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POLAND HAS LOST 1 MILLION PEOPLE (for other EU countries)


posts: 30

rychlikThreads: 51
Posts: 446
Joined: Aug 6, 08 ♂ 		Edited by: rychlik  Jul 22, 11, 20:00    #1
Discuss.

More than one million Poles who left their homeland for other countries in the EU after 2004 won't come back to Poland, a local newspaper has written.

Poles are reportedly succeeding abroad: improving their education and opening their own businesses. And they don't see any changes in Poland that would encourage them to return.

As a result, Poland's Central Statistical Office will have to revise its data: there are 37 million, as opposed to 38.2 million inhabitants in Poland, Dziennik Gazeta Prawna writes.

Economic migration has also created an important demand for legal and consulting services for Poles who want to know how to start their own businesses. Although in 2004, a lot of Poles took on jobs for which they were overqualified, increasing numbers are now branching out and starting their own businesses.

http://www.wbj.pl/article-55418-poland-has-lost-over-one-million-citiz ens.html?typ=pam


Poland is s'crewed. And here I was thinking about moving back to Poland.
TheOtherThreads: 5
Posts: 1,584
Joined: Jul 13, 09 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 20:07    #2
Would be interesting to see the age distribution, and what education the people who leave Poland have.
pawianThreads: 90
Posts: 5,399
Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		Edited by: pawian  Jul 22, 11, 20:07    #3
Read about Polish emigration throughout centuries. It is not only about seeking a better style of life and escaping from poverty. There is sth more to it. We are travellers and explorers by heart. After all, Columbus was Polish.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1333895/Christopher-Columbus-P olish-Portuguese-claim-historians.html
PennBoyThreads: 157
Posts: 3,443
Joined: Dec 7, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 20:07    #4
Poland is s'crewed. And here I was thinking about moving back to Poland.

Well these are new immigrants of only a couple years. There were quite a few Poles after being in the States 20-30 yrs who decided to go back and open up a business in Poland.
rychlikThreads: 51
Posts: 446
Joined: Aug 6, 08 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 20:17    #5
Polands population never officially reached 40 million. I have read the birth rate has gotten slightly better in Poland, but with this official news, it won't make a difference. It will weaken the country. I wonder if this was the intention of the EU? I have to go to Poland now and spread my seed :)
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 20:27    #6
I have to go to Poland now and spread my seed :)


Please, be careful. Don`t spread it on me.
PennBoyThreads: 157
Posts: 3,443
Joined: Dec 7, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 20:30    #7
Polands population never officially reached 40 million. I have read the birth rate has gotten slightly better in Poland,

In the 70s there were a lot of children being born. My parents said around 77', 78' it seamed like every other woman was pregnant.
JonnyMThreads: 16
Posts: 4,487
Joined: Mar 9, 11 ♂ 		 Jul 22, 11, 22:53    #8
In the 70s there were a lot of children being born. My parents said around 77', 78' it seamed like every other woman was pregnant.

There was a bit population spike from the late 70's to the early 80's. They've all got to find work and there just aren't the opportunities in Poland.
Chicago PollockThreads: 10
Posts: 638
Joined: Apr 10, 10 ♂ 		 Jul 23, 11, 07:16    #9
There was a bit population spike from the late 70's to the early 80's. They've all got to find work and there just aren't the opportunities in Poland.


If you want people to hang around you have to pay 'em.
hague1cmaeronThreads: 21
Posts: 1,652
Joined: Mar 30, 10 ♂ 		Edited by: hague1cmaeron  Jul 23, 11, 08:31    #10
Poland is s'crewed. And here I was thinking about moving back to Poland.

With an attitude like that, the phrase that comes to mind is good riddance.....
I am sure you won't be missed.

