Janusz Korwin-Mikke about Polish-Jewish dialog :)

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Edited by: RobertLee Jul 11, 11, 21:46 #1

To those who don't know him:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janusz_Korwin-Mikke
Here is what he said recently about "Polish-Jewish dialog":
http://korwin-mikke.pl/blog/wpis/akcja_morze_dzis_i_cos_o_dialogu_pols kozydowskim/991

I'm all against "Polish-Jewish dialog", as well as any other "dialogs", that take place not between ordinary people but between "groups", who happen to be represented by usurpers.
Why?
I'm absolutely certain that if we started a "dialog" between blondes and dark-haired today, and those groups could win any kind of subsides or even symbolic privileges - then in 5 years time we would see those groups fighting each other on the streets! Why? Because "dialoging" representatives would have an interest to exaggerate the differences - and the suffering inflicted by one group on another. They would have an interest to generate hostility between those two groups - because that would be their source of income!
That's why the state cannot allow one group officially "dialoging" with other group. As long as they keep it private - it's OK.

His party will participate in the coming elections.

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Jul 11, 11, 21:57 #2

RobertLee:

As long as they keep it private - it's OK.

Not a bad idea.
Polish Forums should become partners with some Israeli forum. At least people would get it all out into each other faces. Catharsis could be first step to peace and understanding.

But seriously, I don't think people ponder too much on the Polish Jewish issues in private. My best friend is Jewish. My husband is German. Every single year we sit down to Wigilia. Don't you think most regular people are over those old animosities?

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Jul 11, 11, 21:58 #3

RobertLee:

His party will participate in the coming elections.

And get about 1-2% of the vote - which shows that what Korwin-Mikke says is largely an irrelevance in Poland today. In fact, Korwin-Mikke was never really a factor - an amusement, yes, but not someone that anyone agreed with.

However, it's no surprise that you're promoting the views of a monarchist, who believes in the traditional role of a woman (stay home, shut up and make dinner), alongside other such concepts.

Des EssientesThreads: 11 Posts: 2,318 Joined: Feb 6, 10 ♂ [Suspended]	Jul 11, 11, 22:01 #4
Marynka11: Polish Forums should become partners with some Israeli forum. That would be good so that the enlightened members of this forum cold tell the Israelis to grant citizenship and equal rights to the Palestinians whose lands they occupy and blockade and whose resources they exploit.

skysoulmateThreads: 41 Posts: 3,039 Joined: Jan 10, 10 ♂	Edited by: skysoulmate Jul 11, 11, 22:07 #5
Des Essientes: ... tell the Israelis to grant citizenship and equal rights to the Palestinians whose lands they occupy and blockade and whose resources they exploit. Fair enough, if those said "Palestinians", whatever that term really means, return the land their ancestors stole from the Jewish people. Is that fair enough to you?

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Jul 11, 11, 22:09 #6
skysoulmate: Fair enough, if those said "Palestinians", whatever that term really means, return the land their ancestors stole from the Jewish people. Fair enough? Don't be silly - that would involve history being represented accurately, and we can't have that!

skysoulmateThreads: 41 Posts: 3,039 Joined: Jan 10, 10 ♂	Jul 11, 11, 22:12 #7
delphiandomine: Don't be silly - that would involve history being represented accurately, and we can't have that! Well, point being that no one is totally innocent in the middle east. The ancestors of the people who are demanding a nationhood, citizenship, rights, etc., denied those very same rights to the people they expelled hundreds of years ago.

pawianThreads: 90 Posts: 5,397 Joined: May 30, 08 ♂	Jul 11, 11, 22:21 #8
I don`t treat Mikke seriously. Not that he is a clown or something. But he doesn`t sound serious - he speaks in a very agitated manner which is disgusting. Like a maniac.

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Edited by: delphiandomine Jul 11, 11, 22:25 #9

skysoulmate:

Well, point being that no one is totally innocent in the middle east. The ancestors of the people who are demanding a nationhood, citizenship, rights, etc., denied those very same rights to the people they expelled hundreds of years ago.

That's why Poland should keep out of it and instead concentrate on building bridges with everyone.

