Friedrich Nietzsche - Polish or German ?

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Jun 6, 10, 19:33 #61

Thread attached on merging:
What influence on Polish culture have had F. Nietzsche?

"Chistian mentality of a slave", "anemic interests in history" and "life" on the other side.
He also said that the development of a strong people must not to be stunted by the weak people.
"Chistianity" and "philosophic tradition" turned from real world to "heaven" and the world of ideas. But a "real' world is a world of delusion.

What do you think about Nietzsche's ideas?
Are they important for history or philosophy?
I will rather not ask about influence on historiosophy...

Do you have any ideas or comments?

And please, I am just a girl ;), so no s***** words please
:)

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Edited by: milky Jun 6, 10, 21:10 #62

I think Nietzche had a strong inbuilt bullsh1t detector..I like his view on the slave mentality and i also like the way it was developed by Thomas szasz.I heard a lecturer from the states say that he lectured in Harvard in the sixties when Nietzche was addded to the curriculum and a lot of students had nervous breakdown when they read him.. He claimed that this type of depressed hysteria did not happen in Europe, but in America It was too much for their timid minds of american optimism. The effects Nietzche had on Poland? i have no idea, France for sure, i dont think the Polish pope would have like him so....

newageThreads: - Posts: 2 Joined: Jan 22, 12 ♂	Jan 22, 12, 10:09 #63
I would rather consider Shopenhauer as being polish, because He lived in polish city Gdansk for all his life

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 22, 12, 11:38 #64
^ Back in his day, it was a German city called Danzig.

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Jan 22, 12, 15:12 #65

newage:

I would rather consider Shopenhauer as being polish, because He lived in polish city Gdansk for all his life

Schopenhauer ws born there, and lived there as a youth, but his father movd the family to Hamburg when he saw that the city was going over into Prussian hands, because he knew that the Prussians would tax and constrain his business far more than the Poles had and he didn't want the hassle.

JonnyMThreads: 16 Posts: 4,487 Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂	Jan 22, 12, 15:21 #66
newage: I would rather consider Shopenhauer as being polish, because He lived in polish city Gdansk for all his life He didn't identify as Polish. Less even than Kafka saw himself as Czech. noreenb: F. Nietzsche He had some Polish roots and wrote about that, but saw himself as German.

Des EssientesThreads: 11 Posts: 2,318 Joined: Feb 6, 10 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 22, 12, 15:26 #67
JonnyM: He had some Polish roots and wrote about that, but saw himself as German. He saw himself as both Polish and German but he felt that the Polish part of his being was the most important.

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Edited by: JonnyM Jan 22, 12, 15:29 #68

Des Essientes:

He saw himself as both Polish and German but he felt that the Polish part of his being was the most important.

Read some or ask someone to explain it to you - he had high opinions of Slavs, Jews and Chinese people and identified with certain ideals. But he was German. If I remember, we had this discussion before, sources and all.

Of course, anything Nietsche said has to be weighed against his mental illnesses and the fantasies they brought forth...

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Jan 22, 12, 15:39 #69

JonnyM:

Read some or ask someone to explain it to you - he had high opinions of Slavs, Jews and Chinese people and identified with certain ideals. But he was German. If I remember, we had this discussion before, sources and all.

You should read his autoiography and realize that you are wrong. Nietzsche disdained most Germans as boring clodhoppers and claimed that what nobility Germans do have is the result of them having Slavic blood. He considered his own brilliance to be the result of him being the atavistic reoccurance of a Polish nobleman. He and his father were very proud of their family's suppossed roots in the Polish nobility. So much so that the latter had their family classified as "non-German" with the Prussian authorities.
Nietzsche is a great counter-example to all the Western-European crud we read on this forum that denigrates Poles. Nietzsche knew better.

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Jan 22, 12, 15:47 #70

Des Essientes:

You should read his autoiography

I have. Several times.

Des Essientes:

you are wrong.

No. For the following reasons, among many:

Des Essientes:

most Germans as boring clodhoppers

i.e himself, and most people around him.

Des Essientes:

He considered his own brilliance to be the result of him being the atavistic reoccurance of a Polish nobleman

His abstracted fantasies - a kind of displacement not uncommon among self-haters.

Des Essientes:

So much so that the latter had their family classified as "non-German" with the Prussian authorities.

During a period of documented mental illness.

Nietsche was one of those people who are deeply unhappy with who they are, who fail to engage with those around them, who just don't fit in and psychologically compensate for that in two ways - by pretending to themselves that they are somehow superior to those around them and by seizing on something like their ancestry from generations ago with which they don't have any contact except by DNA. Know anyone like that?

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Jan 22, 12, 15:56 #71

JonnyM:

Nietsche was one of those people who are deeply unhappy with who they are, who fail to engage with those around them, who just don't fit in and psychologically compensate for that in two ways - by pretending to themselves that they are somehow superior to those around them and by seizing on something like their ancestry from generations ago with which they don't have any contact except by DNA. Know anyone like that?

Nietzsche was supremely happy with who he was- one of the most brilliant minds to ever grace this Earth. He was superior to those around him. As for your lame attempt to provoke me it just shows, like so many other of your posts, that it is you who are insecure and thus you lash out at others in a sad attempt to feel better about yourself.

JonnyMThreads: 16 Posts: 4,487 Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂	Edited by: JonnyM Jan 22, 12, 16:17 #72
Amusing, but quite untrue. Nietsche was intelligent, but intelligence is only brilliant if one achieves something more than intellectual onanism. Nietsche didn't. For all his eclat, there's an absence of elan, and the pain of a troubled (and mentally ill) mind.

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 22, 12, 16:44 #73
^ He is fundamentally unsound.

modafinilThreads: - Posts: 831 Joined: Jun 28, 11 ♂	Jan 22, 12, 18:37 #74
JonnyM: intellectual onanism That's the problem with becoming a Superman. Once you find yourself surrounded by apes, one may just as well whisper into the ears of horses.

chichimeraThreads: 3 Posts: 356 Joined: Feb 4, 11 ♀	Jan 22, 12, 22:14 #75
McCoy: And yet my ancestors were Polish noblemen: it is owing to them that I have so much race instinct in my blood-who knows? perhaps even the liberum veto. :) That is one of my favourite quotes of all times, it's a definition of being Polish to me - that "liberum veto" boiling in your blood - with all the beautiful and all the ugly connotations of it

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