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Warsaw airport to close in September

posts: 25

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 14, 10, 16:00 #1

Idiotic, even by the standards of a state-owned Polish company!

Warsaw Frederic Chopin Airport will be closed for three weekends in September, though media claim that the airport’s authorities have not informed airlines or travel agencies about the plan.

Poland’s main international airport will be closed due to renovation of runways, scheduled for September. Unfortunately, the Polish Airports State Enterprise (PLL), the owner of Warsaw airport, has not officially informed airlines or travel agencies about its plans, which may cause cancellations and delays of flights and bring a serious loss to tour operators.

“It’s absurd to close the biggest airport in the country in high season,” says Rafal Orlowski from Yes Airways, which already scheduled flights for the September weekends. “There are loads of tourists who want to go on holiday in September and they usually choose weekends as a departure date,” confirms Piotr Henicz from Itaka travel agency.

The airport authorities argue that they informed about the closure at a conference in Vancouver and placed notes in specialist magazines. “In September 2009, the information was put in the Aeronautical Information Publication (AIP)’s data base, which provides airlines with news about international airports,” says Kamil Wnuk from PPL.

http://www.thenews.pl/business/artykul123635_warsaw-airport-to-close-i n-september--.html

JucheThreads: 13 Posts: 356 Joined: Feb 17, 09 ♂	Jan 14, 10, 16:17 #2
what do you expect, its Poland. when has this place ever been synonymous with sound planning? If its efficiency you want, go to Switzerland or Japan. On a similar note, just wait till the months before Euro 2012. Mayhem and hilarity will ensue.

przelotemThreads: - Posts: 20 Joined: Dec 18, 09 ♀	Jan 14, 10, 16:19 #3
interesting... I wonder is it possible, that the other pl airport take over some of the flights.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jan 14, 10, 18:49 #4
Juche: If its efficiency you want, go to Switzerland or Japan. If only we could get the Germans come to help us get organized. This closure should coincide nicely with the sale of LOT. Lufthansa?

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Jan 14, 10, 19:25 #5

Back to the thread, the PPL claims they should renovate the junction of runways, and as it is the junction, there's no other way to carry on than shutting the airport. I wonder why it is scheduled for September as this is the highest season with even more air traffic than in July or August. It might well be in November when the season is low.

What would be interesting to know is how the problem of renovating the junction of runways is solved in other one-airport towns where there's no possibility to re-direct flights to another airport in the same town.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jan 14, 10, 19:37 #6
Ziemowit: I wonder why it is scheduled for September In July and August we are all at Costa sel Sol; that's no time to work.

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Edited by: convex Jan 14, 10, 19:38 #7
Ziemowit: I wonder why it is scheduled for September as this is the highest season with even more air traffic than in July or August. It might well be in November when the season is low. September is the summer month with the least movements. Is it good to lay concrete when it's cold, maybe that has something to do with it?

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 14, 10, 20:57 #8

Solution? How about building at least one parallel runway? That would prevent the airport from needing to shut for three weeks and provide a valuable extra resource for the airport. Alternatively they could do the runways one at a time: not idea from a flying point of view but better than shutting the airport. Or they could wait until the new airport at Modlin is ready and use that one: it is 25km from the Warsaw, a lot closer than the nearest other airport to divert flights to (i.e. Katowice). Any one of those would be cheaper than the cost closing the airport will have. But clearly you have no idea at all what those costs will be: either that you are just being a complete c0ck because a foreigner dared to say something less than flattering about something Polish.

ZiemowitThreads: 10 Posts: 1,063 Joined: May 8, 09 ♂	Jan 14, 10, 21:19 #9
Harry: Alternatively they could do the runways one at a time: You've ignored what I explained: it's the renovation of the junction of the two existing runways.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Jan 14, 10, 21:28 #10
Harry: That would prevent the airport from needing to shut for three weeks Three weekends, not that that makes my day, as I take vacations in September. This is not good news. But who flies on weekends?

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Edited by: convex Jan 14, 10, 21:33 #11

Harry:

The airport will be closed for a total of 6 non consecutive days (sat and sun). They are fixing the slab of concrete where the two runways intersect. Building a parallel runway would be ridiculously expensive and not worth it. Warsaw sees less traffic than Birmingham, Alicante, Malaga, and those airports don't even have crosswind runways.

LOT will have to cancel some (weekend) flights, and the tourist bombers won't be able to fly there for 6 days in September. Modlin won't be finished for a while to come.

dnzThreads: 25 Posts: 804 Joined: Dec 2, 07 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 00:36 #12
This country really is the epitome of incompetence, its just laughable.

polishcanuckThreads: 10 Posts: 583 Joined: Feb 11, 07 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 01:46 #13
dnz: This country really is the epitome of incompetence, its just laughable. I'm glad to hear that you enjoy living in Poland.

♂ [Suspended]

Jan 15, 10, 02:05 #14

convex:

Is it good to lay concrete when it's cold, maybe that has something to do with it?

Could very well be the reason. I've had a quick look on Google and it suggests that there are quite a few problems associated with concrete laying in cold weather - problems that might not be a big deal in your new driveway, but you don't want to have *any* problems with runways. There's also the point that if they had a repeat of the A2 saga with the runways, people would absolutely slaughter them - so it makes sense to get the job done in the proper conditions rather than trying to do it in the cold. It may also be that doing the job in the cold would mean having to close the airport for longer.

