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Polish President Lech Kaczynski and gov officials die in a plane crash in Russia


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Mark33  Apr 10, 10, 09:53    #1
Have you seen the latest news? I wonder if KGB shoot down his plane. Maybe Putin is preparing himself to the invasion of Poland.
king polkacanonThreads: -
Posts: 90
Joined: Apr 5, 10 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:06    #2
Yes,Kaczynski would be a serious obstacle for Putin's invasion.
richasisThreads: 5
Posts: 833
Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:08    #3
Mark33:
Have you seen the latest news? I wonder if KGB shoot down his plane. Maybe Putin is preparing himself to the invasion of Poland.


Surely you jest...
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:12    #4
Let's not embrace wild conspiracy theories here, nobody wants to delve into paranoia. They wouldn't be so stupid as to do sth like that but, then again, I know better than to take the news at first announcement. I just don't believe we should be moving towards a hateful position by assuming that they did it. A Polish reporter on tv is saying that the cloud cover was quite thick but it wasn't so misty or foggy at all.
Mark33  Apr 10, 10, 10:12    #5
In the case of invasion Kaczynski would order full scale couter attack. Tusk can be intimidated. And we are talking about Russians here, let's not forget that.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		Edited by: Seanus  Apr 10, 10, 10:21    #6
Oh, for God's sake man, cut the crap!!! This is NOT the time for frickin paranoia about Russia invading. Please, once and for all, honour those that died and just cut it out!!

Marek, you are a disgrace to your nation!!! Stop flaming and talking about fighting Russia. They would destroy Poland in an instant and who in Poland wants that???? STOP!

CK, in the spirit of Katyń, kindly take that back! If Russia doesn't show remorse for this incident, it will be seen in a very bad light. I hope it doesn't turn out to be another international setup. Look at the history of international affairs and you see 'remarkable' coincidences. Let's just hope that this isn't one of them! And don't be mocking my nation either. Fly over Scotland one more time and you'll find that you'll be a few MIGs short.
jonniThreads: 26
Posts: 4,189
Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:24    #7
Seanus:
NOT the time for frickin paranoia about Russia invading.


As far as I know the black box hasn't been retrieved yet - it's a bit early for conspiracy theories though no doubt they'll appear soon.
nanaThreads: -
Posts: 48
Joined: Sep 7, 09 ♀ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:26    #8
Firstly KGB DOESN'T EXIST! for many years. now is FSB
Secondly, yes I believe it was a russian job. Presidental planes dont just crash, do they?
In my opinion is strange that FSB torn any news and photos done by journalists and witnesses of crash. I think Poles should KNOW
TorqThreads: 65
Posts: 4,023
Joined: Apr 10, 09 Gold Member MEMBER ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:32    #9
Seanus:
A Polish reporter on tv is saying that the cloud cover was quite thick but it wasn't so misty or foggy at all.


There was no fog there at the moment of the crash according to the journalist.
Everything concerning the crash MUST be investigated THOROUGHLY - and if
Russians will try to make the investigation difficult for us in any way - they will
give themselves out.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		Edited by: Seanus  Apr 10, 10, 10:35    #10
Well, he was attacked in Georgia. They are beginning to doubt the account on TVP Info.

Let's start the fullest investigation now and not 70 years later. This is one of the biggest mistakes of history, to wait and miss chances. Act now and don't let gossip linger!

Conspiracies will fly. My wife thinks Tusk may have had a hand in it. He hated Lech and he was always vetoed by him. They had a very uneasy relationship. Tusk is a NWO puppet and tows the EU/NATO line.
DarunThreads: 1
Posts: 71
Joined: Oct 24, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:35    #11
My deapest condoleances to Poland!
richasisThreads: 5
Posts: 833
Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:39    #12
nana:
I believe it was a russian job


or a sloppy mossad job.
krakowiakThreads: 4
Posts: 131
Joined: Jul 30, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:39    #13
What advantage would Russia have from such an act?

