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Medvedev in Poland

posts: 26

PennBoyThreads: 157 Posts: 3,443 Joined: Dec 7, 08 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 17:41 #1
http://russia-media.ru/generalnews/morenews.php?iditem=2456

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 17:43 #2
Surely testing the resolve of the Polish leaders to see if they have any bottle or a bit of welly ;0 ;) He is being treated very well apparently. Rather him than Putin, I say.

BolleThreads: 3 Posts: 226 Joined: Apr 29, 10 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 19:34 #3
I saw some students in wroclaw's rynek today holding signs saying "wspolpraca z rosja = czwarte rozbiory" and the same message spray painted/markered on signs and walls in the stare miasto.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 19:37 #4
Please remind me, Bolle, what does rozbiory mean? It has slipped my mind :( So, how many eggs will Medvedev get thrown at him? ;)

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Dec 7, 10, 19:39 #5
Bolle: I saw some students Enough said. Perhaps when they stop enjoying State funds, they'll protest against real things.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 19:43 #6
First question to Kommie from Medvedev? 'Do you like TATU?' What else will be on the agenda?

bimber94Threads: 9 Posts: 400 Joined: Mar 13, 09 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 20:03 #7
Sound like the 'elephant in the room' syndrome.

DarrenMThreads: 2 Posts: 126 Joined: Dec 21, 07 ♂	Edited by: DarrenM Dec 7, 10, 20:23 #8
A new level of trust and understanding...... So whilst Russia is busy holding its hands up for the Katyn massacre perhaps they could also extend some of that contriteness to the 1.7 million Poles sent to slave labour camps in Siberia and Kazakhstan. Only one third of them survived. A far greater number of deaths than Katyn but equally abhorent.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 7, 10, 20:25 #9
Good point, Darren. My mother-in-law made the same point when I was speaking to her. Medvedev has to accept that Poles bear grudges and with good reason in many cases. He bears no direct responsibility but his words will go a long way to calming minds.

♂

Edited by: Sasha Dec 7, 10, 22:53 #10

DarrenM:

Only one third of them survived.

Darren, could you please make your "good point" blue (i.e. with a prooflink) instead of bold black so that it doesn't sound like an ad hominem statement. I believe that you read it somewhere, I just ask that you share the knowledge with me who has never hitherto heard of such figures.

P.S. You may as well keep counting heads... There's a high chance that some Pole has just drunk oneself to death in some retired Siberian village.

P.P.S. The most realistic point about atonement was made here

rychlikThreads: 51 Posts: 446 Joined: Aug 6, 08 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 00:18 #11
Medvedev looks so stiff.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 00:20 #12
You shouldn't be looking in such places ;) ;) That happens sometimes when so much hinges on words, rychlik.

dtaylor5632Threads: 49 Posts: 4,459 Joined: May 2, 09 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 00:23 #13
Smite u too Seanus, non believer!!!!!!!

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 00:24 #14
Non-believer in what? What is it now? ;) Non-believer in Medvedev or...?

kondziorThreads: 2 Posts: 441 Joined: Oct 16, 09 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 00:56 #15
One cannot trust a Russian. Cheats and crooks, all of them. Just pretend you get lost and try to ask a Russian about directions. Ask three of them, in a row. You'll get three separate, convoluted routes, each will lead you in quite different a place, none of it even close to a site where you wanted to go. One cannot trust a Russian. They'll cheat you with a friendly smile.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 01:06 #16
That's a little harsh, is it not?

♂

Dec 8, 10, 02:25 #17

kondzior:

One cannot trust a Russian. Cheats and crooks, all of them.
Just pretend you get lost and try to ask a Russian about directions. Ask three of them, in a row. You'll get three separate, convoluted routes, each will lead you in quite different a place, none of it even close to a site where you wanted to go.
One cannot trust a Russian. They'll cheat you with a friendly smile.

I think there is good and bad people from all nations.

I give Medvedev credit for coming to Poland and meeting with Polish leaders in trying to improve Russia-Poland relations.

♂

Edited by: Sasha Dec 8, 10, 09:19 #18

kondzior:

One cannot trust a Russian.

One cannot, dwoe mogut.

kondzior:

Cheats and crooks, all of them.

Amen! :)

Seanus:

That's a little harsh, is it not?

Absolutely not. If not that kind of people that would be harder to make money, at least for me. They bear no nationality, they're all about the same here in Russia and anywhere else in the world.