Aviation safety regulators are paranoid and over sensitive about everything - they have to be, and it wouldn't surprise me if they were told that could only lay concrete in the summer months. Most ordinary people don't understand how detailed and proscribed aviation actually is.

jonniThreads: 26 Posts: 4,181 Joined: Nov 27, 07 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 02:11 #15
delphiandomine: there are quite a few problems associated with concrete laying in cold weather About five years ago a half finished office block in Warsaw collapsed for that reason. The concrete was cast on site when the temperature was around zero. When spring came, the whole construction project fell down like a pack of cards.

JucheThreads: 13 Posts: 356 Joined: Feb 17, 09 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 08:20 #16
polishcanuck: I'm glad to hear that you enjoy living in Poland. call it a love-hate relationship

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 10:03 #17
dnz: This country really is the epitome of incompetence, its just laughable. Why do you say that? What's incompetent about closing a runway to perform needed maintenance on the slowest weekends when it is still safe to do so?

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Jan 15, 10, 13:22 #18

Harry:

Idiotic, even by the standards of a state-owned Polish company!

what idiotic? Poland need time. That`s all. There are real problems

Do you understand that Poland suffered 50 years under communist rule? Every segment of society was affected by it. Then, look how many young intellectuals and work capable people go out of Poland in other EU countries. EU is greedy monster without limitations and wants to take best from Poland for a little amount of money.

Poland giving more then Poland receiveing from EU and,... we see consequences.

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Edited by: dnz Jan 15, 10, 13:36 #19

convex:

Why do you say that? What's incompetent about closing a runway to perform needed maintenance on the slowest weekends when it is still safe to do so?

Nothings incompetent about closing the runway when it needs to be repaired, They should have probably told the airlines who use the runway that it is being closed to avoid any problems.

They have telephones and the internet in Poland why is communication such a big deal? If communication was utilised here then there wouldn't be a string of engineering fuc k ups ie the train tunnel which isn't big enough to run a train through, the motorway which the 2 halves miss each other by miles etc. I know Poland is still developing its infra structure but it seems to be undertaken by corrupt and mindless officials who don't have a clue. Add to that bone idle workers with the don't give a damn attitude which is so profound in Polish culture and cases like this just keep happening.

That said once they have repaired the runway they will probably make such a hash of it they will have to close it again 3 weeks later to replace the lot in true polish style.

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Jan 15, 10, 13:47 #20

dnz:

Nothings incompetent about closing the runway when it needs to be repaired, They should have probably told the airlines who use the runway that it is being closed to avoid any problems.

Completely agreed...even though it is clearly in the AIP, that's not how to tell your customers..

That part goes back to what I was arguing in another thread with regards to quality management (or lack thereof). Baby steps, baby steps. Maybe another 20 years...maybe another 50...

dnzThreads: 25 Posts: 804 Joined: Dec 2, 07 ♂	Jan 15, 10, 14:44 #21
convex: another 20 years...maybe another 50... By which time the oil will have run out and there won't be any planes to use these runways or cars to use these newly built roads.

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Jan 15, 10, 14:58 #22

dnz:

By which time the oil will have run out and there won't be any planes to use these runways or cars to use these newly built roads.

No one is really worried about oil running out, it's just a question of when other technologies become viable price wise. Swiftfuel is looking really nice as a replacement for Avgas, their production costs are dropping like mad. Biofuel is pretty much a 1:1 replacement for JetA... or going the dirty route, we still have massive amounts of coal just waiting to be liquefied...

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Jan 15, 10, 20:38 #23

Harry:

How about building at least one parallel runway?

Are there any investor willing to provide funds ? I didn't hear about any. Or are you saying that huge amount of our tax money should be spent, so in the future we can avoid such horrible incidents as closing down the airport for 6 days once a decade ? Wow, you're such a brainer ! Run Forrest, run ! Your vast wisdom is chasing you.

Harry:

Alternatively they could do the runways one at a time: not idea from a flying point of view but better than shutting the airport. Or they could wait until the new airport at Modlin is ready and use that one: it is 25km from the Warsaw, a lot closer than the nearest other airport to divert flights to (i.e. Katowice).

Wow, so apart from writing some texts about restaurants, you are also a world class engineer specialized in runways pavement ! You must be If you know better how nad when such things should be done.

Harry:

Any one of those would be cheaper than the cost closing the airport will have. But clearly you have no idea at all what those costs will be

You are right, I've got no idea about the costs. Could you then enlighten me instead of over exploiting again the pathetic "you don't like It because It makes Poland look bad" stuff ? I've got no idea, simply see an article where people responsible for that issue say there is no better solution and people from the travel industry criticize It (no comments from independent experts) so unlike you, I'm not so sure that the latter must be right. If you are, then I think we will soon hear much more detailed alternatives, not only some guesses you have presented so far.

Or maybe you simply have no idea about this issue and posted It to spoil the air around as that seems to be the only entertainment in your little, silly life ? Which one is that, Harry ?

JucheThreads: 13 Posts: 356 Joined: Feb 17, 09 ♂	Jan 16, 10, 12:36 #24
Crow: Do you understand that Poland suffered 50 years under communist rule? Same with Czech and Hungary, but they have highways and generally much better infrastructure. That same old "but you dont understand, it was the communists" excuse is starting not to wash.

CrowThreads: 367 Posts: 7,316 Joined: Feb 14, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 16, 10, 12:47 #25
Warsaw airport to close in September forget EU. Call for Serbian experts Serbian airports were operative immediately just after NATO bombing in 1999

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