(must admit - my attitude towards Israel is that they should be allowed to finish the security barrier properly - it would seem essential for a two-state solution. All this nonsense about "Palestinian" land expired the moment that they attacked Israel.)

Des EssientesThreads: 11 Posts: 2,318 Joined: Feb 6, 10 ♂ [Suspended]	Jul 11, 11, 22:36 #10
skysoulmate: Fair enough, if those said "Palestinians", whatever that term really means, return the land their ancestors stole from the Jewish people. Is that fair enough to you? The Palestinian's ancestors stole no land from the Jewish people, but rather lived in harmony with them. European Jews came to Palestine and stole Palestinian land.

David_18Threads: 111 Posts: 1,212 Joined: Jan 4, 07 ♂	Jul 11, 11, 22:40 #11
delphiandomine: (must admit - my attitude towards Israel is that they should be allowed to finish the security barrier properly - it would seem essential for a two-state solution. All this nonsense about "Palestinian" land expired the moment that they attacked Israel.) Should this also have been allowed?

David_18Threads: 111 Posts: 1,212 Joined: Jan 4, 07 ♂	Jul 11, 11, 22:49 #12
delphiandomine: If you knew anything about Israel, you'd know that they depend on Palestinian labour. If you knew anything about the Third Reich then you'd know that they depended on Jewish labour. delphiandomine: Then again - if you want to complain about this, why aren't you complaining about the US border fence? Since this thread is not about the US border fence?

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Jul 11, 11, 23:18 #13

Des Essientes:

The Palestinian's ancestors stole no land from the Jewish people, but rather lived in harmony with them. European Jews came to Palestine and stole Palestinian land.

Not true, European Jews took back what was stolen from them. Palestinians, no such term really but rather Arabs lived in harmony with the Jews IF the Jews were willing to convert. They were second class citizens and most were expelled or chose to leave to avoid the Arab/Muslim oppression.

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Edited by: legend Jul 11, 11, 23:21 #14

delphiandomine:

Remind us - when was the last time Israel forcibly used Palestinians as slaves? What about the last time that they were executed in concentration camps?

Israel issues Goy on a worldwide scale. In America, Europe, and elsewhere.

skysoulmate:

Not true, European Jews took back what was stolen from them. Palestinians, no such term really but rather Arabs lived in harmony with the Jews IF the Jews were willing to convert. They were second class citizens and most were expelled or chose to leave to avoid the Arab/Muslim oppression.

Jews came to Israel from Sumeria. They came to a place that was already inhabited by others. Try again.

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Jul 11, 11, 23:28 #15

skysoulmate:

Palestinians, no such term really but rather Arabs lived in harmony with the Jews IF the Jews were willing to convert.

This is a lie. Jews as "People of the Book" enjoyed protected status under Islamic governments. Jews were never forceably expelled from Palestine, and they were already an extremely cosmopolitan people, living throughout the world, when their Second Temple was destroyed by the Romans following Judea's failed rebellion. The myth of Jewish expulsion is perpetuated to justify the very real ethnic cleansing perpetrated by the Zionist movement in modern Palestine.

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Edited by: skysoulmate Jul 11, 11, 23:39 #16

Des Essientes:

This is a lie. Jews as "People of the Book" enjoyed protected status under Islamic governments. Jews were never forceably expelled from Palestine, and they were already an extremely cosmopolitan people, living throughout the world, when their Second Temple was destroyed by the Romans following Judea's failed rebellion. The myth of Jewish expulsion is perpetuated to justify the very real ethnic cleansing perpetrated by the Zionist movement in modern Palestine.

Well, likewise the "Palestinian" expulsion myth is perpetuated by Arabic islamist and leftist movements.

legend:

Jews came to Israel from Sumeria. They came to a place that was already inhabited by others. Try again.

so Jews expelled Sumerians, Arabs expelled Jews, Jews expelled Arabs, who's next?

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Jul 11, 11, 23:51 #17

skysoulmate:

Well, likewise the "Palestinian" expulsion myth is perpetuated by Arabic islamist and leftist movements.

It is not a myth but a very well documented historical event which occurred in the late 1940's and created the largest group of refugees in the world. These people have the right to return and rebuild their villages and towns, but the racist government of Israel denys them this right.

