PIS and PO - what is the difference in their programs?

helloThreads: 37 Posts: 1,104 Joined: Dec 5, 06 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 16:52 #1
Since I'm not in Poland any more, I don't really get the difference between the two leading parties in Poland (PO - Platforma Obywatelska and PIS - Partia Prawo i Sprawiedliwosc). Which party is more "democratic", and which more "republican"? I assume PIS is more conservative.

WroclawThreads: 74 Posts: 7,272 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Edited by: Administrator Sep 10, 07, 16:54 #2
http://www.po.org.pl - PO http://www.pis.org.pl - PIS

RonekThreads: 1 Posts: 297 Joined: Sep 4, 07 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 16:54 #3
their both ulra chrian parties, so thats it when asking about them beeing conservative. And I sugest lets stop at that so we wont cause forums flames.

helloThreads: 37 Posts: 1,104 Joined: Dec 5, 06 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 16:56 #4
From what I know, many Poles in Poland are now PISsed at PIS, for some reason. I would say - let them continue one more time to finish what they have started; otherwise, Poland may be in mess.

RonekThreads: 1 Posts: 297 Joined: Sep 4, 07 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 16:59 #5
not realy.

WroclawThreads: 74 Posts: 7,272 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Sep 10, 07, 17:09 #6
The most important thing is a party with a clear majority. But I doubt that's going to happen.

♂

Edited by: Lukasz Sep 10, 07, 17:15 #7

Shortly

PO liberal economics, less bureaucracy, thinking about future, pro European, in some cases conservative.

PiS social economics, bureaucrats, anty communistic, fighting corruption, definitely conservative,

LiD -, corrupted, lazy (ex) communists who pretend to be our Labors party, submissive in European relationships

PSL - cooperate with everybody for some concessions for their electorate (farmers)

Samoobrona - populists

LPR- nationalists

Grzegorz_Threads: 80 Posts: 6,102 Joined: Nov 16, 06 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 17:21 #8
Quoting: Wroclaw The most important thing is a party with a clear majority. That's true. Both PO and PiS are... average, better on some things, worse on others - It doesn't really matters which one will win, the most important is to kick out of parliament frieks like LPR and SO and useless PSL and make commies as weak as this is possibel.

helloThreads: 37 Posts: 1,104 Joined: Dec 5, 06 ♂	Sep 10, 07, 17:21 #9
Good summary (I think), Lukasz. What about abortion and religion?

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Sep 10, 07, 17:33 #10

Quoting: hello

What about abortion and religion

We have kind of compromise, there is status quo, and main forces of parliament don’t change the abortion laws (you can have legal abortion only in some cases).

Religion .... to be honest PiS and LPR seams to use church (or some of its parts) in their policy (to get new electorate) . We have rather conservative country, so most politicians like to show themselves religious and serious about church … sometimes it looks funny.

helloThreads: 37 Posts: 1,104 Joined: Dec 5, 06 ♂	Edited by: hello Sep 10, 07, 17:50 #11
Ok then perhaps I would vote for PIS, but first they would have to change these: Bureaucrats - this is not something any business or citizen would want to deal with Anty communistic - good, may be anti-communistic, but this probably takes them too much time for nothing; they would be better off focusing on the real economical or social problems

PeterCptThreads: 2 Posts: 51 Joined: Jun 23, 07 ♂	Sep 13, 07, 19:51 #12
The problem with all these parties is that they are run by politicians who are more interested in satisfying their own egos than in running the country properly. At least, the Poles got rid of Kwasniewski and the SLD Bolshevik/Communists.

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Sep 13, 07, 21:51 #13

Quoting: hello

What about abortion and religion?