More than one million Poles who left their homeland for other countries in the EU after 2004 won't come back to Poland


There is no way they can say that with a 100% certainty.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,158
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 23, 11, 08:36    #11
Hague, it's called 'dramatic effect' in writing :)

Many won't come back to Poland, it's true. Many of my students went across, came back for a visit and said that they much preferred it over there. What's the problem with having fewer people anyway? More chance for those here to get into employment.
ShAlEyNsTfOhThreads: 8
Posts: 232
Joined: Feb 5, 11  Pictures: 4 ♂ [Suspended] 		Edited by: ShAlEyNsTfOh  Jul 23, 11, 09:03    #12
in the late 1800's to early 1900's, the average fertility rate for polish women both in poland and america was around 7.1 (my prababcia had 11 kids living on a farm in Zabludow - 4 males died in WWII)..my maternal babcia had 8 of her own (all survived).. and my mom had 4 (+ 2 miscarriages)..

The Polki of today should once again follow this trend, and our population *decline* will quickly be reversed. :D

I don't understand why people are so overly concerned about being financially stable to support their offspring..

I mean, ****.. you have pakistani couples having an average of 8+ kids while living on welfare in Canada, yet they all seam to live happy, prosperous lives, and send their children all off to universities later on.

I'm 24, make just over minimum wage, and live happily on my own... yet i'm incredibly desperate to have kids... I wanna start off with 1, then 2, then 4, then 6...hell, i'd go for 10 or more.. money or no money.. there are ALWAYS ways to support your kids in a developed country, So so so so soo many ways. :)
milkyThreads: 10
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Joined: Oct 26, 09 ♀ 		 Jul 23, 11, 11:39    #13
If you want people to hang around you have to pay 'em.

Exactly;
teflcatThreads: 6
Posts: 1,076
Joined: May 29, 11 ♂ 		 Jul 23, 11, 11:48    #14
i'd go for 10 or more.. money or no money.. there are ALWAYS ways to support your kids in a developed country, So so so so soo many ways. :)

That's called parasitizing on other taxpayers. If you can't afford 'em, don't have 'em.
pawianThreads: 90
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Joined: May 30, 08  Pictures: 2 ♂ 		 Jul 24, 11, 00:11    #15
That's called parasitizing on other taxpayers. If you can't afford 'em, don't have 'em.



Nope. Other taxpayers should be grateful.
rychlikThreads: 51
Posts: 446
Joined: Aug 6, 08 ♂ 		 Jul 24, 11, 03:32    #16
This freedom to move anywhere in Europe will hurt the country. Maybe this was an EU trick- to weaken the country?
rozumiemnicThreads: 4
Posts: 1,020
Joined: Nov 16, 09 ♀ 		 Jul 24, 11, 03:36    #17
This freedom to move anywhere in Europe will hurt the country. Maybe this was an EU trick- to weaken the country?

oh right and what about the millions given in eU aid in the 80s?? Was that also an evil trick?
rychlikThreads: 51
Posts: 446
Joined: Aug 6, 08 ♂ 		 Jul 24, 11, 07:36    #18
oh right and what about the millions given in eU aid in the 80s?? Was that also an evil trick?

I am dramatic.
delphiandomineThreads: 42
Posts: 9,954
Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended] 		 Jul 24, 11, 08:22    #19
This freedom to move anywhere in Europe will hurt the country. Maybe this was an EU trick- to weaken the country?


It will hurt? Why?

So many people leaving was actually good for Poland in many respects - it reduced the chronic unemployment situation in the East for a start.
SeanBMThreads: 41
Posts: 8,727
Joined: Mar 10, 08 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 10:28    #20
POLAND HAS LOST 1 MILLION PEOPLE (for other EU countries)

That's a loaded statement, why use the word "lost"?
Most of them probably know where they are.

Anyway cheap flights and improvment of infrastructure makes it easier, now more than ever, to travel down the road (let's face it the E.U. isn't very big).

So many people leaving was actually good for Poland in many respects - it reduced the chronic unemployment situation in the East for a start.

That was going to be my next point.
southernThreads: 116
Posts: 10,955
Joined: May 17, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 10:33    #21
Polands population never officially reached 40 million. I have read the birth rate has gotten slightly better in Poland,
In the 70s there were a lot of children being born. My parents said around 77', 78' it seamed like every other woman was pregnant.