- The traditionally superstitious people of Russia will take it as a sign of God, that Kaczynski was not granted to show up in Katyn. They will even more than now unite against the Polish point of view of Russian-Polish relations.

Of course nobody would suspect the Russians to do something as "stupid" as this, but if they did it and if they managed to leave no sign behind.... well the world will rather say "of course they didnt do something as stupid, it was an accident ... maybe even .... a sign of god!?!"

My suspicion: They might have done it and we should pull up our military budget! Just in case!
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:43    #14
Krakowiak, you will never match Russia militarily so I wouldn't speak of it. Wow, 132 probably dead. Ouch! RIP!
TorqThreads: 65
Posts: 4,023
Joined: Apr 10, 09 Gold Member MEMBER ♂ 		Edited by: Torq  Apr 10, 10, 10:47    #15
Seanus:
you will never match Russia militarily so I wouldn't speak of it.


Remind me - how long did it take Russia to finally defeat tiny Chechenya?

But I don't wish to discuss military matters at the moment - the more important news
is that the black boxes are still not found. If it isn't found quickly... and if there is even
a shadow of the doubt as to the authenticity of the black box found by Russians (if it is
found) then it will bring Polish-Russian relations back to 17 IX 1939.
CrowThreads: 365
Posts: 7,192
Joined: Feb 14, 07 Pictures: 1 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:54    #16
my condolences to Poland

i can`t believe this. Latest moves of Polish president Kaczynski presented him as real Serbian friend. Death of Kaczynski is great loss for Slavic south. What a pity. Now, that traitor Tusk who forced recognition of Kosovo and betrayal of Racowie (Serbians) has no real opponent on Polish political scene

Did Russians killed Polish president?

i seriously doubt this. Russians are last who could seek for his death. On the contrary, Kaczynski presented Polish politician that had identical approach to Kosovo situation as main protagonists of Russian politics.

Then, all happened in Russia. Why would Russia kill Kaczynski in Russia?? If they wanted to kill him, they could initiate (for example) his heard attack in Kaczynski`s own house. when great power wants that you died you simple died. Realy no need to blame Russia on this sad event. Actually, this is great humiliation for Russia, attack on Polish-Russian relations in crucial moment and if you want attack on complete Slavic world- because we all know that, without Polish-Russian agreement as soon as possible, there is no Slavic world.

Who ever killed Kaczynski, he directly provoked Russia.

Who could kill Kaczynski, who could profit from it, who could lose in case that Poles and Russian agree on something/anything?

Saudi Arabia? NATO? EU? Shiftars (Albanians)? Israel? Turkey? France? Britain? Its hard to say. It could be any of them. It could be their united action against Slavic civilization
SzenkUK88Threads: 1
Posts: 15
Joined: Mar 10, 10 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 10:55    #17
It's funny how right wing politicians in Europe are slowly being killed off.

First it was Pim Fortuyn, now it's Lech Kaczynski.

These are dark times for nationalists all over Europe.
richasisThreads: 5
Posts: 833
Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:02    #18
jonni:
it's a bit early for conspiracy theories though no doubt they'll appear soon.


But probably not before your euphoria wears off.
AdamUKThreads: 9
Posts: 35
Joined: Aug 6, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:10    #19
Well... Lets see what the evidence shows before jumping to conclusions

However... this is very shcoking and bad news

and im wondering,

How will Poland be governed now?
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:13    #20
That's a horrible comment, CK! I feel that it was just a failure of the plane but Smoleńsk is conveniently rather rural and covered. Pilots very seldom make such errors and I doubt that the wing behaved in the way that they said it did.
Russian  Apr 10, 10, 11:14    #21
Dear friends, Polish President's plane crashed because of fog and decision not to land in Minsk or Moscow. There were 4 attempts to land in fog and the fourth attempt was fatal.
My deep condolences to all Polish people. Please, let's stop all those political hatred between our peoples.
TorqThreads: 65
Posts: 4,023
Joined: Apr 10, 09 Gold Member MEMBER ♂ 		Edited by: Torq  Apr 10, 10, 11:17    #22
Russian:
Dear friends, Polish President's plane crashed because of fog and decision not to land in Minsk or Moscow. There were 4 attempts to land in fog and the fourth attempt was fatal.


