jonni: Your point, Numbnut was:
You can quote one part of the sentence all you like, but ofcourse you know what I mean when you've read the whole story.
jonni: First you say they: don't recieve any wellfare anymore, then you talk about them not being able to afford real estate prices.
I'll try to explain it again, because you're obviously illiterate or something?
If you aren't highly educated, you'll need a simple job to start somewhere. But you can't compete with foreign workers for the simpler jobs, simply because the most basal costs of living don't allow it. If you don't have a job, and you won't recieve wellfare either before the age of twenty seven, you simply don't exist in society. Not only can you not afford real estate housing prices, you can't afford to pay any rent either.
jonni: In effect you're saying they should have a higher standard of living than people from other parts of Europe, but can't afford it because they won't drop their expectations.
I'm not saying they should have a higher standard of living than people from other parts of Europe. You still seem to think we're doing better than foreign workers, and that we all recieve wellfare because we're too spoiled and too lazy to work, which simply isn't the case. We're basically are being treated as a non-existent problem here. It's all our own fault, just like your posting suggests.
I'm saying they should have equal opportunities. If you want me to ask for less salary, you'll have to lower the rent aswell. (Which also differs per region.) Foreign workers who work here on a temporary basis don't have to pay this rent, because these agencies put twenty of them in a bungalow. Dutch guys aren't even allowed to rent a bungalow. We have to rent a permanent residency, because according to the rules, we're supposed to have an official address. It's as simple as that really. I hope you'll understand what I mean now?
I believe you've done a study, I believe it's doable when you have a simple job, but it's not as easy to get a simple job anymore, because times have changed dramatically in the last eight years.
jonni: So do you favour market forces in the labour market or restrictions?
You should be aware of the fact that the local working class people are the ones who are being restricted at the moment. Free market? I'm fine with a free market, but I do favour equal opportunity and equal salary. So either you pay the immigrants more so they can rent houses too, or you pay everyone less salary and lower the rents and taxes. I'm not speaking Martian am I? It's very simple.
jonni: Others manage it, even if they have to clean floors and peel potatoes all day to pay for it. I worked in labouring jobs to put myself through education.
I have done all types of work, I've had dozens of different employers in the last eight years, and no matter how hard I worked, none of them gave me a contract, and none of these employers wanted a Dutch person. Because foreign workers were cheaper, they didn't seem to care that some of these so-called workers are total screw ups, because they can send them home anytime they like.
And that's the real reason, employers don't want commitment anymore. They want cheap, cheaper, cheapest, and if you'd ask them, they'd probably want slaves they don't have to pay anything. So you don't really have a point here.
jonni: But if you're sitting all day in a coffee shop or some such place, being waited on by hard-working minimum-wage immigrants, I suppose there's no time to work.
I started working as an Electrician when I was sixteen. I recieved a temporary contract, and they send me to school for one day in the week. I didn't recieve minimum pay because of this, and when I finished my course, they fired me, and took another guy they could educate. They actually recieve funding for sending someone to school, and this one of the many tricks they use to keep labour cheap. It costs them very little.
So I was eighteen, and still broke. I had to save money for a driving license, because without a driving license, you won't get any job as an Electrician. So I started working for an agency, and did all kinds of simple jobs that most of you wouldn't even consider doing. (Dangerous jobs too.)
Ofcourse, all these jobs were temporary, and didn't last long. I could barely pay the rent every month, and barely support myself, because you simply don't make much when you're fired a few times every month. I can tell you from personal experience that you won't even make the minimum. You will earn less than someone on wellfare most months. So ofcourse it took me ages to save up enough money for a driving license.
After that I joined the army.
I've been working at two different factories the last two years, at the first factory I've worked for eight months, and at the second I've worked for fifteen months, ofcourse on a temporary contract. Then I got fired again because of the crisis.
I'm sitting in a Coffeeshop? Waiting? Keep dreaming. I'm studying as we speak, but I'm running out of money again. So yeah, I'll keep speaking my mind back home, and I'll keep speaking my mind here. And call someone else a numbnut please, because under different circumstances, I'm pretty confident I'll be able to compete with most of you.
But I need a start somewhere, and that's the biggest problem for me and a lot of other guys who actually want to contribute to society. They should either raise minimum wages, or lower the rents to keep it fair. If I would screw up under those circumstances, then you'd be right, and then you'd have the right to say it's all my fault.
:)
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