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Poland fines singer for bashing Bible


page 5 of 5:  « Prev  1  2  3  4  5 posts: 149

Foreigner4Threads: 22
Posts: 1,990
Joined: Nov 18, 07 ♂ 		 Jan 19, 12, 19:40    #121
a.k.:
The court obviously took her words as an insult.

I would like to hear the rationale for it being taken as an insult; she either stated something factually correct or not regarding the biblical authors' use of substances. Nothing at all was mentioned of their collective character. I am not sure how her defense managed to lose the case unless the verdict was in before the trial began and all that was needed for someone to "feel" insulted:/
JonnyMThreads: 16
Posts: 4,487
Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂ 		Edited by: JonnyM  Jan 19, 12, 19:42    #122
Foreigner4:
I would like to hear the rationale for it being taken as an insul

It's the first hearing in a Polish law court - there doesn't need to be a rationale; the documents just need to be presented correctly. Justifying it all and arguing happens later.
RoughFlavorsThreads: 1
Posts: 106
Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀ 		 Jan 19, 12, 19:43    #123
Foreigner4:
all that was needed for someone to "feel" insulted:/

pretty much

quite pathetic that someone can actually still be punished by law in the middle of Europe in the 21st century for "insulting" some "holy" book
croggersThreads: 8
Posts: 91
Joined: Nov 24, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 19, 12, 19:49    #124
I'm offended that she didn't actually physically BASH the bible.
In England when you call someone a bible basher it means they are very religious.The irony lol
SebastianThreads: 8
Posts: 129
Joined: Feb 16, 10 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 07:08    #125
This is ridiculous. Poland is a secular country, so why the hell should she be punished for this? It goes against free speech, and quite frankly the Catholic Church in Poland can go **** themselves. They have too much influence in Polish society and I'm glad Poland is slowly becoming less religious.
croggersThreads: 8
Posts: 91
Joined: Nov 24, 11 ♂ 		Edited by: croggers  Jan 20, 12, 08:18    #126
One of my students told me that here in Poland you can get an on the spot fine for causing offence :- calling someone fat/ugly/ calling Jesus a raving homosexual in the street........ any truth to this?
(Just a quick edit there before the lovable grammar police go in for the kill, and when I say lovable I mean I'd absolutely love to volley them in the plumbs) >:o
JonnyMThreads: 16
Posts: 4,487
Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 09:46    #127
croggers:
One of my students told me that here in Poland you can get an on the spot fine for causing offence :- calling someone fat/ugly/ calling Jesus a raving homosexual in the street........ any truth to this?

In theory. The same as in England except there it's behaviour liable to cause a breach of the peace and in Poland it's either insulting behaviour or using vulgarisms in the street. As with any 'on the spot' penalty, you can refuse to accept guilt and then it turns into a long-winded legal process.
RichfilthThreads: 8
Posts: 327
Joined: Mar 8, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 09:56    #128
croggers:
calling Jesus a raving homosexual in the street.


Is calling someone homosexual insulting? If they're not, they're not, but I'd rather be accused of being gay than Catholic.
JonnyMThreads: 16
Posts: 4,487
Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 10:00    #129
Richfilth:
Is calling someone homosexual insulting?

Frequently in the minds (and terminology) of those who do it. That's why the hammer of the law exists.
Richfilth:
I'd rather be accused of being gay than Catholic.

;-)
croggersThreads: 8
Posts: 91
Joined: Nov 24, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 10:26    #130
Well I assume it would be insulting to Catholics callings Jesus a homosexual, that was my point, not calling someone a homo but calling Jesus one.
OlafThreads: 8
Posts: 1,369
Joined: Oct 29, 09  Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 10:29    #131
Richfilth
Richfilth:
Is calling someone homosexual insulting? If they're not, they're not, but I'd rather be accused of being gay than Catholic.

Hahah, that's a good insight! Made me think.
JonnyMThreads: 16
Posts: 4,487
Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 10:36    #132
croggers:
insulting to Catholics callings Jesus a homosexual, that was my point, not calling someone a homo but calling Jesus one.

In fact Jesus came from a society where there were far fewer hang-ups about sexuality than most catholics have today.
croggersThreads: 8
Posts: 91
Joined: Nov 24, 11 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 11:01    #133
JonnyM:
In fact Jesus came from a society where there were far fewer hang-ups about sexuality than most catholics have today.

yeah they twist and change religion to suit themselves. If there was such a person as Jesus and he was actually the son of God I'd love to know how different the actual events and RULES were/are. Religious people annoy me, no, people who preach annoy me. THEY OFFEND ME lol
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,999
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		Edited by: FUZZYWICKETS  Jan 20, 12, 11:33    #134
Richfilth:
Is calling someone homosexual insulting?


Case and point why the law is ridiculous. Whether you think it's insulting or not, a few guys in Warsaw are going to decide this for you. Freedom of speech does not exist in Poland and that sucks.

croggers:
If there was such a person as Jesus and he was actually the son of God I'd love to know how different the actual events and RULES were/are.


