What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others?

I do wish you would make your mind up about this. Earlier in the thread you were most insistant that those Poles were fighting to save Britain. Now you agree with us and admit that they were fighting for a free Poland.


Not quite dear lady. The university I went to was owned and run by Catholic nuns. Leftist it was not.


Well done for writing about beliefs and opinions. Must be a lot easier for you to write about them than about facts. Facts like: Poles were invited to the London victory parade; free Poles were invited to the London victory parade; the RAF did bomb Germany in September 1939. Facts which you have lied about.
Keep giving us the benefit of your wise opinions. I'll keep countering your lies with facts.


It's because some Poles (and wannabe Poles) are not interested in facts or in what really happened; they are only interested in pushing their self-serving myths and will attack, lie to and attempt to offend anybody who responds with cold hard facts.

Now you agree with us and admit that they were fighting for a free Poland.[/quote]


Lets see if France and Britain had responded to Poland when they were attacked, would it have also been France and Britain that would be protecting their own? Why did they both declare war on Nazi's, for Poland or themselves?

Okay....I still need a clarification!

It's May 1945, the german forces surrendered...Americans and Russians did just had a happy party at the Elbe..so what now?
Not WHAT GB should have done but ideas HOW they should have done it please!
You are now the polish commander providing the allied command in the HQ with some viable plan how to free Poland from the coming soviet occupation:

Start here:
(But please don't do a Lukasz on us with throwing some misty phrases into the discussion - that is helping nobody)

1.)....

That you lost or that we expected you to lose?



It was hardly a malicious comment. Poland's inability to maintain its borders is an obvious subject for humour, even amongst Poles I bet.

If it isnt then it should be.



Well his arguments were more convincing and largely unanswered with anything credible. I learnt something new from his posts but nothing from the respondents. Then again maybe I'm also a leftist, or a Jew or some such other label that will allow my opinions to be dismissed readily.

How about the Polish Air Force under British command. Those were free Poles. They were invited. Your own link tells you that.



If they had repsonded? They did respond. You just don't like the response.
Why did Britain declare war on Germany? Well, perhaps we can find a clue in the announcement of Chamberlain about the declaration of war:

Clear enough for you Yank?

Remind me: why did your country, the US of A, declare war against Germany? To protect Poland or to protect itself?

Do you laugh and joke about Holocaust or just Polish trying to defend borders. I am sure you have viewed the statistics as far as troops & equipment Poland was up against. Sorry but that just cold and not funny at all.



URL


Free my but. They knew of "Soviet" takeover and were trying to find a way to save Poland.

I doubt the Poles of that time acknowledged this themselves or else their behaviour against Germany might not have been so self assured...

So lets see those cold hard facts.
Britain issued an insulting invitation for "London Poles" - last minute, under pressure and exclusively only to some of them. Nobody with self-respect would accept. It would be a dishonor to attend under such circumstances. There is definitely something wrong with your moral compass if you can’t see that.

In your opinion Britain fulfilled their obligation coming from military alliance with Poland by declaring war on Germany and performing 2-3 insignificant air bombings on German's back. If you were to tell me that Britain simply didn’t have planes able to reach even Berlin not to mention further east at that time I would buy that. But you didn't. So I'm still convinced that Britain let us bleed to death while happy that it was us not you.

And stop saying liar in every comment: it's boring and ineffective.



Yeah, funny that later on you Brits had such hard time defending your borders. And you were further away, on the island, with bigger military power and the enemy was somehow tired by then. THAT is humorous.

Poland did admit they could not do this without support. Not to Germany but this was spoken openly when meetings took place.



URL

Comedy is merely tragedy happening to someone else.

By your logic nothing historic is a suitable subject for humour. Or is it just Polish history that should be exempt?

How do you invade Poland?

You march in backwards and tell them you are leaving.



Do you know how Wikipedia is made and maintained?

Brave computer warrior LOL

yes, I was being lazy today and felt ok

if this is wrong and you sent "overland" to Poland, ???



