Holocaust was a Jewish invention, says top Polish bishop

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Edited by: jonni Feb 7, 10, 14:43 #121
1jola: I'd like to know what you would like to do to this rabbi? There's a difference. Christianity preaches love thy neighbour, humility, forgiveness and peace. Regardless of whether or not it's reciprocated. I don't see much coming from the Archbishop.

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Feb 7, 10, 15:31 #122

jonni:

There's a difference. Christianity preaches love thy neighbour, humility, forgiveness and peace. Regardless of whether or not it's reciprocated.

Are you implying Judaism is about hate so the rabbi's statements are resonable and expected?

This is just for your amusement only:

jonni:

I don't see much coming from the Archbishop.

According to Harry he is the top bishop and you promoted him even higher. Both of you have no idea who this excellent priest and professor is. In your bloodshot eyes you just see holocaust denier. Simpletons.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Feb 7, 10, 15:40 #123
1jola: Judaism is about hate It is different. It isn't Christianity. Religions can't be judged by the standards of other religions. 1jola: Both of you have no idea who this excellent priest and professor is. I have been reading his nutty pronouncements for years. Priest - certainly. Scholar - to a point. Excellent? Hardly.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Feb 7, 10, 15:58 #124
jonni: It is different. It isn't Christianity. jonni: Christianity preaches love thy neighbour, humility, forgiveness and peace. What does Judaism preach then? jonni: I have been reading his nutty pronouncements for years. Quote a few and will see if they are nutty. So far, I see nothing nutty, unless you think that the Holocaust isn't a multi-million dollar business.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Edited by: jonni Feb 7, 10, 16:08 #125
1jola: What does Judaism preach then? It doesn't preach. 1jola: unless you think that the Holocaust isn't a multi-million dollar business. Of course it isn't. It's about an attempt to destroy an entire nationality, and that nationality's determination that that will never be either forgotten or repeated. Unless you think otherwise...

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Feb 7, 10, 16:28 #126

jonni:

It doesn't preach.

But it does, but I understand that you don't want to talk about it.

jonni:

Unless you think otherwise...

Of course I think otherwise. Holocaust rememberance is very necessary for Jews. I understand that and see nothing unusual in it, but sometime in the the late seventies in became a huge, profitable industry shoved down everybody's throat at the exclusion of similar or greater tragedies. It is mainly run by shameless American Jews who have little interest in sharing the profits with the real survivors. The bishop's critique is correct as was Finkelstein's, and look what they did to him. Chomsky warned him that his book would mark the end of his carrer as a scholar.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Feb 7, 10, 16:40 #127
1jola: But it does, Not to others. 1jola: I understand that you don't want to talk about it. What's this supposed to mean? 1jola: The bishop's critique is Why did he, as a bishop, feel the need to say it?

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Feb 7, 10, 17:33 #128

1jola,
You are comparing the statements of an archbishop, who by definition represents at least part of the catholic world, with the statements of an unknown bearded guy who calls himslef a rabbi, who holds no position in the jewish world. His only credentials are that he figured out how to use his video camera. You're as much of a rabbi as he is. So if you want to counter the criticism of the archbishop by quoting a "jewish leader" you've done a weak job of it. If all you wanted to do was entertain us by showing a ridiculous Jew, then why not just dig up some old antisemitic caricatures. That should be entertaining.

ZIMMYThreads: 10 Posts: 2,353 Joined: Feb 21, 09 ♂	Feb 7, 10, 17:34 #129
Are you sure Rabbi Friedman isn't in the Taliban? What incredible hate.

z_dariusThreads: 22 Posts: 5,091 Joined: Oct 18, 07 ♂	Feb 7, 10, 18:17 #130
yehudi: You are comparing the statements of an archbishop Pieronek is not an archbishop. yehudi: the statements of an unknown bearded guy who calls himslef a rabbi, who holds no position in the jewish world. How about this rabbit who does hold quite a position in the Jewish world?

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Feb 8, 10, 09:03 #131

yehudi:

You are comparing the statements of an archbishop, who by definition represents at least part of the catholic world, with the statements of an unknown bearded guy who calls himslef a rabbi, who holds no position in the jewish world.

I also referred to a prominent Israeli rabbi earlier in the thread whose hateful statements seem to go down smoothly in the press.

Regarding Friedman, he is a rabbi, he was Kahane's buddy, and he broadcasts on public access TV in New York. I know nothing of the process of becoming a rabbi, but whoever certified him must also have the power to withdraw that priviledge.

http://www.angelfire.com/ny2/abor/

yehudi:

So if you want to counter the criticism of the archbishop by quoting a "jewish leader" you've done a weak job of it.

