #15
Ironside:
Its very existence is a failure for Poland. Sad, that such creatures are being supported by fools, bought in by propaganda.


Fools are those who cannot accept the obvious fact that no other government would do better in such conditions. I hope you realise you are one of them? :):):)
IronsideThreads: 59
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Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 19:33    #16
pawian:
Fools are those who cannot accept the obvious fact that no other government would do better in such conditions. I hope you realise you are one of them? :):):)

What conditions ?
PO government is a continuation of PRL-bis, by now mature and fully grown. You can feel it, you can see it and you can hear it.
Problem is people who support them out of stupidity, do not even see that their stability is simply a continuation of sovietseque Poland with few changes.
Their parents or grandparents had been field-hands or unskilled laborers and all their learned about Poland and Polish culture was filtered by the commie propaganda. They simply have no clue what is Polish and what is not,they could trip over it and still wouldn't have recognize it.
Sure, there is ample amount of people supporting PO out of self interest, but I'm not talking about a rabble here.
Am I a fool?> Probably, but isn't true for the mankind?
grubasThreads: 20
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Joined: Feb 1, 10  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 19:35    #17
pawian:
Fools are those who cannot accept the obvious fact that no other government would do better in such conditions.

You must be one of those "young,educated and from a large city".
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  May 19, 11, 19:45    #18
grubas:
You must be one of those "young,educated and from a large city".


Exactly. Anything wrong with it? :):):)

Ironside:
What conditions ?
PO government is a continuation of PRL-bis, by now mature and fully grown. You can feel it, you can see it and you can hear it.
Problem is people who support them out of stupidity, do not even see that their stability is simply a continuation of sovietseque Poland with few changes.


Of course not. What do you know about socialist Poland? You are too young to remember.


Their parents or grandparents had been field-hands or unskilled laborers and all their learned about Poland and Polish culture was filtered by the commie propaganda. They simply have no clue what is Polish and what is not,they could trip over it and still wouldn't have recognize it.

Of course, you are an example of a guy who perfectly knows what Polish culture is. :):):)

I have read many of your chauvinistic posts and I can tell you as a Pole - if guys like you tried to introduce their "Polish culture" into this country, I would have to emigrate.

Simply speaking - God save Poland from possessed Kulturkampf activists!
IronsideThreads: 59
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Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 19:55    #19
pawian:
socialist Poland

I knew it !!!! You are a commie or ex-commie - whatever, one of those....
pawian:
Of course, you are an example of a guy who perfectly knows what Polish culture is. :):):)

If we are talking highPolish culture, then I'm your man !
pawian:
I have read many of your chauvinistic posts

Eh? What do you mean? I think you are being nasty for purpose, there is nothing chauvinistic in my posts.
pawian:
I would have to emigrate.

What would be the reason? Commie past ?
pawian:
possessed Kulturkampf activists!

Now I know that you are only kidding or you are one of these,
socialist

eh?
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 20:12    #20
Ironside:
I knew it !!!!



So, you have learnt sth at last! :):):)
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,158
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 May 19, 11, 23:35    #21
The main failure? Not to live up to all the slogans and pledges he bandied about in summer 2007. He has been the avoider of blunders and little more. Not lowering excise duty has been foolish.
SeanusThreads: 22
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Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 18:02    #22
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Rj2AtKwtuM, Farage talks about Greece and Tusk sits idly on, looking rather lost.
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 18:36    #23
Seanus:
Farage talks about Greece and Tusk sits idly on, looking rather lost.



This old man is Farage?
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,158
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 18:44    #24
Old man? He's not that old, pawian. He certainly exposed Tusk's disingenuous reference to Greece's problems as "trivial". Ignorance is a failure in my mind.
gumishuThreads: 17
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Joined: Apr 6, 09  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 19:04    #25
Seanus:
Old man? He's not that old, pawian. He certainly exposed Tusk's disingenuous reference to Greece's problems as "trivial". Ignorance is a failure in my mind.


you have linked a wrong clip Seanus (the one you linked is about some old Polish-born professor)
SeanusThreads: 22
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Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 19:08    #26
Aha, sorry. It's on Youtube in Polish and English language versions. Tusk is really taken to task.
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 19:56    #27
gumishu:
you have linked a wrong clip Seanus (the one you linked is about some old Polish-born professor)


Seanus:
Aha, sorry. It's on Youtube in Polish and English language versions. Tusk is really taken to task.


Nope.
Seanus, you mixed up threads. The youtube link you provided here refers to Jedwabne Massacre.

Did I already tell you that quantity doesn`t mean quality? :):):)
SeanusThreads: 22
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Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 19:57    #28
Did you? ;) ;) Anyway, you are a Tusk fan, pawian. Do you, like him, believe that Greece's problems are trivial? I wonder if Greeks would agree with him ;)
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 21:23    #29
Seanus:
I wonder if Greeks would agree with him ;)


Most Greeks are still relaxed. They have experienced bigger predicaments in their history. :):):)
SeanusThreads: 22
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Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 10, 11, 21:26    #30
Have you talked to "most Greeks", pawian?

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