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Jul 12, 11, 00:11 #18

David_18:

If you knew anything about the Third Reich then you'd know that they depended on Jewish labour.

There were more Russians and Poles as forced labourers than Jews. One of my great grandfathers (not the one in AK lol) was sent to a labour camp on the German Belgian border. Poles and Russians taken for labour were mill, factory workers, farmers people who worked had all their lives who had the strength and skill to work. I think they were more productive then some Jewish banker, lawyer, physician etc.

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Edited by: skysoulmate Jul 12, 11, 00:15 #19

Des Essientes:

It is not a myth but a very well documented historical event which occurred in the late 1940's and created the largest group of refugees in the world. These people have the right to return and rebuild their villages and towns, but the racist government of Israel denys them this right.

The UN divided Palestine into a Jewish Palestine and an Arab Palestine. The Arabs attacked the new Israeli state but lost. The Arabs were allowed to stay as long as they accepted the new Jewish state, many refused and moved out to other Arab lands. It was an error of historical proportions for the state of Israel to allow the Arabs stay even though so many of them took up arms against it. Arabs started the war, Arabs lost it, a clear case of put-up or shut-up. They have about as many rights of returning as Germans have of returning to Wrocław, ain't gonna happen. They might "return" to the Arab side of Palestine which today is the only side still uses that name. The Jewish Palestine changed name to Israel a long time ago. So ironically, once the "palestinians" get this country of their own they'll be back to square one, the same Arab Palestine the UN gave them to begin with, a result that refused to accept at the time. They should've never attacked the state of Israel and they'd have had their "arab palestine" all along.

delphiandomine:

skysoulmate: Mine? I'm not a leftist

Not you, him!

I mean - the evidence is all there - Californian, supporter of Palestine, supporter of Communist writers, anti-Jewish (very 1968), atheist, false intellectual - it all adds up

Oh I see, I know, I've had discourse with him before, that's fine, I guess we need lefties too.

Just please don't quote my name again while using the term leftist next to it. I'd rather be called the n-word. LOL

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Jul 12, 11, 00:31 #20

skysoulmate:

The Arabs were allowed to stay as long as they accepted the new Jewish state, many refused and moved out to other Arab lands.

You are lying. Arabs were driven out of hundreds of towns and villages at gunpoint. Many that resisted were massacred such as the villagers of Deir Yassin.

skysoulmate:

So ironically, once the "palestinians" get this country of their own they'll be back to square one, the same Arab Palestine the UN gave them to begin with, a result that refused to accept at the time. They should've never attacked the state of Israel and they'd have had their "arab palestine" all along.

They will not be back to "square one" because the UN partition gave them 49% of Palestine's landmass despite Arabs far outnumbering the Zionists who got 51%. The paltry state on the West Bank and in Gaza which they are supossedly offered is only 20-some percent of Palestine. By Your reasoning the Palestinians shouldn't have resisted foreigners giving away over half of their homeland to Jewish immigrants, but no people on Earth would agree to such an injustice without resisting. You claim Arabs should've accepted this ridiculous situation because you are probably a racist that believes Arabs are inferior to Jews. In any event the two-state solution has been revealed as a ploy by the Zionists to make the world believe they are negotiating for peace while they continually place more and more illegal settlements in the West Bank. The only viable solution is for there to be a single secular state in all of Palestine with equal rights and citizenship for everyone regardless of their religion. The USA is a secular republic. Poland is a secular republic and hopefully some day Palestine will be one too.

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Edited by: skysoulmate Jul 12, 11, 00:40 #21

Des Essientes:

The only viable solution is for there to be a single secular state in all of Palestine with equal rights and citizenship for everyone regardless of their religion. The USA is a secular republic. Poland is a secular republic and hopefully some day Palestine will be one too.

A sheer nonsense. First of all the Palestinian territories were part of Jordan, there was no Palestine that the Jews supposedly took the land from. As far as one Palestine, it'll never happen but it is a very popular plot by Arab and socialist extremist who all know that Muslims tend to procreate like, well, you get the point. Within a few years the Jewish population would be a tiny minority in their own country, which is exactly what you espouse. It's bad enough with the Arab population that already lives in Israel, their percentage keeps increasing as is. ...and there goes your "driven out at gunpoint" theory, I guess the Israelis didn't have enough guns to drive them all out, is that it??