Perhaps. I see a larger issue at play though. Jewish leaders are constantly meddling in the internal affairs of the RCC, dictating who should not be cannonized, which archives we must open, what prayers we should not say, etc. If you notice, the RCC does not return the favor. The clear weakness of our faith is the turn the other cheek part.

A personal question: What does the exclamation Ummay mean?

yehudi:

That should be entertaining.

Thanks, but I'll pass on that.

A final note on the bishop. He is a loud critic of o.Rydzyk and his rants on Radio Maryja often taking on anti-Semitic tones, so this is a non-story worthy of the ADL idiots.

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Edited by: joepilsudski Feb 9, 10, 05:58 #132

Oh boy, we still at it: 'Zhidinski Rozmowa'!

The bishop was absolutely correct, he had the right to speak his mind, and I am proud that a Polish clergyman did not stoop to kiss the Jews ass, like Ratzinger.

You Jewish and don't like it?...Switch the station...We have to listen to your stations 365/24/7.

Now if I was a rich man ('yega dega, dega, dega...') I would start a satellite based network called 'Slavic World' and some of the features would be 'Exposing the Holodomor', 'We Host Them for 1000 Years, Yet They Spit in Our Face', plus, for Ukies, the 'Boghdan Chmielnicki Hour'...Also, a special expose: 'Organ Harvesting Exposed'.

There would be an especially strong signal beamed to the Middle East.

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Edited by: joepilsudski Feb 9, 10, 06:14 #133

If I were a rich man,
Ya ha deedle deedle, bubba bubba deedle deedle dum.
All day long I'd biddy biddy bum.
If I were a wealthy man.
I wouldn't have to work hard.
Ya ha deedle deedle, bubba bubba deedle deedle dum.
If I were a biddy biddy rich,
Yidle-diddle-didle-didle man.

I see my wife, my Golde, looking like a rich man's wife
With a proper double-chin.
Supervising meals to her heart's delight.
I see her putting on airs and strutting like a peacock.
Oy, what a happy mood she's in.
Screaming at the servants, day and night.

The most important men in town would come to fawn on me!
They would ask me to advise them,
Like a Solomon the Wise.
"If you please, Reb Tevye..."
"Pardon me, Reb Tevye..."
Posing problems that would cross a rabbi's eyes!

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 06:26 #134
joepilsudski Keep taking the thorazine, Joe.

FrankThreads: 27 Posts: 1,342 Joined: Aug 14, 06 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 11:12 #135
Yeah......anti-semitism is alive and well......always will be, BUT all it does is show up Catholicsm as being only interested in power and control of the earth populations, appealing to the most debase views and theories, not really worthy of the title of being a religion. PS And those who keep repeating these anti-humanity, insane and debased pronouncements aint much better.

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Feb 9, 10, 11:42 #136

1jola:

According to Harry he is the top bishop

No, www.thenews.pl are the ones who called him "top Polish bishop" (note that they don't use the definite article). But thanks for letting us know that you're ready to give up on this one: when you starting lying about who said what or what was said by who, it normally means you know you've lost. Here you're lying about what I said AND lying about what the person whose words I quoted actually said, so you must be sure it's all over!

Ghowrow	Feb 9, 10, 12:13 #137
many people ask themselves if it was really 6 milllion jews or 600 jews killed all together in Auschwitz. Afterall, what was called the "gasing chamber" was small and had very large windows. How can the gas cyanide stay inside a small room with HUGE windows? ;)

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 12:59 #138
Are you a Paisley fan, Frank? ;) Paisley, rightly or wrongly, really has issues with the Catholic church. Strong issues! On the thread, my belief is clear. That a Holocaust took place but the numbers were exaggerated, just like the number of rapes in Bosnia by Serbs or other such things were distorted.

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Feb 9, 10, 13:43 #139

Seanus:

Are you a Paisley fan, Frank? ;)

Paisley, rightly or wrongly, really has issues with the Catholic church. Strong issues!

On the thread, my belief is clear. That a Holocaust took place but the numbers were exaggerated, just like the number of rapes in Bosnia by Serbs or other such things were distorted.

Fraid not Seanus......just seen the light so to speak........:)

Far too many deniers on this board, people who cast dispersions on the suffering and genocide of a whole race/religion.

Its not a belief thats important....but that the fact it happened, arguing over exact numbers.................is again being a denier........

Just MVHO.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 13:48 #140
Well, not at all. Discussing numbers is discussing evidence and not merely spouting damaging propaganda. I don't wish to be exact, just to question conventional wisdom. Some consideration for all the others that perished would be nice. Serbs, for example, were victimised during WWII.