Funny same ones who beat Russia (good chance all of Europe was saved) are now attacked by both "Soviet's" and "Nazi's" , betrayed by the ones that said they would help and we are the joke? I guess if you can make jokes about this then it's open to make fun of "Genocide".

If the enemy was tired it certainly wasnt from fighting Poland.

It was still hard but we managed it and as a result we were able to enjoy post war freedom and prosperity. It was pretty sweet, shame you missed it.



Just carrying on the fighting traditions of my forefathers, and as your taking a whipping from a foreigner so are you in your own way. :)

The moral of the story is that if you want your freedom, you have to fight for it.

Like Britian did.

If you let another country walk all over you, like Poland did twice in the last centruy, you really have no one to blame but yourselves.

To try and divert this blame only adds insult to injury of a meaningless national pride.

Poland was there and helped you retain your freedom. You see unlike others, Poland kept their word.

... like leaving your brothers to die on the front?



Some Brits are so clueless is hysterical.
You can be brave all you want if somebody stabs you in the back, boy.

Without USA you would be speaking German today.

the USSR... and you too...

And winning wars. Its a good habit to get into and we can wholeheartedly recommend it.
What you fellas dont seem to understand is the bigger picture. Poland was one brief phase of what promised to be a long arduous process of attrition. Britain understood this. We knew that the longer things went on the better our chances. Charging into Poland in 1939 like the cavalry at Little Big Horn would have ended in glorious failure. Something Poles seem to regard as normal but we however do not.

Thats not actually a problem for me

But as it turns out, youre speaking my language

Funny old world, isnt it

fool

-edit-

Obviously I meant Polish fool

Britain must be so proud of you, son. It's better that you stop embarrassing yourself and your country. Ask Harry to recommend you some reading material on British history. You are lacking big time.


So why did you bother fighting Germans for so long and hard?

Are you even sure what are you saying?


I'm still speaking Polish, thank you very much. English is my second language.


Lacking better arguments already, little boy?

Im much to young to have had anything to do with WII

Do you actually think before you say things?



Very sensible of you, given that your first is largely useless

I forgot I was typing to a man that still believes in Queens and fairy tales, opps the truth is out. Do I make fun of your country?


See some things are ok to make jokes about.

We've lost a few, but when it mattered.....well, modesty forbids me from finishing the sentence.

Do you?


And knowing best would annoy you obviously.LOL


Tell that to people even on this forum who are trying hard to learn.

What no funny joke about them?

What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others?

I would not hope for much from him. Some recycled stuff at best.

Thus starting a war with the industrial superpower of Europe.



Er... no, they would have been starting it.



Have you ever heard the phrase 'Ask a stupid question...'

Bzib and Celinski.

A serious question. Have you ever studied history? I mean at a proper (degree) level? Rather than listening to stories whilst sitting on grandpa's knee.

It is rather sad, I would hope after all this time others could at the least reccognize the price paid by Poland's people. What the Polish people did for others, and the strength of our people. Look how sensitive people can be when it comes to the "Holocaust" and yet feel it's acceptable to make jokes about the forgotten Polish. Tonight is, "Scream Bloody Murder".


URL

You can hardly call 1933 Germany an industrial superpower...
If France and Englands presidents would have been blessed with half the balls and foresight of Pilsudski, they would have invaded Germany and disbanded the Nazi party, perhaps stage an assassination of Hitler and some of his brass, and supported the re-creation of a centrist-socialist govermnent, as well as provide financial assistance to the country while it got up on its own two feet.
The Nazi popular vote was still quite low at the time, and the later numbers became manipulated and distorted. There isn't any doubt that the majority of Germans were still leaning towards a socialist govermnent in 1932-33.There were already signs of what was to come if one was to look closely, but the allies were too busy later with their policy of appeasement to bother. Pilsudski's dies, and the rest is history.

I should read, Nazi's and Soviet's attacked Poland, remember?

Who?



You never had a war or struggle for others. I believe this point has been established.