Nanopresident (as we call him here due to his height of 162cm and fancy for nanotechnologies) unlike putin has a heart. That's what I have to admit after him being at the helm for a couple years. He's not a gifted leader, yet the positive trend in liberalization (though faint) is clear.
The step however is not disinterested. From what I see they're expecting similar for 80 thousand Soviet POWs of the Pol.-Bol. wojna.

♂

Dec 8, 10, 09:26 #19

kondzior:

Just pretend you get lost and try to ask a Russian about directions. Ask three of them, in a row. You'll get three separate, convoluted routes

Ehh ... the Dutch do the same with Germans. When they ask for directions, we always send them back to the border.

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25219:
"The most anti-German sentiments are among the Dutch and Danish, who just hate them from invading their countries too often. When German ask for directions in Holland, they’re usually given directions to the shortest way out of the country, or told “Give us back our bikes!”, a reference to the fact that Germans confiscated Dutch bicycles during WW2".

Sorry BB ... ;)

♂

Edited by: 1jola Dec 8, 10, 09:50 #20

delphiandomine:

Enough said. Perhaps when they stop enjoying State funds, they'll protest against real things.

That's funny, you being European and all (formerly Scottish), wish students to fund their own education.

DarrenM:

So whilst Russia is busy holding its hands up for the Katyn massacre

It's not binding what they have done so far. Duma can vote tomorrow and blame the Germans. The law is what matters. Miedwiediew, in his interview with Lis, played off the Russian court's recent reply to Strasbourg calling the crime an "occurance" and its unwillingness to hand over the Katyń files in a casual way. He simply said he is not aware of it. M. is a lawyer, mind you. 66 volumes are still secret. What Polish historians think is that there must be evidence in the record of German-Soviet co-operation during the time of extermination of Polish intelligence. Gestapo and NKVD did meet several times and certainly discussed the Polish opostion. Then they proceeded in carrying out the crime. Another thing we know that should be there is a film, or rather the copy, as the original was given to North Korea in 1950 as a training film, of, well, we will see if they ever declassify the files.

Not surprisingly, there is no discussion about concrete issues that prevent us from drinking together, but the show must go on.

Very good move on Russia's part, as Poland is about to take EU's presidency soon, at least they know what they are doing.

You socialist scum should unite in denouncing this post. :)

♂

Edited by: DarrenM Dec 8, 10, 11:19 #21

Sasha:

I believe that you read it somewhere, I just ask that you share the knowledge with me who has never hitherto heard of such figures.

There is a 5 part film on You Tube. Part One is here:

Jagna Wright and Aneta Naszyńska produced the film and it took them over nine years to produce.

Additional Resources:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Kresy-Siberia/

http://www.kresy-siberia.com/

1jola:

It's not binding what they have done so far. Duma can vote tomorrow and blame the Germans.

Agreed.

1jola:

What Polish historians think is that there must be evidence in the record of German-Soviet co-operation during the time of extermination of Polish intelligence. Gestapo and NKVD did meet several times and certainly discussed the Polish opostion. Then they proceeded in carrying out the crime.

Again, I couldn't agree more.

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 8, 10, 14:52 #22
There is still some governance going on ;) ;) I certainly hope the taxpayer doesn't finance any of this, or any other, visit. Kommie can pay out of his own pocket. Nothing gets done, much like the peace process in the ME.

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Dec 8, 10, 15:22 #23
1jola: That's funny, you being European and all (formerly Scottish), wish students to fund their own education. Sure, it should mean they take their studies far more seriously.

EchoTheCatThreads: 2 Posts: 183 Joined: Jan 20, 10 ♀	Dec 9, 10, 11:47 #24
Seanus: Please remind me, Bolle, what does rozbiory mean? It has slipped my mind :( Rozbiór - partition The situation when your neighbours decide to treat you like their birtday cake and eat you part by part ; )

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,158 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Dec 9, 10, 15:27 #25
Aha, thanks for the explanation, Echo :) :) I usually remember vocab but this time.... So, Medvedev in Poland? What a waste of fuel. Please tell me ONE important and meaningful thing he said beyond rhetoric and verbal diarrhoea.

EchoTheCatThreads: 2 Posts: 183 Joined: Jan 20, 10 ♀	Dec 9, 10, 15:52 #26
He came with package of files about Katyń so at least he brought a present ;) The rest of them (46 files from Moscow's archive) we'll get on the occasion of another president's crash ;) Sorry for the black humor, blame The Monty Python.

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