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Feb 9, 10, 13:52 #141

z_darius:

How about this rabbit who does hold quite a position in the Jewish world?

This "rabbit" had to resign his position as Prime Minister because of corruption charges, so, no, he doesn't have any position in the Jewish world. As far as the report you posted, it's obviously an arab propaganda report and full of half-truths and distortions. If i had to counter every bit of arab propaganda on the internet I would have to work at it 24 hours a day, and even then I wouldn't convince people who want to believe them.

1jola:

I know nothing of the process of becoming a rabbi, but whoever certified him must also have the power to withdraw that priviledge.

The so-called "American Board of Rabbis" is apparently a one-man operation by this same clown. There is no American Board of Rabbis. In fact there is no one centralized religious organization in Judaism parallel to the catholic church. There are many groups of rabbis and yeshivot and they can give rabbinical ordination to whoever they want. The legitimate ones can be recognized by those who care. This Friedman is just one guy with a computer.

1jola:

A personal question: What does the exclamation Ummay mean?

I never heard that expression. Where did you hear it?

1jola:

Jewish leaders are constantly meddling in the internal affairs of the RCC

You can pray however you want and canonize whoever you want. But if the catholic church is interested in good relations with Jews, then we have a right to say that a certain action of the church will hurt those relations. How the church reacts to that information is its own business.

1jola:

The clear weakness of our faith is the turn the other cheek part.

While you were turning your cheeks, you spent a lot of centuries smacking ours.

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Feb 9, 10, 14:30 #142

Seanus:

Well, not at all. Discussing numbers is discussing evidence and not merely spouting damaging propaganda. I don't wish to be exact, just to question conventional wisdom.

Some consideration for all the others that perished would be nice. Serbs, for example, were victimised during WWII.

Yes Seanus, but this is a thread about what a catholic Bishop said about the Jews......we could make a case for nearly every/race/nation on earth at some point!

Millions of Jews did perish in the most inhumane way imaginable......at the hands of one nation. Anyone who cast doubts or dispersions, is in a roundabout way, justifying those heinous crimes.

Just how I feel seanus.

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Feb 9, 10, 14:40 #143

Doubts are normal given the widely differing accounts from historians and witnesses. In fact, given that we and so many others weren't there or didn't even live in that epoch, doubts are the best we can hope for rather than erroneously reaching a position formed incorrectly.

It's not justifying at all, Frank. I cannot condone, as any rational person can't, the singling out of a whole race. There is no justification for that but I can still discuss the figures.

Let the bishop speak and for him to be dealt with as the relevant authority sees fit upon fair reflection of their principles.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 20:11 #144
Harry: No, www.thenews.pl are the ones who called him "top Polish bishop" Please, Harry, the news pl is a joke of a news source. Do take care a bit, sir.

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Feb 9, 10, 20:40 #145
^Polskie Radio, a complete joke, eh?

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Feb 9, 10, 21:15 #146

yehudi:

While you were turning your cheeks, you spent a lot of centuries smacking ours.

My great grandfather stopped selling his farm products to Jews in the shetetl because he overheard them calling him "cattle". A letter of his also states that he was bothered that these same Jews didn't want to assimilate. This was prewar.

These same Jews who my great grandfather refused service probably considered him antisemitic without giving thought to their own actions.

ArienThreads: 6 Posts: 1,604 Joined: Oct 20, 08 ♂	Feb 9, 10, 21:21 #147
Harry: Holocaust was a Jewish invention, says top Polish bishop Well, you shouldn't believe everything a Bishop says, says Arien. Oh, and you shouldn't believe every news article either.. ;)

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Feb 9, 10, 22:59 #148

Prickiewicz:

These same Jews who my great grandfather refused service probably considered him antisemitic without giving thought to their own actions.

Let's see: he treated all members of a race in a certain way solely because of their race (with the 'justification' that two members of the race once did something). That makes him a racist. The people he discriminated against were Jews, so that makes him anti-semitic.

Or do you mean that I should automatically treat all Poles as racist morons solely because some Poles are racist morons?

Mr GrunwaldThreads: 34 Posts: 2,358 Joined: Dec 16, 08 ♂	Feb 10, 10, 14:50 #149
Bratwurst Boy: My parents of blessed memory who suffered in Concentration cams and who lived in Poland would tell me the Poles were as bad as the German Nazis. Such statements will come into truth one day if it continues...

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Feb 10, 10, 14:58 #150
Although you cannot attack innocent people, the motive was clear. That's why we need to be very clear in toning down all the nonsense and harsh rhetoric spewed out by certain leaders. BB's parents didn't deserve that treatment but people hit out in rage, it's just the way it is.

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