Quoting: hello

may be anti-communistic, but this probably takes them too much time for nothing; they would be better off focusing on the real economical or social problems

you see, hello, first you ask about abortion/religion and then say anti-communism is not an important thing, well I can say the same about abortion and religion, for me they are less of a problem for Poland (generally) than our communist burden (that still affects many areas, including economy and social life)

helloThreads: 37 Posts: 1,104 Joined: Dec 5, 06 ♂	Edited by: Administrator Sep 13, 07, 23:20 #14
But how long are Poles going to talk about communism? It's been 20 years since changing the "system" and people still haven't resolved it... On a side note, when I'm reading Gazeta.pl online it seems they try everything to discredit PIS. I thought the Polish public media should be a little more objective...

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07 ♂	Edited by: Lukasz Sep 14, 07, 06:24 #15
I dont see the problem, for hello religion/abortion is more inportnt than comunists. For me our economy is the most important thing so I m going to vote on PO

♂

Edited by: Krzysztof Sep 14, 07, 07:22 #16

What I meant is that for him some problems seem more improtant, for me not. What's wrong with religion in Poland? I've been an atheist for 20 years now, since I'm 16 and I never had any problems with that, not with my family (mostly religious) nor friends not even in church (because of wedding and baptism formalities). So it's hard for me to see why Poland is regarded as a church-dominated, backward country, because it's a huge exaggeration, IMHO. And about abortion, yes, I know our law is more restrictive here than normally in the Western world, but you need to see things in proportion, how many people are really affected by that law, it's not like every pregnant woman wants to get rid of the baby/foetus.

There are real and much bigger problems, affecting all the country and yes, they are connected with the fact that

Quoting: hello

It's been 20 years since changing the "system" and people still haven't resolved it

Quoting: hello

But how long are Poles going to talk about communism?

it's not about talking, it's about finally doing something.

and sticking to the topic, it's not the programs of the parties that matter, it's how they realize their program in practice, which, unfortunatelly in Poland is far from the promises made during the electorial campaign.

I really have a big headache because of the coming elections, I won't vote for PiS, because I can't forgive them forming a government with thieves from Samoobrona (Kaczyński's almost own words - two months or so before the election, of course he couldn't use the word "thieves" because of possible legal preceedments, but it's how he was talking about Lepper & Co., and I agree), but the alternative according to the current polls is a coallition of PO and LiD, and the Kwaśniewki party ruling (even as a smaller party in the government) this country again isn't any better. So let's say I see the future in black colors, when it's come to the political life :(

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Sep 17, 07, 05:34 #17

Polish PM in tight election race

Mr Kaczynski's party could benefit from a strong economy

Poland will hold parliamentary elections next month, two years ahead of schedule, with Prime Minister Jaroslaw Kaczynski rallying support for a traditional brand of conservatism.

He believes his Law and Justice party has a very strong chance of being re-elected when Poles cast their votes on 21 October. His twin brother Lech is Polish president.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6995228.stm

♂

Sep 18, 07, 04:35 #18

Hi,

Well, I think that the problem of the abortion and/or religion is quite important. Because, for these reason, polish citizens have not the same rights than any other europeans. When an european has some problems with his country (eg: this polish woman who now is blind because she didn't abort), They can go to an european tribunal and issue them. But there is an exception: Polish people can not do that if the problem is related with religion, family or national security.

About the comunism,... Well I am spanish. In Spain we had a similar problem than polish people now. After the dictator Franco (he was from the rigth wing and a radical catholic) we should choose between try to revenge or to try to solve the problems of the country. We chose to solve the problems of the country.

truhleiThreads: 14 Posts: 612 Joined: Jul 15, 07 ♂	Edited by: truhlei Sep 18, 07, 04:52 #19
By reading all posts I came to the conclusion that if I were Pole I would vote in favour of the League of Polish families. I think Poles who are for moral don't have any different way. Unfortunately the League is so unexperienced in politics and administration. It seems to romantic.

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07 ♂	Sep 18, 07, 05:58 #20
Quoting: truhlei By reading all posts I came to the conclusion that if I were Pole I would vote in favour of the League of Polish families. I think Poles who are for moral don't have any different way.Unfortunately the League is so unexperienced in politics and administration. It seems to romantic. Now I understand why you symphatize so much with sarmats ...