Poland indeed paid a heavy price but it was a price they paid for no one but themselves. They went to war for no one but themselves.

In short, they did fuk all for anyone.

... and you've donated to this forum, why?
Why do you even post here, tosser?

Erm...and what about the Germans???



Poles really seem to rule the realms of misty, glorious but empty phrases...but when you ask for clarification and hard facts then...

Rightio.



That is generally how foreign policy works. I simply love this notion that the Poles fought for Britain. I would find it quite funny if so many deluded tw*ts didn't actually believe it.

Bratwurst, are you in denial that the majority of Germans were still centrist-socialist at this time? The numbers after Hitler combines chancellor-president offices in 1933, are distorted. In fact, I even doubt Hitler had popular vote until 1934 or 1935. Communist party still held a lot of seats until Hitler outlawed them, and there were many powerful monarchists in the backdrop too.

At least one third was firmly in the NSDAP camp and you can BET that these numbers would have doubled, tripled and grown even more the moment foreign invaders made Hitler a martyr murdered fighting for german freedom and independence...

Boy...every politician who would want have one inkling of acceptance would need to come from the armed resistance from the underground during the guerilla war which would undoubtly follow with hot contacts between them and Moskau.
Stalin surely knowing a distracted Poland would be easy prey...

PS: And where from should the money come to "help Germany onto her feet"??? From Poland???

PPS: wait...you didn't mention Poland...only France and GB...sorry....my fault...again France and GB should get Polands nuts out of the fire....again...as it wasn't GB or France so much where Hitler had laid his eyes on...

Look, I was in partial agreement with you guys over Poland caring more for a free Poland, than anything else, and in fact, this is a normal sentiment, is it not?

But to deny that they did not at least help along the wars final outcome and the well-being of the allies (the latter being involuntary, in some cases) is quite an ignorant affirmation. Polish free forces were one of the largest, and they fought everywhere, from Italy to the Netherlands, to North Africa, and yes, FOR THEIR OWN country.
The Polish armed forces in the west fought under the British command and numbered 195,000 in March 1944 and 165,000 at the end of that year, including about 20,000 personnel in the Polish Air Force and 3,000 in the Polish Navy.

England may have had the industry to match Germany later in the war, but they surely did not have the man power to man their machines.

You would be either a liar, or mentally challenged to state that Poland did 'fuk all for anyone.'
I could direct you to a few grave sites in Italy or the Netherlands if you want, and you can go visit my relatives. I'm sure they didn't think their efforts were aimed at only a free Poland.
A few of the battles Polish forces took part in:

British campaign in Norway (Battle of Narvik)
French Campaign
Battle of Britain
Battle of the Atlantic
Battle of Tobruk
Operation Jubilee (Battle of Dieppe)
Battle of Lenino
Battle of Normandy (D-Day)
Battle of Monte Cassino
Battle of Falaise
Operation Market Garden (Battle of Arnhem: "A Bridge Too Far")
Battle of Ancona
Battle of Bologna
Battle of Berlin
Prague Offensive
Polish underground actions:
Operation Tempest (Burza)
Operation Ostra Brama
Lwów Uprising
Warsaw Uprising



After Hindenburg appointed Bruning as chancellor, he called an election to consolidate his government, and Nazi vote was still only 18.3% at the time.

The earlier the allies would have fully supported the Weimar, perhaps not even militarily, the better it would have been for everyone. The problem is that no one really saw Hitler as a threat until it was too late. Anyway, an assassination could have easily been organized secretly between the radical communists. Communists then could have been put to the stake for their involvement in such an assassination by the Weimar Republic.

As well as Germany.






URL

That is a far cry from invading and taking over the politics forcefully!



The problem here is that you point at Hitler and say "he is to blame"!
You seem to think that with taking him out of the equation everything will be okay, but here you are so wrong!
Hitler, the politician with his hate was born in WWI and the aftermath. Hitler rose to success and acceptance on REAL problems and REAL grievances....they would still exist....Hitler was a symptom of Germany after WWI not the cause!