During communism fertility rate was much higher because the system supported women too much.After communism collapsed population declined rapidly in all former eastern Block countries.
milkyThreads: 10
Posts: 1,229
Joined: Oct 26, 09 ♀ 		 Jul 26, 11, 10:35    #22
cheap flights

are becoming a thing of the past
why use the word "lost"

'Gone" would be a better word.
One million is a major understatement.
SeanBMThreads: 41
Posts: 8,727
Joined: Mar 10, 08 ♂ 		Edited by: SeanBM  Jul 26, 11, 10:42    #23
'Gone" would be a better word.

Are you "Gone"? you also emmigrated, care to comment?

One million is a major understatement.

In 2005, I read 2 million had left when Poles where allowed to go to countries like Ireland and England which had a workforce shortage. Since then it has stabalised and driven up wages and lowered unemployment, along with the "lost" Poles sending back billions of Euros to buy a house or plot of land.

cheap flights are a thing of the past

Most cheap airlines still operate out of Poland.
southernThreads: 116
Posts: 10,955
Joined: May 17, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 10:47    #24
Poland's workforce now benefits the UK,Netherlands etc.They get skilled workers without paying for their education.
SeanBMThreads: 41
Posts: 8,727
Joined: Mar 10, 08 ♂ 		Edited by: SeanBM  Jul 26, 11, 10:56    #25
Poland's workforce now benefits the UK,Netherlands etc.They get skilled workers without paying for their education.

Not all are skilled but you do have a point.
I wouldn't totally agree that the E.U. doesn't pay (see above figures), the idea, as I am sure you are aware is to create a level playing field, bringing Poland in line with other, more developed countries.

You are always going to have emigration, it was just shocking for Poland as it was not easy for Poles to emigrate before 2004.

I would like to see the rate of emigration today, rather than dwell on the innitial exodus.

Germany has recently opened her boarders to Poles and there hasn't been much happening, not to the degree the Germans feared.
I have no statistics for this, just from people I have spoken to.
southernThreads: 116
Posts: 10,955
Joined: May 17, 07 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 11:14    #26
Germany has recently opened her boarders to Poles and there hasn't been much happening, not to the degree the Germans feared.


Yes,becauze Germans put as prerequisite for employment knowledge of german language which is hard to qchieve and because they have very inflexible hiring process which does not allow mistakes.
A JThreads: 19
Posts: 4,639
Joined: May 21, 10 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 11:38    #27
They get skilled workers without paying for their education.


Have you any idea how much tax money goes to Poland? Greece? Other EU countries? I think we *are* paying for their education.

;)
al111Threads: 34
Posts: 106
Joined: Sep 2, 09 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 13:58    #28
I wonder what the fuss is all about on this Topic. Poland is a country that has prospered and continues to prosper due to emigration. Thats just the reality here unfortunately, if all those that have emigrated were to come back tomorrow then lord help us all this country will just go down the drain. The numbers are staggering i must say, just have a look at this from the UK and think of what
£3bn does to the Polish economy in return. Wonder how much is sent from Chicago yearly that contributes as well...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2017817/Poles-sending-home-3bn -year--pay-4-5m-week-benefits.html
PalivecThreads: -
Posts: 333
Joined: Apr 22, 11 ♂ 		 Jul 26, 11, 14:13    #29
Yes,becauze Germans put as prerequisite for employment knowledge of german language which is hard to qchieve and because they have very inflexible hiring process which does not allow mistakes.


Many Poles speak a pretty good German, moreover German isn't so important in better jobs. No, the real reason is that the wages in Germany aren't high enough. They stagnated for more than 10 years now, and there isn't even a wage floor. Unskilled Poles can either work for 5€/h in Germany or 8-10€/h in France/Holland or Austria.
milkyThreads: 10
Posts: 1,229
Joined: Oct 26, 09 ♀ 		 Jul 26, 11, 15:01    #30
Thats just the reality here unfortunately, if all those that have emigrated were to come back tomorrow then lord help us all this country will just go down the drain.

This is very true. It would be back to square one.


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