Does it matter? Regardless of what really happened, they'd change it up to suit themselves regardless.
IronsideThreads: 59
Posts: 6,786
Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 12:56    #135
FUZZYWICKETS:
a few guys in Warsaw are going to decide this for you.

the court will decide, yes.
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,999
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		Edited by: FUZZYWICKETS  Jan 20, 12, 14:16    #136
Ironside:
the court will decide, yes.


but the mere fact that you even land in court is because of a law written by a few Polish citizens who decided x, y, and z is insulting. communist. but then again, Poland is full of communist relics, starting with zameldowanie. hopefully Poland grows out of this.
IronsideThreads: 59
Posts: 6,786
Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 14:44    #137
FUZZYWICKETS:
but the mere fact that you even land in court is because of a law written by a few Polish citizens who decided x, y, and z is insulting.

nope, somebody complained that the only reason that case is in court.
RoughFlavorsThreads: 1
Posts: 106
Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀ 		 Jan 20, 12, 15:27    #138
Ironside:
somebody complained that the only reason that case is in court

that's not a very good reason to end up in court. the exercise of free speech is bound to be offensive, controversial, contentious, iconoclastic to someone out there. if we judged what can or cannot be said based on whether it offends someone, we couldn't say anything at all.

FUZZYWICKETS:
Freedom of speech does not exist in Poland and that sucks.

apparently not
IronsideThreads: 59
Posts: 6,786
Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 15:44    #139
RoughFlavors:
that's not a very good reason to end up in court. the exercise of free speech i

definition of freedom of speech vary whats good for the USA doesn't necessary is good for Poland. Initially the term - freedom of speech - has been connected with ability to criticize a ruler or a government.
Obama was right and the USA is the devil !

expressed by one of your pop-singers would that still be acceptable exercise of freedom of speech ?no consequences of law suits would follow?
IronsideThreads: 59
Posts: 6,786
Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 15:55    #140
Anyway in the case of Doda (that pop- wannabe singer ) what you read above about Poland court fined her is simply misinformation.
Translating that circumstances into the USA system it would be so called - preliminary hearing.
Comprar ?
RoughFlavorsThreads: 1
Posts: 106
Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀ 		 Jan 20, 12, 16:00    #141
Ironside:
whats good for the USA doesn't necessary is good for Poland

how did we start talking about the USA?

how is the inability to say anything you want good for any country?
IronsideThreads: 59
Posts: 6,786
Joined: Feb 26, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 16:14    #142
RoughFlavors:
how is the inability to say anything you want good for any country?

I said that definitions of what a freedom of speech means differ !
You cannot say anything you want anywhere - not without consequences !
milkyThreads: 10
Posts: 1,229
Joined: Oct 26, 09 ♀ 		 Jan 20, 12, 16:19    #143
There seems to be a division between the loons with the cross, and the trendies slagging the church. The truth is not somewhere in between, both sides are blind to Poland's grey reality.
RoughFlavorsThreads: 1
Posts: 106
Joined: Jan 18, 12 ♀ 		 Jan 20, 12, 16:54    #144
Ironside:
Initially the term - freedom of speech - has been connected with ability to criticize a ruler or a government.

it did start like that, and then it evolved because a lot of forward-thinking people saw that it is beneficial for individuals to be able to criticize other aspects of a society, including other people's beliefs concerning "holy" objects. again, you can't have free speech if your goal is to be inoffensive, and if you can't have free speech, can you have democracy?
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,999
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 17:08    #145
Ironside:
nope, somebody complained that the only reason that case is in court.


with the law being the catalyst.

Ironside:
expressed by one of your pop-singers would that still be acceptable exercise of freedom of speech ?no consequences of law suits would follow?


As if that hasn't happened countless times already since he took office? No lawsuits. No consequences. Witaj w Ameryce.

Ironside:
definition of freedom of speech vary whats good for the USA doesn't necessary is good for Poland.


good for Ironside is more like it. don't speak for all of poland.

RoughFlavors:
if you can't have free speech, can you have democracy?


No.

You.

Can.

Not.
FUZZYWICKETSThreads: 12
Posts: 1,999
Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♂ 		 Jan 20, 12, 17:36    #146
http://boingboing.net/2012/01/19/how-the-internet-blackout-affe.html
milkyThreads: 10
Posts: 1,229
Joined: Oct 26, 09 ♀ 		 Jan 20, 12, 19:48    #147
Was listening to her singing,maybe she should be fined for being sinfully annoying.
EM_WaveThreads: 20
Posts: 513
Joined: Nov 11, 11 ♂ [Suspended] 		 Jan 20, 12, 20:13    #148
Ironside:
expressed by one of your pop-singers would that still be acceptable exercise of freedom of speech ?no consequences of law suits would follow?


No legal consequences would arise from that.

America is a much better country than Poland is in terms of freedom of speech. Get over it.
PlasticPoleThreads: 10
Posts: 5,432
Joined: May 28, 09 ♀ 		 Jan 21, 12, 03:41    #149
milky:
Was listening to her singing,maybe she should be fined for being sinfully annoying.

She could be fined for not knowing bible stuff but if people were fined for that, the municipalities would have a huge windfall.

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