Hopefully, the independent investigation will confirm that. Hopefully, Russian side will
allow us to conduct the investigation without obstacles - as for now, it is too early
for any conclusions.
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:17    #23
I agree, Russian. I sincerely hope that the Russian authorities conduct a thorough investigation ASAP and that the plane fault is confirmed. Those bloody pesky journalists are very low too. All smiles because they get a huge story. Sick basta*ds!!
frdThreads: 8
Posts: 1,956
Joined: Feb 3, 09 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:19    #24
Those Tu's were brought to the public eye on numerous occasions.. each gov swept buying them under the carpet to avoid supposed public critique of them spending tax money on luxuries. It seems a real blow was needed.. and there we go. If it was a good modern plane thing could have been different - the major damage the plane received has torn it apart.
peterwegThreads: 30
Posts: 1,445
Joined: Feb 16, 07 ♂ 		Edited by: peterweg  Apr 10, 10, 11:21    #25
Pilots very seldom make such errors and I doubt that the wing behaved in the way that they said it did.
Seanus:
Pilots very seldom make such errors and I doubt that the wing behaved in the way that they said it did.



Pilots make many many mistakes and landing in fog is one of them. TU154 is dangerous aircraft as well, although thats relative.

Why did they have a presidential plane? even thats an expense too far for the UK
SeanusThreads: 22
Posts: 30,160
Joined: Dec 25, 07 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:22    #26
I said "such errors", peterweg. It's usually bread and butter for them and pilots have often averted major disasters through their competence.
CrowThreads: 365
Posts: 7,192
Joined: Feb 14, 07 Pictures: 1 ♂ 		Edited by: Crow  Apr 10, 10, 11:28    #27
Russian:
Dear friends, Polish President's plane crashed because of fog and decision not to land in Minsk or Moscow. There were 4 attempts to land in fog and the fourth attempt was fatal.

so, you say that Russia is that incompetent, stupid and idiotic country that can`t provide regular plane to representatives of foreign state, who coming as guests to Russia??? If it is the case then Russia isn`t world power but Russia is world`s greatest sh**.

BUT, we all know that its not the case. It is obvious that somebody decided to humiliate and provoke Russia. Its on Russia to say who is responsible for death of Polish president and not to hide behind comments such is ``plane crashed because of fog``. Its the question of Russian credibility as world power. Russia was responsible for security of Kaczynski.

i hope that Russia can manage to answer on this challenge, or i would conclude that Russia afraid to point with her finger at the those who are responsible. Somebody sabotaged that plane and Russia must say who was that
mafketisThreads: 15
Posts: 1,830
Joined: Mar 31, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:34    #28
AdamUK:
How will Poland be governed now?


Probably elections soon. And Poles don't fall into chaos easily, they're experts at carrying on in unsure situations.

Technically, the president isn't that powerful a position and most on board were not in active governing positions since this was a PiS mission and PiS is in the opposition at present. It's a horrible tragedy, but not any kind of 'decapitation'.....

My main concern was : why so many military leaders on one plane?
daniel04ever  Apr 10, 10, 11:40    #29
My good friends....First of all condoleances for polish people....Im just a romanian who watch thise bad news with doubt regardind plane accident...I don't belive the presidential aircraft just crash just like that...It is more things hiden behind this ''accident''...Hope the truth will come out,and if someone invold then may god punish them...
delphiandomineThreads: 40
Posts: 9,587
Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ 		 Apr 10, 10, 11:45    #30
mafketis:
My main concern was : why so many military leaders on one plane?


It appears to be a monumental failing - not only with the leaders on the plane, but also the pilot possibly contradicting ATC orders as well.

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