Poland's trump card, the most famous Pole alive (L. Walesa)

AdamKadmon

Mar 14, 10, 23:33 #1

Maybe a bit odd to ask, but I would like to know, how Lech Wałęsa was and is viewed in UK and other English speaking countries?

Lech Wałęsa in a BBC documentary - The Poles are Coming

But there was possibly one last trump card - the most famous Pole alive. A translator warned us he could be… unpredictable.

- He can be very nice, but be ready for some… er… not necessarily nice receptions.
- Shall I bring some flowers?

- And sure enough, when I did meet the president of ‘Solidarity’, former president of the country, and Nobel Prize winner Lech Wałęsa…

- Mr. President it’s an honour to meet you. Thank you for gracing us this morning.
- Kiepskie pytanie. Następne. (Lousy question. Next question please.)
- OK, very good… well, I’ve been warmed.
- It wasn’t really bed question… but, you know…
- Would you like to appeal to any of the Poles, and there are so many, who’ve come to
Britain, to come back to Gdańsk?
- Gdybym teraz to powiedział… (If I’d said like that now, I would just be booed)
- Why would you be booed?
- No dlatego, że… (People expected us to sort out the country more quickly, to make changes, which would make Poland better off, but this hasn’t happened…

wildroverThreads: 180 Posts: 8,143 Joined: Jun 7, 07 ♂	Mar 14, 10, 23:47 #2
Well speaking personally i thought he was a great man..a hero...and i think most British people respected him for what he did... We didn,t know or care much about how he performed as a president , but before this he was certainly thought of as a great man...

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 06:25 #3
Poland's trump card, the most famous Pole alive (L. Walesa) - what do you think? just tell me what is Walesa`s position on Tusk`s Kosovo recognition and i would tell you how much is Walesa really worth and what Poland can expect from him

AdamKadmon	Mar 16, 10, 09:18 #4
Crow Nobody knows that, because Wałęsa never talked about Kosovo. My guess is that he may not know what Kosovo is.

♂

Edited by: Crow Mar 16, 10, 15:30 #5

AdamKadmon:

Nobody knows that, because Wałęsa never talked about Kosovo.

true? Never?

Then, he is wise. He is aware of importance of that question for international relations, for the Serbs and that way for Poles. So, he won`t lure himself easely in discussion on that matter. No doubts that he knows history and knows a lot of about Serbs, about Balkan, about.... If he didn`t support Tusk on Kosovo then, Tusk is already pollitical oblivion. Probably, Polish inteligentsia keeping some cards for the last moment and Walesa could be that card or aware that card must exist and must be played, sooner or later.

No doubt, if Walesa didn`t publicly support Kosovo separation (recognition by Tusk), Walesa most probably support Serbs, meaning... Walesa probably belong to progressive Polish inteligentsia that hold to Polish national and specific interests.

♂

Mar 16, 10, 15:36 #6

Crow:

importance of that question for international relations, for the Serbs and that way for Poles.

Kosovo is of virtually no importance for Europe: we have all accepted that it is an independent nation just as it should be. And we all know what while there is a proper army there, Serbs will never dare to return to their murdering and raping habits there.

Crow:

Walesa most probably support Serbs,

Only fellow rapists and murders support you: Walesa is neither.

♂

Edited by: Crow Mar 16, 10, 15:48 #7

Harry:

Kosovo is of virtually no importance for Europe: we have all accepted that it is an independent nation just as it should be. And we all know what while there is a proper army there, Serbs will never dare to return to their murdering and raping habits there.

its all pure anglo-muja-germano propaganda against Serbs. Polish journalists and parliament investigated and concluded that there were no reasons for military intervention against Serbs so, i don`t need further explanations here.

Kosovo is important because justice is important. So, Serbian people and Serbian order would return to Kosovo, after NATO occupators leave region and, as we all know NATO would go. Simple, go

Harry:

Only fellow rapists and murders support you: Walesa is neither.

you have tongue of snake, of sick snake.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 15:53 #8
Crow: Simple, go Well, that's for the Kosovar's to decide me thinks, not you! ;)

♂

Mar 16, 10, 19:34 #9

BB, what if America invaded Germany and swamped your land with Americans, making you the 10% minority in the Vaterland? I bet you wouldn't be talking about giving 'Americaners' (fictitious name) the right to vote, now would you?

Wałęsa? Famous and infamous at the same time. His life has been the subject of much adverse speculation but he has cleared his name 3 times I think. We should look at the great things he did as opposed to the bad things he might have done.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11 Posts: 14,563 Joined: Apr 2, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 19:51 #10
Seanus: BB, what if America invaded Germany and swamped your land with Americans, making you the 10% minority in the Vaterland? I bet you wouldn't be talking about giving 'Americaners' (fictitious name) the right to vote, now would you? German land got "swamped" with Poles, Germans were ethnically cleansed, and no, we don't demand it back now for peace sake.