♂

Sep 18, 07, 06:24 #21

Quoting: Lukasz

Now I understand why you symphatize so much with sarmats ...

Yes, I hate liberast movement everythere.
It is not liberal.
I'm afraid Poland today isn't the historic RP. There are many people who are very agressive in their imoral behaviour and public opinion doesn't persecute them. There were moral violators before, but among middle classers such as little szlachta and city residents that was a shame. Nothing of the sort today.
I don't think the League has chosen a right political way to defend morals. But other political forces aren't moral defenders at all.

Grzegorz_Threads: 80 Posts: 6,102 Joined: Nov 16, 06 ♂	Sep 18, 07, 07:37 #22
Quoting: truhlei By reading all posts I came to the conclusion that if I were Pole I would vote in favour of the League of Polish families. Twins better.

truhleiThreads: 14 Posts: 612 Joined: Jul 15, 07 ♂	Sep 18, 07, 07:48 #23
Quoting: Grzegorz_ Twins better. Lech Kachynski is President. And I'm talking about the parlamentary elections. As to Jaroslaw, smth. may be wrong with his activities. Unfortunately the League have an antisemit reputation and that doesn't permit its dialogue with Russian political circles. I'm sure they have fresh ideas to solve some problems between Poland and Russia

one who knows

Oct 12, 07, 20:09 #24

Difference between main parties, explained in short.

Consider a barrel of honey with a spoonful of s-h-i-t. Poland, now.

Law and Justice (PiS):
Let us remove this s-h-i-t with care. The rest is honey nonetheless.

Civic Platform (PO):
No, let us take a spoon and stir to mix both ingredients.

the Left and Democrats (LiD):
Yes, let us mix, but use an electric mixer instead of a simple spoon.

And s-h-i-t eaters - which party (parties) are they likely to vote ?

lesser

Oct 14, 07, 17:37 #25

Nobody mentioned UPR party which is the oldest in post-communist history of Poland. However they are outside of the parliament for many years they regularly win the support of about 2% of voters.

- economically liberal much more than PO
- more conservative and traditionalist than PiS
- anti-EU which they consider to be a socialist bureaucratic monster, so pro-absolute independence
- pro-freedom in general
- pro-NATO

Actually the made a tactical alliance with LPR and hopefully they finally manage to do it. Poland need them because actually only PO declare itself to be pro-liberal economy but their proposal often are far from such general declaration. Sometimes they sound like a openly socialist PiS. UPR should counter them on this ground and hopefully cooperate to change this country and reject bureaucracy caused by socialism.

Grzegorz_Threads: 80 Posts: 6,102 Joined: Nov 16, 06 ♂	Oct 14, 07, 17:40 #26
UPR is right on many things but they have no chance in serious politics.

lesser

Oct 14, 07, 18:00 #27

Well if our dear mainstream media would be so kind to report that Korwin-Mikke isn't the chief of UPR anymore and that the new wave of politicians of younger generation run them then perhaps they could do something positive for all of us.

I have seen recently their chief Wojciech Popiela in long two hour debate in Superstancja TV. He did destroy his opponents from other parties in this discussion. Even journalist who run this debate Mrs Paradowska a leftist said that she was surprised by very good impression that he made. In SMS voting he was classified third after PO and LiD what is great result if you consider that they introduced him as a representation of LPR.

jareck8	Oct 25, 07, 08:34 #28
Quoting: Grzegorz_ make commies as weak as this is possibel. bravo to that,,,,, these pis and po have christian roots, and this ideology will maintain decency in this nation... we must stand firm with our principles and ensure that we do not lower our backs to bullies like germany and russia

lesserThreads: 7 Posts: 2,014 Joined: Oct 19, 07 ♂	Nov 2, 07, 15:49 #29
Good article about PO, unfortunately only in Polish language: prawica.net/node/9062

LukaszThreads: 73 Posts: 2,396 Joined: Sep 1, 07 ♂	Edited by: Lukasz Nov 2, 07, 16:57 #30
Quoting: lesser prawica.net/node/9062 interesting I can agree with first part of article.

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