-----

Harry:

You sound like Arkadiusz Protasiuk.

Not sure who he is so I'm not sure if this is a compliment or not?

legendThreads: 9 Posts: 819 Joined: Apr 23, 11 ♂	Jul 12, 11, 00:51 #22
delphiandomine: I mean - the evidence is all there - Californian, supporter of Palestine, supporter of Communist writers, anti-Jewish (very 1968), atheist, false intellectual - it all adds up nicely. Are you a WASP, supporter of Israel, supporter of capitalism, pro zionist, evangelical nut, etc?

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Jul 12, 11, 00:57 #23

Des Essientes:

The USA is a secular republic. Poland is a secular republic

"In God We Trust' and all the rest of it - doesn't sound like a secular republic to me.

As for Poland - dream on.

legend:

Are you a WASP, supporter of Israel, supporter of capitalism, pro zionist, evangelical nut, etc?

Worse.

I'm centrist and politically non-aligned - I prefer to take things issue-by-issue rather than obeying any one ideology. Classical centrist, really ;) In Poland, so far, I've voted for independent candidates every time.

AmathystThreads: 30 Posts: 3,968 Joined: Nov 10, 06 ♀	Jul 12, 11, 01:06 #24
Marynka11: Don't you think most regular people are over those old animosities? Yes, In dont care that the Germans bombed my Grannies street, its the past..we are a different generation and we can sit and talk and eat and enjoy today and tomorrow, not yesterday...Its about a future - if people didnt look foward, then how could be progress?

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Jul 12, 11, 02:14 #25

delphiandomine:

Buber certainly wasn't Polish

Buber was quite fluent in Polish and he was about to translate Nietzsche's Zarathustra into Polish before deferring to a friend who had already begun to do so.

delphiandomine:

The usual claim of a racist is say "I'm not being racist, but".

You call me a racist and I explain that I am an anti-racist. You being unable to find anything racist in my response, grab the word "racist" from it, and then invent a nonexistent "but". If you think my anti-Zionist position is racist then explain how so, otherwise you should be quiet, because your cheap attempts at smearing me a racist without any argument just makes you look foolish.

JonnyMThreads: 16 Posts: 4,487 Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂	Jul 12, 11, 03:00 #26
Des Essientes: Buber Martin Buber? Are you serious? Have you actually read any Buber? RobertLee: Korwin-Mikke...His party will participate in the coming elections. And will not get any seats.

henchinThreads: 1 Posts: 2 Joined: Jul 12, 11 ♂	Jul 12, 11, 23:25 #27
I think that Korwin-Mikke is the most intelligent polish politican. I voted him in last year.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Jul 12, 11, 23:43 #28
He's just one guy. Why not listen to any random guy on the issue?

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Jul 12, 11, 23:50 #29

Des Essientes:

Buber was quite fluent in Polish and he was about to translate Nietzsche's Zarathustra into Polish before deferring to a friend who had already begun to do so.

Fluent in Polish doesn't make someone Polish. If you'd actually ever visited Poland, you'd know that being Polish isn't just a matter of language, but tradition and culture too.

Des Essientes:

You call me a racist and I explain that I am an anti-racist. You being unable to find anything racist in my response, grab the word "racist" from it, and then invent a nonexistent "but". If you think my anti-Zionist position is racist then explain how so, otherwise you should be quiet, because your cheap attempts at smearing me a racist without any argument just makes you look foolish.

Again with the Zionist stuff. Quite common among so called "anti-racist" types to subscribe to that particular theory.

JonnyM:

And will not get any seats.

He'll get the usual 2% - usually from people sick to death of post-Solidarity/PZPR politics.

Seanus:

He's just one guy. Why not listen to any random guy on the issue?

Because the random guy doesn't agree with some Polish-American racist schmuck.

joepilsudskiThreads: 44 Posts: 2,529 Joined: Apr 27, 07 ♂	Jul 13, 11, 18:48 #30
skysoulmate: Fair enough, if those said "Palestinians", whatever that term really means, return the land their ancestors stole from the Jewish people. Is that fair enough to you? The Palestinians stole Khazaria?

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