Think Twice	Mar 16, 10, 19:56 #11
"the most famous Pole alive "....... thats Adam Malysz. AdamKadmon: trump card You mean " the joker " ?

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 19:57 #12
For the sake of peace? Germans were never and still aren't happy with the League of Nations decisions in 1921. If Silesia was fully autonomous, I don't think you'd be too happy with them voting if Poles were voting on German land and interests.

HarryThreads: 59 Posts: 7,996 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 20:18 #13
Seanus: For the sake of peace? Germans were never and still aren't happy with the League of Nations decisions in 1921. If Silesia was fully autonomous, I don't think you'd be too happy with them voting if Poles were voting on German land and interests. He's talking about Stettin, Stolp, Allenstein, Rastenberg, Breslau, Kolberg, Koslin, Swinemunde, etc, etc.

TorqThreads: 65 Posts: 4,023 Joined: Apr 10, 09 MEMBER ♂	Edited by: Torq Mar 16, 10, 20:25 #14
Harry: Stolp There's third generation of Poles being born and raised there at the moment and we haven't seen a German here since 1945 (apart from occasional tourists) so I think we can safely spell the name of the town S-Ł-U-P-S-K. K! S! KSG! KSG-Gryf-Słupsk-OLE! Ahhhh, memories, memories - I feel like I'm 18 again :)

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Edited by: Crow Mar 16, 10, 20:35 #15
Harry: He's talking about Bratwurst Boy: German land got "swamped" with Poles, Germans were ethnically cleansed, complete eastern Germany (probably more then that) is nothing but germanized Slavic ethos and for the sake of peace and because whole so called west is behind you, Slavs tolerate German existence

SeanusThreads: 22 Posts: 30,160 Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 20:38 #16
Wałęsa often talked about the Gdańsk shipyards, not the Danzig ones ;) ;)

♂

Edited by: TheOther Mar 16, 10, 20:39 #17

Torq:

There's third generation of Poles being born and raised there

Well, I always see people on PF moaning and b*tching about the partitions, which they call 'occupation'. Wasn't the German Empire partioned after WW2, too? ;)

Crow:

Slavs tolerate German existence

Especially Slavs like you, right?

Seanus:

Wałęsa often talked about the Gdańsk shipyards, not the Danzig ones

He couldn't speak German, that's the reason why... ;)

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Torq Mar 16, 10, 20:46 #18

TheOther:

Wasn't the German Empire partioned after WW2, too? ;)

Partitioned? Naaah - they just gave us back some lands that were rightfully ours ;)
And if they were partitioned that was for a good reason too! ;)

Anyway - if Germany ever has its entire territory partitioned between Poland, France
and... I don't know - Denmark and will stay under the occupation for 123 years, then
they can start moaning ;)

CrowThreads: 365 Posts: 7,192 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 20:47 #19
TheOther: Wasn't the German Empire partioned after WW2, too? ;) aren`t Lusatia still under German occupation?

HarryThreads: 59 Posts: 7,996 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 20:50 #20
Torq: There's third generation of Poles being born and raised there at the moment and we haven't seen a German here since 1945 (apart from occasional tourists) so I think we can safely spell the name of the town S-Ł-U-P-S-K. Fourth generation from what I see when I'm up there. Torq: K! S! KSG! KSG-Gryf-Słupsk-OLE! Prefer Czarni myself.

TheOtherThreads: 4 Posts: 1,440 Joined: Jul 13, 09 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 20:51 #21
Torq: ...will stay under the occupation for 123 years then they can start moaning Let's see: France annexed Elsass-Lothringen in 1918 ... 92 years Denmark annexed part of Schleswig-Holstein in 1918 ... 92 years Poland was reestablished in 1918 ... 92 years. Okay, you've got 30 more years before the Germans are eligible to do something about the partitions... :)

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Torq Mar 16, 10, 21:00 #22

Harry:

Fourth generation from what I see when I'm up there.

Ha - so there!

Let me know when you're in Ustka/Słupsk area next time, Harry, so we can
meet for a pint or two (I promise not to punch you in the face even if you
deserve it ;)).

Harry:

Prefer Czarni myself.

No such club in Słupsk ;)

TheOther:

you've got 30 more years before the Germans are eligible to do
something about the partitions

...before they are eligible to moan about partitions! ;)

AdamKadmon	Mar 16, 10, 21:01 #23
TheOther Germans are eligible to do something. TheOther come to Poland and become a true Pole.

TheOtherThreads: 4 Posts: 1,440 Joined: Jul 13, 09 ♂	Mar 16, 10, 21:08 #24
Torq: before they are eligible to moan about partitions LOL! AdamKadmon: TheOther come to Poland and become a true Pole I've been to Poland and liked it a lot, but no, thanks, I prefer to keep my Aussie passport.

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Poland's trump card, the most famous Pole alive (L. Walesa) - what do you think?